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The AHL is a development league, and is more than just developing a players skills on the ice. 

 

The AHL is also there to help players learn how to be a professional hockey player, on and off the ice.  That's why organizations like the Wings have a clear-cut philosophy of letting players "develop" in the AHL, regardless of whether they may be on-ice "ready".

 

The Canes would be smart to take a page out of that book.  Put me in the camp that would like to see a shakeup in the coaching ranks in Charlotte. 

Edited by coastal_caniac

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Although I fully appreciate the philosophy and sentiment behind allowing our prospects time to "develop" in  the AHL, ala Detroit, it should be obvious to all that, as they say in my county, "something ain't working". Thus, thinking back over many, many years, other than less than a handful of our prospects, namely Skinner and Faulk who apparently needed very little development, please name for me anyone who's prospered in our minor league ranks? 

 

Therefore, to me it appears that there must be a very fine line between proper, advantageous coaching and development, and stymying a player's game.

 

Now, granted Maurice x2 did not help foster a players confidence with his philosophy of putting all call-ups on the 4th line it seems, but hopefully, this coach will comprehend the harm that can do?

 

Thus, coastal, I cannot help but think that Scotty Walker's endorsement of his player is adequate proof that he believes, like remkin has opined, that this player may be on an accelerated tract to quickly jump into the NHL? Further, it appears to me that leaving him under Daniels' tutelage may not be beneficial?

 

Oh, and thanks Lake for responding above to the request for the article I'd mentioned, as I'd been away from my computer for awhile, thus could not respond.

Edited by KJUNKANE

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Ok, I'll bite.

 

Neither will meet these milestones and the Canes will be a bottom feeder this year. Even Buffalo could do better than us unless the BIG guns pull their heads out of the clouds. Hoping or thinking that Boychuk and/or Ward will make a difference this year is simply not realistic. Boychuk's a top AHLer (and a mediocre NHLer) and Ward is a backup now. Not sure why you would even consider either of them to be a difference maker. New coach, new front office, Tim Gleason and maybe Chad LaRose. This season is going to be bad. I see a tanking coming. Everyone wants to draft McDavid and this season is the sacrifical lamb that snares him. Disgusting, but likely true for several teams including the Canes.

 

This has been the weakest off-season I've seen in six years. Everyone decent is gone and some went for reasonable money. This is obviously do or die for the big money guys. I predict...

 

* No playoffs again this year

* Eric, Semin, and Ward are gone for 2015-2016

* We get a good draft pick, but its not McDavid

 

OH! But Chad LaRose may be back. SC here we come!

 

This team is bad and looks to be getting worse. I'm not sure what PK is thinking, but it's apparently not about winning a Cup. We're so far removed from even making the playoffs that I just want to scream. RF is talking to Chad LaRose? MyGod! This is team Titanic.

 

 

 

If Boychuck nets 20 goals this year and if Ward maintains he 2.30 GAA they should both be like this:

 

 

are-you-not-entertained.gif

 

Thoughts?

 

Cam has not done that on the NHL level before. Why do you think he could do that now?

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Ok, I'll bite.

 

Neither will meet these milestones and the Canes will be a bottom feeder this year. Even Buffalo could do better than us unless the BIG guns pull their heads out of the clouds. Hoping or thinking that Boychuk and/or Ward will make a difference this year is simply not realistic. Boychuk's a top AHLer (and a mediocre NHLer) and Ward is a backup now. Not sure why you would even consider either of them to be a difference maker. New coach, new front office, Tim Gleason and maybe Chad LaRose. This season is going to be bad. I see a tanking coming. Everyone wants to draft McDavid and this season is the sacrifical lamb that snares him. Disgusting, but likely true for several teams including the Canes.

 

This has been the weakest off-season I've seen in six years. Everyone decent is gone and some went for reasonable money. This is obviously do or die for the big money guys. I predict...

 

* No playoffs again this year

* Eric, Semin, and Ward are gone for 2015-2016

* We get a good draft pick, but its not McDavid

 

OH! But Chad LaRose may be back. SC here we come!

