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Canes 2010 general off season talk

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I will say this: JR indicated that the rebuilding of this team wasn't going to happen overnight, that it was going to take time. I don't know if JR will pull the plug on Rod. I actually think that if Rod says he's coming back, then JR is going to swallow that. We don't have a lot of centers.

And let's face it, if we really can't move Cole/Sammy and if Rod comes back, then we pretty much know our lines. We've added Tlusty... we might sign Ray for 1 more year.

This certainly looks a lot like the team that stunk it up last year.

I wish Rod the best, but I agree with others that it should be off the ice. But if he's set on playing, I'm not sure JR will do what has to be done.

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I really think a Samsonov buyout is completely out of the question. I never really understood the Sammy bashing. I mean, by no means do I disagree with Samsonov not fitting in with this team anymore; yes, I do believe he should be moved. But come on, this is a guy who scored 14 goals this year while playing on the 4th line with under-achieving players most of the year. Thats really impressive to me.

I believe Samsonov compiled with draft picks and maybe another player could move us up in the draft. I think Columbus picks either 4th or 5th. Samsonov's 14 goals this year is more than a couple of players scored on Columbus' first two lines. It's just a thought.

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The Brind'Amour rebuttle from JR courtesy of Luke at the N&O:

On Brind'Amour, Karmanos indicated a decision on whether to buy out the final year of the former captain's contract might not be made for some time. In today's N&O,
Brind'Amour indicated he isn't ready to retire yet
, which may force the team's hand.

"It’s a hard situation anytime you have a player coming to the end of his career that has given as much as he has and works as hard as he has," Karmanos said. "There’s no easy solution to that. I just want to win hockey games, whatever works out best. As far as an obligation to a player, every time the contract ends you settle that. Rod has another year left on his contract at $3 million I believe. If it makes sense to us to have him play, fine. If we have to buy him out, we’ll do that. We’ll see what happens with training camp and all that stuff. ...

"You want to do the right thing for the player. If you think he can pick up somewhere else, you don’t want to leave him in a position where there are no jobs open somewhere else. You should make your decision at a time when it’s good for the team and good for the player."

Wonder what "all that stuff..." is?

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I don't think Karmonos knows the CBA too well.  Of course, I don't either but I still think the buyout period is limited to a couple of weeks in June, or as JLP pointed out, could be extended into July depending on arbitration cases.  But the window certainly doesn't extend out to training camp.  I'm glad he's not the GM.......

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It appears Brindy holds most the cards. If he gets bought out we pay him 2 mil and he gets to sign with another team as a fourth line center for

4th line wages, maybe 600 thousand. We save a million but take a two year cap hit.

If we keep him we get to pay him 3 mil for fourth line minutes, some special team work and probable some games he sits out. We get rid of the cap hit in 2011/12 but we don't get to use that extra mil this upcoming season for the rebuild.

Of course there is always the chance two years out from the injury and still in pretty good shape he has one more really good year left.

Brindy to JR...your move.

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I don't think Karmonos knows the CBA too well.  Of course, I don't either but I still think the buyout period is limited to a couple of weeks in June, or as JLP pointed out, could be extended into July depending on arbitration cases.  But the window certainly doesn't extend out to training camp.  I'm glad he's not the GM.......

You're correct.  The window for a team to tender a buyout expires June 30th.  The arbitration exception only applies if you have a pending arbitration case.  In that instance there is a window that opens for a three-day period after the arbitration case is settled.  That's exactly what happened last year with Kaberle (he was bought out during the window that was opened by Tuomo's arbitration settlement).  

As far as I know, we have no RFAs on the roster that are arbitration-eligible.  So unless we acquire one between now and June 30th, June 30th is the buyout deadline.

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Thanks Dreamie for expanding on the buyout window.  Well, that means the last couple of weeks of June should be quite telling with the Brindy situation, a possible Whitney signing and the draft.  Can't wait.

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The Brind'Amour rebuttle from JR courtesy of Luke at the N&O:

"
It’s a hard situation
anytime you have a player coming to the end of his career that has given as much as he has and works as hard as he has," Karmanos said. "
There’s no easy solution
to that.
I just want to win hockey games
, whatever works out best. As far as an obligation to a player, every time the contract ends you settle that. Rod has another year left on his contract at $3 million I believe.
If it makes sense to us
to have him play, fine.
If we have to buy him out, we’ll do that.
We’ll see what happens with training camp and all that stuff. ...

