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nhbeast

Babchuk signs with KHL

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it could be possible that JR did all he could. This is a guy that burned bridges in Chicago, ran back to Russia once before,and it could be possible that the other GM's didn't want to give anything in return for somebody with such a flaky past.

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Except JR stated he had at least one offer on the board, and that he was waiting to see if another, more lucrative would appear. And from my understanding, the Rangers and Columbus were both interested in his services.

So he willingly ignored an offer for Babchuk, and now we're getting nothing for him. Even if you dislike Babs or his play here, letting any player walk for nothing is unacceptable.

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Except JR stated he had at least one offer on the board, and that he was waiting to see if another, more lucrative would appear. And from my understanding, the Rangers and Columbus were both interested in his services.

So he willingly ignored an offer for Babchuk, and now we're getting nothing for him. Even if you dislike Babs or his play here, letting any player walk for nothing is unacceptable.

Let it go.  It's over.  I don't agree with how it appears to have been handled but of course none of us know what really happened. I guess we still own his rights and if he wants to come back, his agent will have to arrange a trade somehow.  Don't write off another team's desire to have him after this fiasco.  Players get chance after chance as long as they have talent.  Babs had to do something since J.R. wasn't making anything happen and the season was starting so he signed a KHL deal.

  

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We own his rights until he becomes a UFA, which I believe will be the offseason after the next one. The problem is having a player that twice went to Russia in under 5 years (even with the circumstances of this past one). His value plummets now, to the point where it's not even worth considering offers for him.

I don't understand how JR starts the offseason stating Babs will play the Top 4 this upcoming season to this.

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[quote name='super-dave-1 wrote:


IceFrog999']Except JR stated he had at least one offer on the board, and that he was waiting to see if another, more lucrative would appear. And from my understanding, the Rangers and Columbus were both interested in his services.

So he willingly ignored an offer for Babchuk, and now we're getting nothing for him. Even if you dislike Babs or his play here, letting any player walk for nothing is unacceptable.

Let it go.  It's over.  I don't agree with how it appears to have been handled but of course none of us know what really happened. I guess we still own his rights and if he wants to come back, his agent will have to arrange a trade somehow.  Don't write off another team's desire to have him after this fiasco.  Players get chance after chance as long as they have talent.  Babs had to do something since J.R. wasn't making anything happen and the season was starting so he signed a KHL deal.

  It does appear to be over. Thank the hockey gods because this has been a distraction for to long.  I would have liked to see us get a prospect in return for Babs but I do think we still own his rights. If he really does want to play in the NHL he still will need to work something out with JR or wait until he is a UFA. He still young enough and time is still on his side.  As for Babs  he is a hockey player and hockey season is about to start. I can't blame him for returning to Russia to play. 

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It is over, but it still leaves me scratching my head trying to figure out what JR was thinking.  There is no doubt that the fault for this lies on both sides, but I wish Anton the best in Russia.

Does this mean the "Play GM for 2009" thread can officially be retired now?  laugh.gif

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It's time to give this a rest, at least til next summer. Nobody knows the real story, and in this market with the media's minimal coverage and need to kiss butt, it'll likely be years if ever when the whole thing comes out. This deal JR supposedly had could have been a 5th round pick - not exactly worth it. Teams were interested, but obviously not enough. According to Chip, JR has had another on/off offer this past week. They aren't banging the doors down for this guy, OK? He probably realized he could get a lot more back home, and not getting what he wanted here, and his agent/JR not finding enough, he went home. And you can't say JR holds a grudge when he laid out $1 million just to get him back this past year - not too many people pay someone they have a grudge against that much.

All Anton had to do was suck it up, take the QO, probably even then get traded, and then go for the $ next year. He took a different path, as has been the case in the past. Too bad so sad.

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It is over, but it still leaves me scratching my head trying to figure out what JR was thinking.  There is no doubt that the fault for this lies on both sides, but I wish Anton the best in Russia.

Does this mean the "Play GM for 2009" thread can officially be retired now?  laugh.gif

No. That board will never retire. We will find something else pretty soon to start it up again.

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No. That board will never retire. We will find something else pretty soon to start it up again.

You are right.  We've lost one in a row, Mo must go.  Ward was average at best.  Brindy and Wallin couldn't even get on the ice.  Where are Kabs and Babs when you need them.  

That thread still has a lot of potential.

  

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I agree it will be a while before we have any idea what happened here, but barring some last minute trade it just seems that JR booted this one.

