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New CBA or Lockout? "All things CBA"

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After listening to these bozos today, I'm really steaming now.

My biggest gripe with the owners is their first proposal. Look, they asked for the moon and more -- the absolute best, most restrictive agreement in all of pro sports. It is unreasonable and makes them look ridiculous. It is like going to a car dealer and asking for 30% under invoice. It is a non starter.

My biggest gripe with the players is their leader is playing a delay game, and then acting like he is innocent. What a politician. His disingenuous comments would fit right into the USA presidential politics. Maybe he should go that route.

Why the heck did they wait so long? To put pressure on the owners. Well, the owners are p.o.ed, and they've shown a willingness to lock out. It is now going to happen, pretty sure. The players dragged their feet going to the table, then took a ridiculous amount of time for this counter-proposal, which really wasn't that, and was something they probably had cooking for a while.

After looking at their proposal, it has a lot of smoke and mirrors to it. Sure, they give back to the owners gradually over the 3 years, but then it "snaps back" after 3 years to the old 57%. Back to where we were. That's a non-starter.

The whole thing among these parties is ridiculous.

Terrible, terrible.

.

Edited by wxray1

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why question to both parties would be : why did you wait this long to resolve this issue? It should have been resolved shortly after the end of the Stanley Cup Finals?

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why question to both parties would be : why did you wait this long to resolve this issue? It should have been resolved shortly after the end of the Stanley Cup Finals?

Nobody does anything until shortly before there's a deadline. Remember putting off writing that TERM paper until a few days before it was due? And study for final exams? Cram the night before. Human nature.

That said, I find it interesting that among the 23 or so NHL players on the "advisory board" of the NHLPA, I doubt if more than one or two finished high school. I know, Craig Adams went to Harvard, so I give you that one. But the rest? Not the brightest stars in the academic constellation. All they're doing is echoing what Fehr and their agents are saying, not offering much constructive advice into the negotiations.

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Nobody does anything until shortly before there's a deadline. Remember putting off writing that TERM paper until a few days before it was due? And study for final exams? Cram the night before. Human nature.

That's some of it. You could also argue that they players didn't want the distraction, and that Fehr had to go to Europe, etc.

But come on. This is also part of Fehr's strategy. I'm with the owners here. They wanted to start earlier. Fehr is playing a delay game to put pressure on. It isn't working.

That said, I find it interesting that among the 23 or so NHL players on the "advisory board" of the NHLPA, I doubt if more than one or two finished high school. I know, Craig Adams went to Harvard, so I give you that one. But the rest? Not the brightest stars in the academic constellation. All they're doing is echoing what Fehr and their agents are saying, not offering much constructive advice into the negotiations.

But that's also why they hired Fehr. Give them some credit. In any kind of legal matter, I may visit with the other party and my attorney. In the world of the Bar, I'm not "bright" either. I'm completely stupid, actually. That's why I have my Counsel.

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I can't wait to see what the NHLFA says in their counter offer. Wait, you mean there isn't a NHL fans association? :Tumbleweed:

I will say this, if there is a season lockout I am done with the NHL, and probably all sports in a professional sense, hockey is one of my last bastions of sporting entertainments. I will get my refund from my season tickets with interest and call it a day. And get off my lawn! :wheelchair:

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If the NHLPA doesn't agree with the owners with the same CBA they had from 7 years ago. Couldn't they try and play the season with out the lockout and try again next year with a new proposal for a CBA?

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I can't wait to see what the NHLFA says in their counter offer. Wait, you mean there isn't a NHL fans association? :Tumbleweed:

I will say this, if there is a season lockout I am done with the NHL, and probably all sports in a professional sense, hockey is one of my last bastions of sporting entertainments. I will get my refund from my season tickets with interest and call it a day. And get off my lawn! :wheelchair:

NHLFA? Where do I sign up?

:rofl:

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If the NHLPA doesn't agree with the owners with the same CBA they had from 7 years ago. Couldn't they try and play the season with out the lockout and try again next year with a new proposal for a CBA?

OK. So, this was Fehr's plan, apparently. Hence the delay. "Just keep working under the old terms this year while we work out our differences."

The owners say, emphatically, NO. Fehr is playing politics saying, "But the owners got what they wanted 7 years ago, this their CBA. Why not?" No. The owners are saying it is flawed and needs to change. No play under the old CBA.

Without even an agreement to informally extend the old CBA, it means no play. That's called a lockout since it is coming from the owner's side.