"You want to do the right thing for the player. If you think he can pick up somewhere else, you don’t want to leave him in a position where there are no jobs open
somewhere else
. You should make your decision at a time when it’s good for the team and good for the player."

I see the black as obligatory deference to a player of Rod's accomplishment and contribution to the team. The blue suggests that bringing him back is by no means certain, even suggesting trying to see if they can move him, and the red actually says that they are considering buying him out.

Net effect is to set the stage for letting him go.

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Pretty sure Picard is eligible, he just finished his 5th pro year. And Carson just finished his fourth, so he should be eligible too. Though I am far from an expert on these things, just going by the arbitration section in the CBA. And nothing guarantees they would go to arbitration of course, though that would probably just take a little whisper in the agent's ear. smile.gif

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Lot's of interesting stuff when the boss and the scouts come to town. Nice to finally have something to talk about.

The latest from DeCock: For-sale sign has payroll implications, in part:

Even if the team is here for good, though, it’s fair to ask how good the team will be. The pressure to make the money-losing team as attractive a proposition as possible may consign it to payroll purgatory at the bottom of the NHL’s salary-cap range.

The sales prospectus prepared by Allen & Co., investment bank Karmanos hired, touts a reduction in expenses in excess of $10 million and possibly as much as $15 million as a step toward consistent profitability. In a meeting with News & Observer editors and reporters, Karmanos confirmed that kind of savings could only come through cutting player salaries by a quarter.

“We run a very efficient franchise,” Karmanos said. “Your real choice is the $56 million on the top (of the cap range) or $41 million on the bottom for salaries. That’s where you can do most of your work.”

Sounds like they are really planning to cut costs to attract an investor. They had been saying it for a while though...wonder which situation triggered which.

I don't think this impacts the Brindy situation, you only save at most 500k there since you have to have someone to replace him. And if all else is equal, they may just decide to keep him if they think he won't be a distraction or real detriment. Hmmm.

Biggest impact I see is the potential re-signing of Whitney and/or Cullen. Sounds like they will need to take a good-sized hometown discount. If they do keep Brindy, bye-bye Cullen. Man, I would hate seeing that scenario happen.

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I'm with JLP, buying out Brindy does nothing more than remove him from the ice.  I think you are better off all-around letting him finish his career this year and be done with it.  If cutting salaries at all costs is your priority objective, then the best short-term alternative seems to be letting Whitney walk and replacing him with Boychuk, and replacing Cullen with Dalpe.  I think Sammy can be moved...he's still a good player if used effectively (which I don't think the Canes did very well last year).  Cole....well, I think we will have to bite the bullet here, at least until the trade deadline.  And then there is the draft.....

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After reading most of the press reports available I would also agree with most of what JLP and Coastal say. I'm not sure how the Brindy situation will play out yet. I have a hunch we will buy him out.  Although Cole could move over the summer I think that we will take a gamble that he plays better and move him at trade deadline. I think Sammy is gone. As for signing Whitney,Cullen, Legace and Pothier I will be surprised if 3 out of the 4 are here next season.

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The Caps said they will not try to sign either Walker or Corvo. Any interest in bringing them back? I like both guys, but is Mc Bain a younger, cheaper Corvo, and is Walker too injury prone?

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The Caps said they will not try to sign either Walker or Corvo. Any interest in bringing them back? I like both guys, but is Mc Bain a younger, cheaper Corvo, and is Walker too injury prone?

JUST SAY NO!

We want to get younger...The only player who left that I would even consider bring back is Cullen, and that would be only if Brindy retires or is bought out.

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[quote name='rocheccw wrote:


caniac6']

The Caps said they will not try to sign either Walker or Corvo. Any interest in bringing them back? I like both guys, but is Mc Bain a younger, cheaper Corvo, and is Walker too injury prone?

JUST SAY NO!

We want to get younger...The only player who left that I would even consider bring back is Cullen, and that would be only if Brindy retires or is bought out.

That is my opinion also. We want to get younger and unfortunately that leaves Walker out. I like Corvo but I think his cost will be to high. For better or worse we are (IMO) going to see the beginnings of a new team next season. I hope the new look is also a competitive group.

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[quote name='OBXer wrote:


rocheccw wrote:

caniac6']The Caps said they will not try to sign either Walker or Corvo. Any interest in bringing them back? I like both guys, but is Mc Bain a younger, cheaper Corvo, and is Walker too injury prone?

JUST SAY NO!

We want to get younger...The only player who left that I would even consider bring back is Cullen, and that would be only if Brindy retires or is bought out.