 

This team is bad and looks to be getting worse. I'm not sure what PK is thinking, but it's apparently not about winning a Cup. We're so far removed from even making the playoffs that I just want to scream. RF is talking to Chad LaRose? MyGod! This is team Titanic.

 

 

Oh I fully agree.  I predict a 3rd overall draft pick.  Over the years our offense has gotten worse and we are weaker in forwards than 2 years ago.  There is no reason to not think that we will be a bottom dweller.

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I'm in Coastal's camp with letting the players develop. Kjun, you are right in the fact that nobody has been developed, and that is why kids like Skinner, Faulk, Lindholm, and McBain get thrust into the Big Show so soon. It is going to take a change in philosophy to stop that practice. Detroit is doing something right and maybe Peters can smear a little of that on the Canes.

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Maybe a year in the AHL might have prevented Skinner from getting slobber-knocked so early in his career?  Maybe it would have prevented him from acting like such a baby on-ice early in his career?

 

Maybe some missed the point Walker made about having to throtte back McGinn?

 

Just because our development of players in Charlotte hasn't been very good isn't a reason to abandon what the AHL is there to do.  That speaks to a change in management. 

 

If I remember correctly, RF has stated quite clearly that he will be communicating to Charlotte exactly how he wants development of players to proceed moving forward.

 

Not really into starting a debate here, but that's just the way I see it.

Edited by coastal_caniac

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I think our biggest issue is throwing a prospect into the shark tank at an early age.  IE: Murphy, Lindholm, Staal, Sutter, and Skinner.  The only prospect to do remotely good their first year was Skinner.  All the others either got hurt or didn't really produce.  The organization needs to stop rushing prospects and let them develop like what we are doing with Rask.

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And coastal/super dave, I do not disagree with you one bit in regards to your comments on "development" in AHL. My point and only observation is what you've noted that THE SYSTEM has to change, because something is awry. Either that or 90% of our draftees are questionable.

 

And yes, my hope also is that not only will Peters be successful in refocusing our players here, but also that his influence changes things back in Charlotte.

 

Further, bluedevil, I'd opine that this "rushing players" you and others observed was an act of desperation, likely influenced by JR etal attempting to infuse quality too quickly in a team pointedly lacking.

Edited by KJUNKANE

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I certainly agree with the idea of not putting scorers on the 4th line in the NHL and basically telling them if they don't back check like Sutter they are going back down. 

 

Speaking of Sutter, he's about the only guy that our method works for. Back check and play defense to earn your offense. Why? He is cut out for that role in the first place. 

 

People say Boychuk is just a great AHL player. So how do we know he can't score in the NHL? Scoring guys need a chance with a run of games in the NHL in the top 9 at least, ideally the top 6 to show they can score in the NHL. And they need PP time. Scorers almost all pad their numbers on the PP (except our PP). Most of Boychuk's minutes were 4th line, or third line checking role minutes. 

 

I point to Jussi Jokinen. He had a decent career before coming here, but had tailed off in Tampa and was basically given away to us. He played 25 games with us his first partial year here and scored 1 goal. The next year he was put in a scoring role and put up 30 goals and 65 points. Then around 50 points the next two years. Then he gets misused, puts up 11points in 33 games and we decide he is worthless and we (like Tampa) give him away. Next full season he puts up 57 points.

 

It is absolutely possible that Boychuk is just an AHL scorer who cannot translate that to the NHL. But we don't know yet the way we've mostly used him. He needs to get confidence and be allowed to focus on offense for a while and get PP time if we are to know for sure. He didn't just put up a lot of goals last year, he led the league in goals and was #2 in points. What else do we want?

 

The way that we bring up our non elite scorers (not talking about 4th liners, but guys expected to put up 20 goals and 35-40 points, who have paid their dues in the minors: get on that 4th line and make dang sure that you are back on defense. OK, fine, but at some point you've got to turn them loose. Let them make a few defensive mistakes to get that offensive mojo going. 2 ways includes offense. A guy like Boychuk will only make it in the NHL if he can score. Let him try. Or don't. But don't misuse him.