The players are free to find someone else to start a new league or play somewhere else.

The owners are free to hire replacement players.

The NFL tried replacement players, and it was a disaster. The players will play somewhere else, buried in Europe or somewhere we won't see them.

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If the NHLPA doesn't agree with the owners with the same CBA they had from 7 years ago. Couldn't they try and play the season with out the lockout and try again next year with a new proposal for a CBA?

You won't see the owner's play without a firm CBA because they run the risk of the players striking once they get paid the bulk of their salary. The owner's would then have no leverage in any negotiations.

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You won't see the owner's play without a firm CBA because they run the risk of the players striking once they get paid the bulk of their salary. The owner's would then have no leverage in any negotiations.

That's right!

And even worse, once the seasons start, the players really just need to make noise about the evil owners. That would get the fans 100% on their side and really put the squeeze to the negotiations.

As bad as a lockout is after summer break, any work stoppage (from either side) would be really bad mid-season. Fans would go nuts.

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Lets hope the worker bees get something done between now and next Wednesday. Certainly between the two proposals there has to be some common ground to build on. A lockout or strike no matter when it comes could have ramifications we don't want to think about.

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The squabble between the two sides seems to be as bad as the warring parties in Congress. I am fed up with politics and I am fed up with millionaires battling millionaires in, what is in essence, a child’s game.

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The day the players (as was their right) hired Donald Fehr the dye was cast. This is his last rodeo and his legacy is 'WINNING' labor negotiations. He will NOT ride off into the sunset losing this one. Tuck youselves in for a long winter.

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Thanks for explaining that to me makes a lot more sense now. So how could they do replacement players when some of them are owned by different owners in other leagues? It be interesting if they could do replacement players that way we could still see hockey be weird but better than no hockey at all.

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These guys are far apart, but I can't take this too seriously with a month to go before Lockout. Nobody settles that early.

I hope my math is right, but how much are you willing to pay for the owners to get what the players have offered?

Offer $450MM-$800M over 3 years. I get:

$$$/years/teams/games/seats = your per game cost (if we fans pick up the players tab)

$450MM/3/30/41/18,500 = $6.59 per ticket ea. game

$800MM/3/30/41/18,500 = $11.72 per ticket ea. game

Where are the 1% when we need them?

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Detroit Red Wings have canceled the 2012 Prospect Tournament in Traverse City.

Too bad.

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Chopping up declined revenue is a lose/lose, no matter what the percentages are. PO'ed fans will decline revenue. Even in the rosy view of everything, the fans coming back, you still lose the revenue of the lost games...

The newly forming NFLFA should band together and let the owners and players both know that we will institute a game for game fan lockout.

They would like to come back after some lost games, probably compress the schedule and get back some of the lost revenue. I am not interested in going to 5 games a week, I can't spare the time. They are not pulling that crap on me.

I say for every calendar game on the regular schedule that they miss, we wait that many games before we return, and I mean we call up the ticket office and say we either get a refund for that many games, or cancel our season tickets.

So, for example, if they miss all of November and start in the beginning of December, we have missed 9 regularly scheduled home games. Even if they come up with a compressed schedule to try and get back a few games, maybe shorten the season a few games, it is irrelevant to me. They get a 9 game penalty from the fans, and we don't go to the first 9 games. Season ticket holders call up and demand a refund for the first 9 games, or cancel.

This is the first plank in the NHLFA platform, so sayeth The Hag.

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I love your idea of a Fan Union.

I wonder if such a thing has ever been tried.

Starting with everyone who is a STH or multiple game holder, heck even get some corporate sponsers in there.

Must be a reason it's never been done, but it is intriguing.

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Whether we have a fancy title or not we're a union with no head more or less.

Ticket sales will get slapped in the face if this happens again.

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Bettman needs to put the players and the owners in a room and not let them out - even to go the bathroom - until they come to an agreement. Also, he needs to make sure there is plenty coffee, iced tea, and beer available at the meeting.

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Bettman needs to put the players and the owners in a room and not let them out - even to go the bathroom - until they come to an agreement. Also, he needs to make sure there is plenty coffee, iced tea, and beer available at the meeting.

Bread and water, TILL it gets worked out :twilight-zone:

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Bettman needs to put the players and the owners in a room and not let them out - even to go the bathroom - until they come to an agreement. Also, he needs to make sure there is plenty coffee, iced tea, and beer available at the meeting.

The more beer the more likely we'll have an agreement.

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