Look JR is a master. We could not have a better GM, but he mishandled this Babchuk thing. He could just as easily have signed him with a raise, then traded him later. Put him out there for a couple of months then moved him. The other GM's would have had little idea that (if) Babchuk was a problem child, and would have gladly picked up all that offense and given us some kind of value in return. Plus, at least as a regular season player Bachuk was coming on and looked very good at times. Was he that bad in the clubhouse? Even if he was, he could have been moved for value if JR had played this right.

Instead JR refuses to give him any kind of raise, then devalues him further by making it clear that he is damaged goods. Then gets nothing for him.

Edit: A late thought. Babchuk was very much a part of this team when they turned things around and was there for most of the playoff push. If he was such a problem with such a negative effect on the team, then why did we do so well with him there?

Even JR makes mistakes. At this point this is looking like one to me.

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I wish Babs well. I did enjoy watching him play. This whole thing seemed like a strange deal and like it

has been said by others, we don't know all the facts. I think with a little maturity and a patient coach he

will be top 4 defenseman one day.

But---at least we won't have him playing against us this year !!

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eek.gifSigh after a very lengthy repsonse to Ice Frog and Remkin I have lost the post... I would blame the new site but me thinks operator error is to blame....

Cliff notes version

1)JR usually fairly values players as is evidenced by never having been taken to arbitraion by a RFA player.

2)If AB had done his time in the barrel ( and had  decent agent) he would be eligible to challege the offer he was tendered this year. Tough doodoo

3)GMs know and deal with each other every day... You don't lie about a player or his "lockeroom demeanor" unless you dont want to ever deal with another GM again. There are only 30 of them and honor among thieves is a cornerstone.

4) If you allow one player to call your bluff you will be doing it  the rest of your career. Anton has blinked now twice.

5) You dont sign an on and off again player to more than he is worth to your team in the hopes you can trade him... Its not good business especially in this uncertain economy and salary adjustments.

No mistake by JR in my opinion just a great call of not allowing the prisoners to run the prison. There is one boss (who is thought highly of by the number of players that want to come/ come back here) and he is in charge. If you don't like it please go back to the KHL.

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The reason JR is rarely taken to arbitration by an RFA (and it is rarely, not never) is because JR has no problem dragging your name through the dirt publicly to meet his needs.  And if that happens, it doesn't matter what the arbitrator decides on, you've got that mark on your career forever.

JR's a great GM when it comes to trades.  He typically can see what the team needs and how he can meet that need without breaking the bank.  Handling contracts, especially contract disputes, is an entirely different thing together.  The prison comparison doesn't work out, since it's not a prison, it's a business.  And in a business, there's give and take, something JR doesn't seem to get.

As has been stated earlier, there's no reason you should ever let a player go without getting something for him.  It's fine if there were no interested parties, but JR specifically said that one team had an offer ready and another one that was "showing a lot of interest".  If JR really wanted to get rid of Babchuk, why wait to pull the trigger?

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It seems most are willing to throw JR under the bus for not signing AB to a contract. IMO, AB had plenty of opportunity to sign whatever contract JR had on the table, whatever the amount or AB's agent had every opportunity to submit another offer. AB has already pull this nonsense once before, running home to Russia because he "didn't get what he wanted" or whatever the deal was with until he got his way, which was a trade to Carolina.

IMO, AB is acting like a spoiled child, who isn't get what he wants so he is taking his hockey stick and going home. If the two teams who thought of trading for AB, really wanted him, they would have made the deal, obviously they did their homework on him. His reputation for bolting when he doesn't get what he wants seems to proceeds him.

There is two sides to every story, let's not lay all of this at JR's feet, AB and his agent need to take some of this blame on themselves. Let's think about this, how many times was AB a healthy scratch? Quite a few times, especially in the playoffs and if he was going to get a big contract over a few yrs ala Marian Hossa, he should think again. He has had 1 good season, not multiple seasons put together, he has been up and down between Carolina and Albany, so as far as I am concern, AB needs to step back and realize he is not all that. One good season doesn't make him an All Star.

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My opinion - JR wasn't offered enough. He was probably offered some prospect who will never get out of the AHL, which is useless to us. Why give up something for nothing? Again this is speculation on my part. JR isnt an idiot. He isnt going to let this personal problem prevent him from getting a deal done. Besides, we still have his rights for the next two years I believe.

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In today's paper it appears that the Babs saga may not entirely be over. JR stated something to the fact of looking into signing him next off season.

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eek.gifSigh after a very lengthy repsonse to Ice Frog and Remkin I have lost the post... I would blame the new site but me thinks operator error is to blame....

