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AWACSooner

IF/When Kirk gets the axe, who would you like to replace him?

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A new owner would likely want to move the team to a more profitable location....

 

Even if someone such as Goodman or Goodkinght (sp?) assumed ownership? What does this say about the overall profitability of the franchise? On the other hand why does PK keep the franchise in an area where will it not become a profitable entity? How long can he continue to lose money on the clubd?

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A "OLDSCHOOL"  type/style Coach!  Like Hitchcock, one that likes physical style of play & holds players responsible for their actions!!

 

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I'm not sure its the coach(es) at this point.  With a new GM I would give Kirk until Xmas next year and tell him flat out: Coach if you have won 60% or more of your games you stay, if you haven't your fired.

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If I was the new General Manager (still waiting for the phone to ring), I would bring back Lavi.  His free wheeling style would probably be a good fit for our current roster.  If the decision was made to blow it up and rebuild, I would bring in Scott Walker and start getting a little tougher.

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I posted in another thread that Lavi was here 3 full seasons and parts of 2 others, and made the playoffs once. His intense style has a short shelf life. I thought he was great the year they won the Cup, but the next year the Canes became one of the few teams to win the Cup and miss the playoffs the following year.

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The real time for this thread was back in the Spring/Summer last year when
the Canes (JR) passed up Alain Vigneault and John Tortorella!
 
Recall, some of us were advocating for Alain and Torts back then as they were PROVEN winners!
 
Sad, but the Canes COULD HAVE made a run for an NHL Head Coach with:
 
1) Playoffs in 6 of the last 7 seasons!

2) 2 Presidents' Trophies on his resume over the last 3 years!

3) Ultra high scoring team with his team's defense in the top-10 for three years in a row!
 

Instead JR kept sticking with unproven NHL head coach (Muller) and we all know what happened.
So, naturally, JR once again came up a day late and/or a dollar over spent (again)! 

 
Guys, we need a proven NHL HC, not unproven names like S.Walker  and Rod (great players and guys but totally unproven as NHL head coaches).

The only good news here is JR is finally moving on!!! 

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If Trotz gets canned in Nashville, he should get a serious, serious look here...not the most exciting brand of hockey, but maybe he could do more with the players here.  Pretty consistent winner on a very low budget team.  One thing to look at with Trotz are the PP numbers...218 chances and 42 goals (19.3%) as compared to our 253 chances and 33 goals (13%).  At 19.3% we would have 49 pp goals this year. Trotz got that done with ONE 20 goal scorer on the entire roster.   

 

See if Jaques Martin could be pried out of Pittsburgh

 

Kevin Dineen--He's won at all levels and probably won too fast in Fla with very little around him and then the team came crashing to earth with injuries and zero depth

 

Bottom line, I think Muller is a good coach and may very well be a great one but we need someone with serious NHL coaching experience here to right the ship. 

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Who's to say we could have had either of those coaches?  Just because a coach becomes available, it doesn't mean he will take any job that is vacant.

Sure true that... but we have ZERO evidence of any kind that JR made any attempt to see what it would take to land Torts or Vigneault.

Had he, odds are good we would have found out something by now.... not to mention Kirk is still behind the bench.

Connecting the dots... I think its safe to say, JR did not make a play for Torts or Vingeault.

 

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Sure true that... but we have ZERO evidence of any kind that JR made any attempt to see what it would take to land Torts or Vigneault.

Had he, odds are good we would have found out something by now.... not to mention Kirk is still behind the bench.

Connecting the dots... I think its safe to say, JR did not make a play for Torts or Vingeault.

 

That's some stout sleuthing there. The fact of the matter is you have ZERO evidence one way or the other regarding JR and Torts or Vigneault. JR has made enough decisions that anger people...let's not start saddling him with ones we don't even know he made.

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It's stupid (or convenient) to ignore the fact Muller hadn't had a full season behind the bench at the beginning of this season.  JR indicated on many occasions that Muller would be given this year to get the team into the playoffs.

 

We weren't looking for a new head coach at that time so yeah it is safe to say we weren't looking at Torts, Vingeault or anybody else for that matter.

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If he came in for one year and we made the playoffs, it would be a big improvement...

 We need a coach that can build a consistent playoff team, not a one year wonder.

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Guys, we need a proven NHL HC, not unproven names like S.Walker  and Rod (great players and guys but totally unproven as NHL head coaches).

