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Whaler1

2015 NHL Entry Draft

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I can think of $50M reasons he chose Toronto.  Toronto is a wonderful city and Buffalo is not.  Player will still go to Toronto.  They are the New York Yankees of hockey.  Win or lose, love them or hate them, Canadian kids dream of wearing that uniform.

 

Not a bad move for the Leafs.  Money is no object for them.  Coaches don't count against the cap.  He's a proven winner and his "use by" date in Detroit was about up anyway (he had been there 10 years). 

Except Buffalo offered more cash. :huh:   If I had that choice  I'd take the Slugs.  They've already shed all their dead weight.

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Here's a podcast from Section 328 with Mark Seidel from Central Scouting.  Some interesting insight into the draft and what the Canes might do. 

 

http://section328.com/2015/05/20/cheaters-never-win-podcast-mark-seidel-draft-prep-edition/

 

According to Seidel, RF puts high value on big and strong, and good skating (not trying to get into the obvious debate, just repeating what he said).  He really talks up Rantanen as a possible Canes pick.

 

Worth a listen.

Edited by coastal_caniac

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I have mentioned Rantanen a few times,  and Lucic, i have watched alot, hes plays down to his skill level..

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Here's a podcast from Section 328 with Mark Seidel from Central Scouting.  Some interesting insight into the draft and what the Canes might do. 

 

http://section328.com/2015/05/20/cheaters-never-win-podcast-mark-seidel-draft-prep-edition/

 

According to Seidel, RF puts high value on big and strong, and good skating (not trying to get into the obvious debate, just repeating what he said).  He really talks up Rantanen as a possible Canes pick.

 

Worth a listen.

 

Good stuff coastal, thanks.  Here are some of the things Seidel mentioned that jumped out at me:

 

Rantanen: special player, dinged a bit in the ratings because he's playing in Europe. Seidel has him better than Crouse. Canes very interested in Rantanen.

 

Strome: not an especially strong skater which might effect how he translates to the NHL [first time I've heard that!]

 

Marner: highest potential upside other than McEichel; not as small as some are making out (5'11" with potential to grow)

 

Defensemen: he sees Hanifin as a potential franchise d-man.  Doesn't like Provorov as much as some others, in part because of the "D" side of d-men.  Seidel likes Werenski better than Provorov.

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Since I can't listen now (at work), did he talk about trading down as an option? Rantanen might be there a bit lower...

 

Strome's skating has been noted in the past. Apparently Tavares was not a great skater, but has been able to become greatly improved. Teams want big centers.

 

If Marner is not thought of as small though, that could have him gone before us.

 

Interesting on the Dmen too.

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Hmmm, then Rantanen is potentially ranking higher than the mock drafts. Not the first time. I will say that watchig video on him the guy looks smooth and skilled for a big guy.

 

Also an intersting quesiton would be if Strome and Rantanen were there which one he'd see the Canes take. Certainly would have thought Strome, but makes one wonder just how high Rantanen might climb.

Edited by remkin

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I wonder if Strome might turn out to be this years Seth Jone (sliding several spots lower than projected) . . .

Edited by LakeLivin

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Bleacher Report (which means nothing) recently put up an article:

"The most complete players in the 2015 draft."

The top eight:

1. McDavid

2. Eichel

3. Strome

4. Hanifin

5. Rantanen

6. Warenski

7. Crouse

8. Zacha

For what it is worth...

Still nice to see Rantanen up there. Btw, I said Rantanen was my dark-horse pick awhile ago. He really left an impression on me at the World Juniors. Maybe not such a dark-horse anymore but I do think non-North-American players tend to get undervalued a bit. I tend to like the European style of play.

He's already big and he just looks like a kid that is going to fill out his frame and get much stronger.

I also posted this here before but recently saw it in an article:

Rantanen has similar size, attributes, and stats at this stage in his career as Barkov did a couple of years ago and he went #2 overall. I think Rantanen is a better skater but Barkov has better hands. Both are considered big body players that know how to protect the puck and play a three-zone game. Neither is overly physical but they will go to the net to score goals.

From reading up on him, Rantanen's primary weaknesses are that he needs to get stronger (which obviously he will), he could be more physical relative to his size, and his shot needs some improvement.

Outside of that he brings a lot of positives, and is considered to be a player with as much upside as any player in the draft.

.

Edited by Kyrule

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I do remember hearing at random points in the season Tripp would say that RF was in europe scouting talent.  Then I remember hearing how he was at an OHL game when Lawson Crouse was playing.

 

I just can't imagine many scenarios where RF would draft Rantanen above Hanifin or Strome, but what do I know.