Cliff notes version

1)JR usually fairly values players as is evidenced by never having been taken to arbitraion by a RFA player.

2)If AB had done his time in the barrel ( and had  decent agent) he would be eligible to challege the offer he was tendered this year. Tough doodoo

3)GMs know and deal with each other every day... You don't lie about a player or his "lockeroom demeanor" unless you dont want to ever deal with another GM again. There are only 30 of them and honor among thieves is a cornerstone.

4) If you allow one player to call your bluff you will be doing it  the rest of your career. Anton has blinked now twice.

5) You dont sign an on and off again player to more than he is worth to your team in the hopes you can trade him... Its not good business especially in this uncertain economy and salary adjustments.

No mistake by JR in my opinion just a great call of not allowing the prisoners to run the prison. There is one boss (who is thought highly of by the number of players that want to come/ come back here) and he is in charge. If you don't like it please go back to the KHL.

An unemotional voice of reason. 

Welcome back bag12day smile.gif

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I'm not going to quote anyone but the dumbest thing i've ever read is on this page lol.

I actually think their are tear stains on the paper of this topic. 

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I'm not going to quote anyone but the dumbest thing i've ever read is on this page lol.

I actually think their are tear stains on the paper of this topic. 

Now I find this funny.  Honestly, come out and say who it is that said the dumbest thing on this page.  We all have an opinion on this matter.  Some of us are going to take AB's side and others are going to take JR's side.  Until the real story comes out, opinions and speculations are going to be forming on this board as to why AB decided to head back to Russia and play in the KHL. 

I said it before in an earlier post, AB has a history of bolting to Russia so his reputation for sticking around when things aren't going his way doesn't look good on his behalf.  JR is the GM of this franchise, he only has so much money to work with and he is not going offer AB a large amount of money for 1 outstanding season.  I am sorry but I would love to make the money that some of these guys make but I don't so if AB wants to "skate" back to Russia and play there, let him.  I am tired of a player, whatever sport it is, crying about the amount of money they think they deserve and not getting it.  When AB puts several seasons together like last year and makes the All Star team for two or three seasons in a row then JR can give him that multi yr deal but until then, JR gives him what he deserves and nothing more.

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yay the giant from red square is gone. no matter what anyone says, Anton Babchuck never truly was a team player, and I have no sympathy for attitudes like that. yes, his goal scoring was good, but past that, it was a mixed bag.

maybe next season we can try again.

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Don't get me wrong. I have no doubt that there is more to this story than meets the eye. I also have little doubt that Anton and his agent mishandled this from their end. I am not sympathetic to Anton at all. I understand that there is the larger picture of JR's image in terms of future trades. These are all valid points, and in the end those making them may be right.

It probably comes down to two things.

1. What was the actual number that Babchuk was going for? If it was huge, then JR had no choice. Still could have done less to devalue Babchuk, but needed to just play hardball.

2. How bad was the "attitude"? If it was Avery-like then fine, good riddance. The success of the team with him in the lineup suggests that the effect was not that bad. But none of us really knows.

It is interesting though that some think it is well known to all of the GM's that Babchuk is a problem child. This is a conspiracy that there is little evidence of. What they do know is that Babchuk is loaded with potential on the ice. 15 goals and he has not played that many total NHL games. There is no doubt that Babchuk will improve with more games in the NHL. No one would even part with a prospect or a draft pick? I think some are underplaying how good Babchuk was for stretches. I havn't done the research, but would we have made the playoffs without those goals, most of which came during our run?

My general sense is that JR let his emotions get the better of him, which he rarely does. It is interesting because it is so atypical. I concede that Babchuk is the child. But JR as the adult could have acted like the adult and calmly moved the problem out and gotten something for him.

Maybe the whole thing was just not salvageable. Maybe this is still part of a larger play where JR makes a last minute deal while Babchuk faces NHL banishment. If so, I will come on here and declare JR once again to be the master, which in most cases he is. But at this point it is not looking like he mastered this one. Time will tell. But one thing is for sure. This is a really odd situation.

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Very interesting quotes from JR regarding the end of the Babchuk saga:


"Nothing about this angers me," Rutherford said. "It's disappointing that he doesn't understand how the system works. And he's not going to be able to figure out a way to beat the system."

"I don't think anything different of him," Rutherford said. "I think he's a solid NHL player that given the opportunity should score 15 goals every year. He may very well, the next time he plays [in the NHL], do it here."

Full N&O article here

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