 

 
I think everybody would agree with that, but they all have jobs...

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The only way I'd ever want to see Torts in Raleigh is if he's fighting Patrick Roy at center ice on Pay-Per-View!

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I'm not sure its the coach(es) at this point.  With a new GM I would give Kirk until Xmas next year and tell him flat out: Coach if you have won 60% or more of your games you stay, if you haven't your fired.

 

I can live with this statement!  Muller probably has had his hands tied. Give the man full control of the team and let's see what he can do!

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I can live with this statement!  Muller probably has had his hands tied. Give the man full control of the team and let's see what he can do!

 

Francis should know better than anybody if or how much Muller has been hindered by JR.  I am more in the camp of wrong players for his system, the old square peg/round hole debate.

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Muller has failed to motivate anyone on this team, with few exceptions. He needs to go.

My understanding is that Torts is about to be fired in Vancouver, they sure have gone downhill this year. If we want an abrasive coach, I'd go w/Lavi 2.0. I think neither is going to happen. There will be experienced head coaches available in 3 weeks.

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The mere notion of axing Muller is ludicrous. He understands hockey as well as the guy who will replace JR as and as the guy most responsible for the '06 cup win, who will also remain with the org after JR leaves (Brindy). Since that win, three coaches have tried everything. At some point it's time to accept there is a problem with on-ice leadership and to get rid of that problem. Our captain got his Cup ring at a young age and has been playing like he couldn't care less about getting another one ever since. Trade him while he's under 30 and still has value. Doing so will send a message to every player in the room that if you don't leave it all out there every night, you're gone - no matter who you are. And it might just help E. get the fire back in his belly.

Edited by top-shelf-1

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Muller has failed to motivate anyone on this team, with few exceptions.

Lindy, Sekera, Faulk, Semin, J. Staal, Skinner, Nash, Khudobin, Peters, Gerbe, Liles… seems like more than a few to me. And a core I'd be glad to move forward with. Put everybody else on the block.

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If Trotz gets canned in Nashville, he should get a serious, serious look here...not the most exciting brand of hockey, but maybe he could do more with the players here.  Pretty consistent winner on a very low budget team.  One thing to look at with Trotz are the PP numbers...218 chances and 42 goals (19.3%) as compared to our 253 chances and 33 goals (13%).  At 19.3% we would have 49 pp goals this year. Trotz got that done with ONE 20 goal scorer on the entire roster.   

 

See if Jaques Martin could be pried out of Pittsburgh

 

Kevin Dineen--He's won at all levels and probably won too fast in Fla with very little around him and then the team came crashing to earth with injuries and zero depth

 

Bottom line, I think Muller is a good coach and may very well be a great one but we need someone with serious NHL coaching experience here to right the ship. 

 

Personally, I'm done with Muller. I just can't see how he successfully fits here unless we trade most of our roster, and I don't feel a need to blow it up that much. I really don't think that most of the players are behind him at this point, as well as the square peg/round hole part that others have pointed out. He is extremely stubborn trying to follow this "system" that doesn't fit the team, it's not working but he won't budge. When a new coach comes in, it can take a few weeks of growing pains to get things figured out. But not a season and a half.

 

I hadn't even thought of Trotz, but I'd love to give him a chance here. I like what he has historically done with the players on a Nashville team that really doesn't spend anything... Although the one reservation is that his teams have usually been stronger defensively, so I don't know how well his style translates to this team. I like that powerplay fact though, and definitely wouldn't be angry at him getting a shot.

 

Dineen, I didn't watch in Florida, but he did a great job getting the Canadian women's team going together for the Olympics. Maybe he could be a good motivator for some of our underachievers *cough* Staal *cough*. 

 

 

If I was the new General Manager (still waiting for the phone to ring), I would bring back Lavi.  His free wheeling style would probably be a good fit for our current roster.  If the decision was made to blow it up and rebuild, I would bring in Scott Walker and start getting a little tougher.

 

Even though I would probably prefer the new blood/new eyes approach, going back to Lavi isn't a bad idea. I think you're right, his style would fit in well to me, I'd like to see our offensive skill doing a little more free wheeling. And he may have an expiry date, but to me with a new GM in place and a lot of different players on the roster than when he was here, I would call this more of a fresh start for him and a new team rather than 2.0

 

Just my two cents, anyways. We shall see where it ends up 

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