Edited by remkin

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Boychuk is one of those guys that really hasn't been misused.

 

He's a former first round pick that can't crack the top-6 in the NHL.

 

Evidence.  He continually goes straight back down to Albany, or more recently Charlotte, or to the bench in Pittsburgh or Nashville.

 

There's a trend there, but it's not one of misuse.

 

Maybe he just isn't good enough?  I don't know, but at some point you have to just call a spade a spade.

 

Maybe Peters has a different plan for the third line where he can be worked into a scoring role.  Regardless, I think he's going to have to bring a lot more at the NHL level to surplant one of our top-six players.

 

He hasn't exactly been stellar in prior training camps, where he did actually have a chance to make a spot for himself, just like everybody else.

Edited by coastal_caniac

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I'd love to see a breakdown of time he's been in a true scoring role and how many minutes per game in that role. 

 

My recollection is that he spent a lot of time on lower lines, especially early on. Sure he's seen a few games on the top line, but not with any consistency. Kicking around a few waiver pick up teams that didn't slot him highly doesn't really prove he can't play either. 

 

I think it is quite possible that he just never will really rack up points in the NHL. That would certainly be the conservative bet. I mean he's been at this a while now, and has failed to break through at the NHL level. 

 

But I also think it's possible that he blooms late. That he finally gets the right opportunity and pots a few early and gets some confidence and especially on the PP contributes enough offense to be a third liner or better.

 

I guess we'll see soon enough.

Edited by remkin

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I'd say a big contributor to our "rushing" players to the NHL is our small market/lower budget status. Instead of signing an expensive FA we put our draft pick and his entry level contract in that spot and hope he's ready enough.

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Boychuk may surprise, but he didn't surprise when he had a chance on Malkin's wing...or in Nashville...or in the last half decade in Raleigh.

 

I would love to be surprised, but sometimes you have to cut bait.

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I would personally like to see Boychuk play about 20-30 games this year. He can't possibly be any worse then Bowman and I personally don't have high hopes for this roster as it stands. We already know what he can do in the AHL and I'm not sure if Ronnie cares that Boychuk can put up a ton of AHL points again this year. Time to see if he's got anything.

 

Doing the Remkin method :D He was on pace for a 29 point season last year. Better then most of our bottom 6 if not all.

 

More of a just saying statement, I too would need to see it to believe it obviously.

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Just seems like a guy who put up nearly 40 goals, most on the PP in the AHL should be able to put up at least 20 and help an anemic PP in the NHL. I know it doesn't always work that way but I'm still holding hope.

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So, according to a Chip tweet, RF is still working with Bellmore? Guess if that is successful, "the gang's back together" on defense? Good or bad?

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Considering how bad the D was last year I'd have to go with bad.

 

Either Ronnie really and truly believes Peters is the messiah or he wants a high pick next year.

Edited by legend-1

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He rejected one because he dislikes JR? Sorry, out of context, that made no sense!! That was a response Legend to your post on Sutter?

Edited by KJUNKANE

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So, according to a Chip tweet, RF is still working with Bellmore? Guess if that is successful, "the gang's back together" on defense? Good or bad?

 

Resigning Bellmore would be awesome.  Why let a servicable d man that we developed walk?  He is 6-4 and knows how to play a physical game.

 

"Brandon Sutter has reportedly turned down three different offers from the Pittsburgh Penguins.

The report states that two of the deals were short term, while one was long term. He was offered a one year, two year, and four year contract. He was offered $2.75 million for the one year, $3 million on the two year , and $3.75 million along with incentives on the 4 year.

Is Brandon Sutter worth all the hassle? When GMJR signed Marcel Goc a few weeks ago it appeared that, even then, the staff was unsure on what would come of contract talks with Sutter. Now after three turned down offers one should ask, “Does Brandon want to play in Pittsburgh?”"

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Thanks bluedevil. That is very interesting and wonder what it means as related to the Canes? Probably nothing, but surely is intriguing particularly with regards to Goc and Stepniak acquisitions, and thus Sutter's place in the center order?

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