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Canes 2010 general off season talk

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Something to cure the summertime no hockey blues. smile.gif Enjoy!

The more video I see of this kid playing the more I love that we picked Skinner. He scores goals every possible way that you can imagine! pimp.gif

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Some of those moves looked alot like a guy we used to have who now plays in Phoenix.  Others just looked like Skinner.  Wow.  He seems really strong on his skates and appears to have a real solid lower body.  Thanks for posting up.  groupwave.gif

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Thanks for the video.  Was that Peters that he schooled mroe than once?  Could this be that player that we oh so need to stay near the net and get those garbage goals?  If he is training with Gary Roberts then he might just be that guy......

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Chip has a great article about Skinner in today's N&O. Also comments from Gary Roberts and you might be pleasantly surprised to hear that Roberts has compared him to Sidney Crosby.

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Some of those moves looked alot like a guy we used to have who now plays in Phoenix.  Others just looked like Skinner.  Wow.  He seems really strong on his skates and appears to have a real solid lower body.  Thanks for posting up.  groupwave.gif
You're welcome! Anything to help during these boring summer days! He is going to be fun to watch on breakaways / shootouts!

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Yeah, I miss the "talk".  We just ran outta stuff.  I wanted to start a "rate the top prospects" thread but I couldn't figure out the poll tool and it just didn't seem woth the time since we are going back to the new-old software.  Woulda been something to talk about though.  If I was pinned to the wall I would say my top prospect would have to be McBain.  But that kid Skinner just keeps putting a smile on my face.  

Also wanted to ask everyone what they would prefer as far as a game day thread for the new season.  I like it alot better when the GDT and the PGA are combined into just a Game Day Thread.  But, the poll tool again.

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I like it alot better when the GDT and the PGA are combined into just a Game Day Thread.
I agree, make it two votes so far.

I also agree about McBain and Skinner, I expect Jeff will blow-up on a top two line, but until it happens it's just speculation IMO.  I have high hopes for him so far, I love what I see.  McBain has already made a mark for himself last season.  I hope he can stay consistant, if he can, we have a real winner.  I'm not sure who to pair him with, though... if we put him with Pitkanen then he'll play 25-30 mins a game and will be the more "responsible" one and have to stay back while Joni attacks like he does.  But, if we put him with Gleason he has the option of being more flexible.  Which is the better option for his confidence and growth?  I'd give him more freedom and allow him to explore the space... really, explore the space.  Unless that created a problem back there, in which case I'm sure Gleason would say something considering he's, well, Gleason - he has no problem saying what's on his mind.

Our youth movement has really interesting potential... I'm very excited about the future of the team.

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I know it's too early to speculate but what do you guys think the chances are that Jeff Skinner will make the team this year and be an impact in the NHL?  Again I know we won't fully know until training camp but is anyone willing to take a bet here?  

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[quote name='jb_online wrote:


coastal_caniac']I like it alot better when the GDT and the PGA are combined into just a Game Day Thread.

I agree, make it two votes so far.

I also agree about McBain and Skinner, I expect Jeff will blow-up on a top two line, but until it happens it's just speculation IMO.  I have high hopes for him so far, I love what I see.  McBain has already made a mark for himself last season.  I hope he can stay consistant, if he can, we have a real winner.  I'm not sure who to pair him with, though... if we put him with Pitkanen then he'll play 25-30 mins a game and will be the more "responsible" one and have to stay back while Joni attacks like he does.  But, if we put him with Gleason he has the option of being more flexible.  Which is the better option for his confidence and growth?  I'd give him more freedom and allow him to explore the space... really, explore the space.  Unless that created a problem back there, in which case I'm sure Gleason would say something considering he's, well, Gleason - he has no problem saying what's on his mind.

Our youth movement has really interesting potential... I'm very excited about the future of the team.The prospects with the biggest upside have to be McBain and Skinner. 

While I have been chided for projecting stats out over a full season, McBain's numbers from last year project him to the very top of the league. On the one hand, the number of games clearly was too small to make that kind of projection, on the other hand that was the kid's first exposure to the NHL. For years I have been reading on these very boards about how much longer it takes a defenseman to find his NHL level game. That would imply that McBain has even more in him than we've seen. This guy is going to be special.

Skinner? Well 70 goals in one season. If that were so easy then Taylor or Tyler would have done it. My main question right now is this: how many brand new teenage picks come into the NHL in their first year and put up at least 15 goals? I know the super-elites have done it, but how many others? 