That is my opinion also. We want to get younger and unfortunately that leaves Walker out. I like Corvo but I think his cost will be to high. For better or worse we are (IMO) going to see the beginnings of a new team next season. I hope the new look is also a competitive group.

The Canes were more competitive with a younger team at the end of the season, than they were with an older team at the beginning of the season.

Anything can happen from season to season, but I would take my chances with the youth movement.

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[quote name='rocheccw wrote:


OBXer wrote:


rocheccw']

JUST SAY NO!

We want to get younger...The only player who left that I would even consider bring back is Cullen, and that would be only if Brindy retires or is bought out.

That is my opinion also. We want to get younger and unfortunately that leaves Walker out. I like Corvo but I think his cost will be to high. For better or worse we are (IMO) going to see the beginnings of a new team next season. I hope the new look is also a competitive group.

The Canes were more competitive with a younger team at the end of the season, than they were with an older team at the beginning of the season.

Anything can happen from season to season, but I would take my chances with the youth movement.

Oh I agree. The "old" Canes at the beginning of last season never came together. They began playing better with some Rats right before trade deadline but their fate had been sealed. When the rebuild began we saw a lot of energy with our young players. I'm not against the youth movement but I still wonder how some of the young guns will play as full time NHL'ers. I hope and expect no matter how the team shapes up we are competitive.  But anytime you have unknowns you wonder.

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I expect alot of sophmore slumps :\ It's just the way development generally works.
This is my concern. If this is the path the Canes choose ( and it appears it is) I expect we will have highs and lows next season. Until we

see who is signed and who is allowed to walk or traded we won't know.

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I expect sophmore slumps but I expect wins so dont get any ideas. I dont usually watch hockey but when I do I watch los huracanes.

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Pretty great article by Bob Wage. I think its pretty exciting to think about a low budget team doing so well, which is what the Hurricanes were in the 05' 06' season. Check out the salaries our players were making then.

http://www.canescountry.c...it-can-be-done#storyjump

One of the big keys to that year though was finding underpaid under-appreciated fairly high end veteran talent cheap, not by loading the team up with prospects and fringe players. Whitney and Stillman were crucial:  At less that $2 million/ year each, but with serious proven talent, not prospects. Adding Weight and Recci late (and only paying part of their salary) added more of the same: proven veteran scoring.

I'm all for bringing a goodly clump of young guys up, but the must be folded in with some well chosen veterans if we are to be any good.

I recall many arguing against me (I wanted Taylor/Tyler) that all that winning at the end of last year would "teach our young guys how to win". It would seem contrary to this to just load the team up with an impotent blend of ineffective vets, AHL'ers and prospects and have a bad year next year. I would assume that would conversely teach our guys how to lose.

But that does NOT have to happen. JR just needs to find ONE guy like he did with Stillman and Whitney to make a huge difference. Find that Stillman-esque winger and bring back Cullen (and trade Cole/Sammy) and we will be competitive from game one. How do I get this post to JR?

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[quote name='remkin wrote:


jeromeo87']

Pretty great article by Bob Wage. I think its pretty exciting to think about a low budget team doing so well, which is what the Hurricanes were in the 05' 06' season. Check out the salaries our players were making then.

One of the big keys to that year though was finding underpaid under-appreciated fairly high end veteran talent cheap, not by loading the team up with prospects and fringe players. Whitney and Stillman were crucial:  At less that $2 million/ year each, but with serious proven talent, not prospects. Adding Weight and Recci late (and only paying part of their salary) added more of the same: proven veteran scoring.

I'm all for bringing a goodly clump of young guys up, but the must be folded in with some well chosen veterans if we are to be any good.

I recall many arguing against me (I wanted Taylor/Tyler) that all that winning at the end of last year would "teach our young guys how to win". It would seem contrary to this to just load the team up with an impotent blend of ineffective vets, AHL'ers and prospects and have a bad year next year. I would assume that would conversely teach our guys how to lose.

But that does NOT have to happen. JR just needs to find ONE guy like he did with Stillman and Whitney to make a huge difference. Find that Stillman-esque winger and bring back Cullen (and trade Cole/Sammy) and we will be competitive from game one. How do I get this post to JR?

Rem, I hope your right about Cullen and the FA winger. I just don't see it right now. Since Pk says the cuts are to position for a sale (50%) the priority is saving money. But JR has a habit of finding struggling rejects,cast offs and young pros who find their game with us. Maybe toward the end of the free agency frenzy he might get  that winger.

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