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PK17, don't think that your scenario will play out, maybe 1 of those 2 but not both. My choice, and he's also been for quite awhile, would be Rantanen, even over Strome, but if Hanifin falls, and I think that is less likely, then I'd really have a problem. Rantanen, to my way of thinking, from all I've been able to read, is a Ron Francis type of player, or so I feel. I also think Peters would like his tenacity and net front presence.

 

Lawson Crouse may also be that type of player, but I just believe the Finnish player has a bit more upside. Now whether we could "trade down" and still get him, even if we could find a magical trading partner, I'd just not take that chance.

 

And Kyrule, in that top 8 posting you've cited, curious what happened to Marner? Do they see him slipping down that far?

Edited by KJUNKANE

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PK17, don't think that your scenario will play out, maybe 1 of those 2 but not both. My choice, and he's also been for quite awhile, would be Rantanen, even over Strome, but if Hanifin falls, and I think that is less likely, then I'd really have a problem. Rantanen, to my way of thinking, from all I've been able to read, is a Ron Francis type of player, or so I feel. I also think Peters would like his tenacity and net front presence.

 

Lawson Crouse may also be that type of player, but I just believe the Finnish player has a bit more upside. Now whether we could "trade down" and still get him, even if we could find a magical trading partner, I'd just not take that chance.

 

I heard the podcast, and one thing they kept insinuating is that picking Rantanen wouldn't be a bad move at #5, but it would be a reach.  At this point, I don't think a team is going to trade up to our spot to draft him, with all the buzz going on about the top 5.  

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I heard the podcast, and one thing they kept insinuating is that picking Rantanen wouldn't be a bad move at #5, but it would be a reach.  At this point, I don't think a team is going to trade up to our spot to draft him, with all the buzz going on about the top 5.  

 

Personally, I think Strome is going to fall outside the top 5. After watching a few games and tape of him, his skating reminds me of Rask. Now, I like Rask and Strome is probably better, but his skating is not top five pick good...maybe not top 10 good. I could see people picking Rantanen before Strome, so I'd be careful about trading back to get Rantanen if Strome is the one at five...you might just trade the pick to someone who moves up to take Rantanen.

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I just don't like how when it comes to draft day, the Hurricanes are always the team to draft outside the box.  I'm thrilled about them, but Fleury and Lindholm were considered reaches for the spots they were draft at.  I see Rantanen as a role player, but not a game changer.  The Carolina Hurricanes biggest weakness is offense.  At #5 in a deep draft, they need a player that can create offense for himself and others.  Strome and Marner have done that at the biggest amateur stage in hockey.  If I said it once i'll say it again, I don't think drafting anyone outside of Strome/Hanifin/Marner at #5 is using our resources to the best of our abilities.

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I personally don't think either Lindholm or Fleury were that much of a reach. Skinner? That was a reach.

 

Lindholm was mostly ranked and mocked back and forth with Monahan at 5 and 6. Nurse and Ristolanen taken next were generally not ranked above Lindholm. Now that was the year Nichushkin fell, so one could argue that one, but he fell all the way to 10. At this moment Monahan looks like the better pick, but still too soon to tell, and still not that much of a reach. I still think Lindholm will be the real deal.

 

Fleury maybe. He was generally ranked a few spots below 7, but not much, and Nylander and Ehlers who were the forward studs left on the board (and went next) are small and offense only types. Fleury at 7 was the #2 dman in almost all rankings. There were some scouts very very high on Fleury. Of course Ekblad kind of dims any other dman of that draft.

 

I don't know if it is a fair comparison in trying to devine what Franicis might do, but he did pass on Nick Ritchie the power forward of last year's draft. How does Ritchie compare to Crouse?

Edited by remkin

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And Kyrule, in that top 8 posting you've cited, curious what happened to Marner? Do they see him slipping down that far?

The article (as mentioned) is just a Bleacher Report article that listed the top 10 most complete players in the draft (in the author's opinion). It wasn't a mock draft. You'll note Provorov is not there either because he is considered an offensive defenseman although I've read that he is more of a two-way player.

Like I said, this is just the author's opinion and doesn't carry any weight.

Note: I left #9 and #10 off the list because neither were players being discussed here.

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Remkin, admittedly, Lindholm wasn't that much of a reach, but he was drafted 2 spots higher than most rankings.  Both Nichushkin and Monahan were generally ranked above him.  But like I said, I love Lindholm and glad he's on the team but was surprised we didn't draft Monahan.

 

Fleury was definitely more of a reach.  He was the 2nd best dman in that draft and that is an organizational need, but he was barely in the top 10 in most drafts.  Some drafts had him outside the top 10.  I will say I'm glad we chose him over Kasperi Kapanen, where most people had him as a mid-late 1st round pick "unless Carolina drafts him at 7."