While those two have monster upside, I am really intrigued by Riley Nash. I am thinking he has the inside track to third line center. Just stuff Ronnie Francis has said about him (and the Canes depth chart shows him there). It may be a combination of my withdrawal from losing Cullen for good, or projecting our desperate need at this position, or the Canes talking him up to get him to sign, but reportedly he sees the ice very well, and comments on the prospect camp focused on Skinner and Nash being the standouts. What a steal he could turn out to be.

Finally, up front, I really do think that Boychuk has the skills. He has a nose for the puck in the right spots to score, and just needs to put his game together. He's seen a fair amount of NHL ice, and I would bet on him having a strong offensive season this year, which we are going to need. I think the same thing about Tlusty. He needs to show something this year. I think he will. 

But our depth is suddenly deep. Dalphe and Bowman both have shown serious scoring potential as well. Either of them could make the team or make a big contribution on call up duty.

Then I would point out that Samson has put a lot of AHL goals up and I bet his tenaciousness along the boards gets him a 4th line job. He's a guy who could follow the LaRose career path: prove his mettle on the 4th line, get a chance to move up and then breakout.

Then there's Osala, Mastumoto, Shugg, and others including all our defensive prospects.

The future looks pretty good. Just need a few things to fall in place to make this year good.

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[quote name='jb_online wrote:


coastal_caniac']I like it alot better when the GDT and the PGA are combined into just a Game Day Thread.

 McBain .....I'm not sure who to pair him with, though... 

I wonder about this also. While the talk (by JR) is to try to take pressure off him (partly by acquiring Corvo), clearly the expectations are high, and frankly I think he needs to be in the top 4, probably on the second pairing. Based on that, he would have to be paired with Pitkanen, Gleason or Corvo.

I agree that we should not put him with the Wondering Finn. We need to let him create some, not to be constantly dropping back for dear life as Joni drives deep. Gleason would probably be ideal. But then who goes with Joni? Maybe Joni and Corvo, Gleason and McBain? Or Corvo-McBain? Help me out here, I'm not good at d pairings.

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How can you possibly break up Gleason and Corvo?  No way that will happen. Our top pairing.  Their like peas and carrots.  Plus you have to consider which side a player shoots from.  Right defense - left shot; Left defense - right shot, etc.  Particularly important on the PP.  McBain goes with Pitkanen, IMO.  Babs stays with Carson.  

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Finally, up front, I really do think that Boychuk has the skills. He has a nose for the puck in the right spots to score, and just needs to put his game together. He's seen a fair amount of NHL ice, and I would bet on him having a strong offensive season this year, which we are going to need. I think the same thing about Tlusty. He needs to show something this year. I think he will. 

I don't share your enthusiasm for Boychuk.  I think he might just be a bust, never reaching his potential.  But, just my opinion of course.  Hope I'm wrong.

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[quote name='remkin wrote:


jb_online wrote:

coastal_caniac']I like it alot better when the GDT and the PGA are combined into just a Game Day Thread.

Finally, up front, I really do think that Boychuk has the skills. He has a nose for the puck in the right spots to score, and just needs to put his game together. He's seen a fair amount of NHL ice, and I would bet on him having a strong offensive season this year, which we are going to need. I think the same thing about Tlusty. He needs to show something this year. I think he will.  
This will likely be an unpopular statement but I think Boychuk may be a bust, never reaching his potential.  Hope he proves me wrong.

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[quote name='coastal_caniac wrote:


remkin wrote:

jb_online']

Finally, up front, I really do think that Boychuk has the skills. He has a nose for the puck in the right spots to score, and just needs to put his game together. He's seen a fair amount of NHL ice, and I would bet on him having a strong offensive season this year, which we are going to need. I think the same thing about Tlusty. He needs to show something this year. I think he will.  
This will likely be an unpopular statement but I think Boychuk may be a bust, never reaching his potential.  Hope he proves me wrong.

Coastal - I agree with you. I think Boychuk is a bust. Last season he was averaging a point every 3 games. But then again, Sutter was averaging way less than that before last year.  It will be interesting to see what he can do this year but personally I don't think he is going to pan out.  

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I had this great idea once. It was a "Jump to Conclusions" mat. You see, it would be this mat that you would put on the floor... and would have different CONCLUSIONS written on it that you could JUMP TO.

Boychuk is 20 years old, at least give him a chance to party with the boys after a win before you call him a bust. I think that with this years draft he has been kinda left to the side on our prospect boards, but hopefully he will have a big year year playing more consistent minutes.

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I had this great idea once. It was a "Jump to Conclusions" mat. You see, it would be this mat that you would put on the floor... and would have different CONCLUSIONS written on it that you could JUMP TO.

Boychuk is 20 years old, at least give him a chance to party with the boys after a win before you call him a bust. I think that with this years draft he has been kinda left to the side on our prospect boards, but hopefully he will have a big year year playing more consistent minutes.

3 words...conditioning, conditioning, conditioning...did he spend the offseason getting stronger and ready to play at the next level.  Boychuck has all the hockey skills, did he put in the work?  Sutter definately did last year, coming back, bigger, stronger and WAY faster which paved the way for a breakout season.  We know from Chip's article that Skinner is doing exactly that and will be ready to push for a spot.  This goes for all our young guys, Nash, Skinner, Dalpe, Boychuck, Osala, Bowman, Samson, etc...the brass ring (or red Swingline stapler) is there for the taking, who's put in the work to go an grab it? 

  

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[quote name='remkin wrote:


jb_online wrote:

coastal_caniac']I like it alot better when the GDT and the PGA are combined into just a Game Day Thread.

 
McBain .....I'm not sure who to pair him with, though... 

I wonder about this also. While the talk (by JR) is to try to take pressure off him (partly by acquiring Corvo), clearly the expectations are high, and frankly I think he needs to be in the top 4, probably on the second pairing. Based on that, he would have to be paired with Pitkanen, Gleason or Corvo.

I agree that we should not put him with the Wondering Finn. We need to let him create some, not to be constantly dropping back for dear life as Joni drives deep. Gleason would probably be ideal. But then who goes with Joni? Maybe Joni and Corvo, Gleason and McBain? Or Corvo-McBain? Help me out here, I'm not good at d pairings.

Actually, McBain/Pitkanen was the pair and they did really good. I remember commenting to seatmates that AWard, a 15 some year vet couldn't get it together with Pitkanen, but a rookie can. 

Before Corvo was traded, he and Gleason made a great pair. Those two ended up being a really good shut-down pair for us. Going out there against the likes of Crosby, Ovechkin, etc. I wouldn't break them up as they seem to have some good chemistry.

Babchuk/Pitkanen actually scares the poo out of me. I'm actually more confident with McBain/Pitkanen.

So far the Canes depth chart has: Gleason/Corvo, Pitkanen/McBain, Babchuk/Harrison. I think this is how we start in Finland except Carson taking Harrison spots.

 

 

 

  

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I wouldn't be at all surprised to see Skinner and Nash leapfrog Boychuk into the NHL. I'd be shocked if Boychuk didn't spend most of this season in Charlotte. I know he's young, etc, etc....but I've already been heckled for thinking the kid is way overrated.

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You can't call a 20 year old a bust! Boychuk learned a lot this year. I meet him at the Canes' Casino night. He told me that he had learned so many things this year, and was going to train hard in the off season to earn a spot on the Canes next year. He said that he hope to follow in Sutter's foot step, & make a big jump from his 1st to his 2nd pro year. Also, remember that he was a center in Jrs, & is learning to play wing in the NHL.

Now if in 5 years, he has not made a significant impact on the Canes roster then you could label him a bust. I think Boychuk will be fine, and a solid NHL player. I don't think he will be as great as he was promoted in his draft prospect file, but in no way do I think the kid will be a complete bust either.

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Well at least we have a discussion going!

On the d pairings. I defer to everyone else. I wasn't watching that closely at the end, so if Pitkanen and McBain worked, then I stand corrected. No question McBain did well so whoever he was paired with, I'll have what their having.

On Boychuk. Very tasty debate. I still think he will prove Coastal, Swanson, and Big Kahuna wrong. He and Tlusty will both be this year's Sutter, with NHL time and lots of offseason to prepare will push 20 goals. If not, we will need someone with little to no NHL ice time to step up immediately. If Boychuk does fizzle, I would look to Bowman to get the first shot.

On Nash, I have him making the team out of camp as the #3 center.

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I keep overlooking Nash... he does seem to have caught a lot of attention from the fans and coaching staff so far.  I think it speaks volumes about the organization/franchise to consider that he wouldn't have left school to play for Edmonton but he DID to play for Carolina.  To me that is a wonderful statement.

"Yeaaahhh, I'm gonna have to sort of disagree with you there..."  I know that Gleason and Corvo work well together, but eventually we have to see how Gleason and McBain fit (I mean, Corvo IS the oldest guy on the team... no telling how much longer he'll last laugh.gif).  It could be just as good or even better... and it doesn't have to be permanent.  I'm sure Paul will play with the lines plenty before the season starts, but I'd be very interested to see the two on the same line.

And I think it's too early for me to tell if Boychuk is going to work or not.  I don't think he'll be the next Whitney, but I have faith he'll do what he can to try to get there.  He's such good friends with Sutter, maybe the work ethic will rub-off and you guys will be pleasantly surprised.

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How can you possibly break up Gleason and Corvo?  No way that will happen. Our top pairing.  Their like peas and carrots.  Plus you have to consider which side a player shoots from.  Right defense - left shot; Left defense - right shot, etc.  Particularly important on the PP.  McBain goes with Pitkanen, IMO.  Babs stays with Carson.  
While I think that will eventually be the pairing, it will be interesting to see if it's the pairing to start the season. I think we'll start with Pits/Babs, Gleason/Corvo and Carson/McBain. But I think McBain will put pressure on Corvo/Babs for one of those spots by mid-season. I really think the coaching staff wants to bring McBain along in a reasonable fashion; I'm not sure that throwing him out there with Joni for 25-30 minutes a game will be considered reasonable.

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[quote name='coastal_caniac wrote:


remkin wrote:

jb_online']

Finally, up front, I really do think that Boychuk has the skills. He has a nose for the puck in the right spots to score, and just needs to put his game together. He's seen a fair amount of NHL ice, and I would bet on him having a strong offensive season this year, which we are going to need. I think the same thing about Tlusty. He needs to show something this year. I think he will.  
This will likely be an unpopular statement but I think Boychuk may be a bust, never reaching his potential.  Hope he proves me wrong.

I'm not ready to call it either way. But if he makes the roster this year and gets a top 9 job, then he needs to score 15+ goals. Otherwise I think we'll be seeing more of Osala, Samson, etc. I think it's great that we have depth on the wings in Charlotte. If Tlusty or Boychuk struggle, then we'll be seeing more of someone else.

And I agree that Boychuk needs to prove this season that he can score... or else.

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I had this great idea once. It was a "Jump to Conclusions" mat. You see, it would be this mat that you would put on the floor... and would have different CONCLUSIONS written on it that you could JUMP TO.

Boychuk is 20 years old, at least give him a chance to party with the boys after a win before you call him a bust. I think that with this years draft he has been kinda left to the side on our prospect boards, but hopefully he will have a big year year playing more consistent minutes.

There's also this thing called EYEGLASSES.  You might need some.  I said it's possible he MAY be a bust.  I certainly didn't say he WAS a bust.  Clarifying that point was also the statement that my definition of "bust" is not reaching his potential.  That's not jumping to a conclusion.  Looks like you have all ready tried out your own "Jump to Conclusions" mat.

Like I also said, its probably not a popular statement, but I stand by it.    

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Fore the sake of some, I'll put this Boychuk debate in perspective from my eyes.  From my seat last year, the kid looked like a deer in the headlights with the big club. Let's not forget he played around 30 games.  He really didn't do anything well.  He was always out of position, had no hint of a two-way game, couldn't cycle the puck, didn't win scrums along the boards, and basically got pushed around.  If you take that at face value then yeah, he's 20-years old and a prospect.  But, he didn't fare that well in Albany last year either.  I think he had around 36 points in 52 games.

But, when he was drafted HE WAS THE FUTURE.  Those are high expectations.  Maybe some of you weren't around then, but there was alot of talk. 

Fast forward to today.  Are those same expectations there?  In my opinion, and based soley on what I witnessed, he's not even in my top-5 of the prospects in our system.  So, I think this is HIS year to prove something.  At least to me.  So, its up to him.  I agree he has the skills.  But, I think its possible that he just might not live up to the hype he got in his draft year, and never live up to his potential.  For early first rounders (Boychuk went 14th), that's often called a bust.

I certainly hope I'm wrong and I'll be pulling for him with a litte extra effort.

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