 

To me, the wing position is more of a luxury than a center.  And with the declining play and statistics by Eric Staal, drafting a protege now like Strome could set us up really well in the future.  I was just looking back on drafts since 2003, there's only 2 or 3 guys per year that end up being a #1 center, and Strome projects to be one of those guys this year.

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Yeah, maybe Fleury was a bit of a reach. I just remember reading a couple of articles about how good the author thought he was, and there was less consensus after Virtanen and the further down, the more guys go less in order of rankings. The two guys taken right after Fleury were small and perhaps a bit soft, so that as well as organizational need and Fleurys size and potential led to the pick.  Ritchie also dropped a ways in that one though, and I still wonder if Crouse is kind of this year's Ritchie.

 

It will be interesting to follow Ritchie and Crouse over the years because they are the two highest thought of guys that would fit the bill of power forwards. Of course, they are the elite ones, but that's where we've been drafting lately.

Edited by remkin

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Yeah, maybe Fleury was a bit of a reach. I just remember reading a couple of articles about how good the author thought he was, and there was less consensus after Virtanen and the further down, the more guys go less in order of rankings. The two guys taken right after Fleury were small and perhaps a bit soft, so that as well as organizational need and Fleurys size and potential led to the pick. Ritchie also dropped a ways in that one though, and I still wonder if Crouse is kind of this year's Ritchie.

It will be interesting to follow Ritchie and Crouse over the years because they are the two highest thought of guys that would fit the bill of power forwards. Of course, they are the elite ones, but that's where we've been drafting lately.

Ritchie dropped because of reports about being inconsistent. He was universally thought of as the #7 pick. I think the general consensus on this board was to draft him anyways. Looking at his stats for this season, he stayed very consistent, even after switching teams halfway through the season. I was one calling for Fleury, so I can't say much.

Toronto took Nylander at #8, who is similar in stature to Marner, but doesn't have as high of ceiling as Marner. That's why one would think they may not draft Marner, but their fans wouldn't mind having two undersized but high skilled forwards. Winnipeg took Ehlers at 9, who is even smaller than Marner. I didn't particularly want either player, as scouts weren't all that enthused about either, and I was in the getting bigger camp. Although I wouldn't have minded if we drafted Ritchie.

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I was not initially in the Fleury camp, but then I usually want to draft forwards. I was interested in Virtanten, but Vancouver grabbed him. But after the Fleury pick it grew on me. Of course one is tempted to lament the fact that we can't quite get bad enough to pick the Ekblads of the drafts, but we got what certainly appeared to be the next best d man in the draft. Further, not to bring up the size issue again, but outside of going Ritchie, the next forward options were not only the two smaller guys you mentioned, but I believe both of them had some form of "soft" or not interested in playing defense tags. Plus Fleury is a good sized a 6'3" to help eventually in that whole area.

 

Despite a down year offensively, I still have very high hopes for Fleury. (McKeown, our prospect pick up from LA kind of had the same kind of down offensive year). Both guys supposedly still look good and are taking steps forward in non offensive parts of the game. Points out the trickiness of picking D men though.

 

Here's a quote from a recent article on our prospects in Hockey's Future:

 

It wasn’t a standout season for Fleury; he was cut from Canada’s World Junior team, and he finished with 18 fewer points (six goals, 22 assists) than he had last year. His Rebels were ousted in the first round of the 2015 WHL playoffs.

 

Still, Fleury remains Carolina’s prized prospect, a big, rangy, smooth-skating blueliner who is still learning all the responsibilities that come with being a No. 1 defenseman and top pick. Were his numbers down? Yes. Did he finish 2014-15 as a better player than he started it? Absolutely.

 

Article has some thoughts on other prospects too:

 

http://www.hockeysfuture.com/articles/123105/carolina-hurricanes-prospects-show-promise-despite-frustrating-season/

Edited by remkin

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Here's a podcast from Section 328 with Mark Seidel from Central Scouting.  Some interesting insight into the draft and what the Canes might do. 

 

http://section328.com/2015/05/20/cheaters-never-win-podcast-mark-seidel-draft-prep-edition/

 

According to Seidel, RF puts high value on big and strong, and good skating (not trying to get into the obvious debate, just repeating what he said).  He really talks up Rantanen as a possible Canes pick.

 

Worth a listen.

Got around to listening this morning. He blew right by Crouse and talked up Rantanen as the likely choice if GMRF goes against the grain. He put up a really good argument. After listening to him, I'm almost expecting Marner to go before Strome.

Edited by super_dave_1

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It is interesting nobody has picked up on the comment - about RF's best move to date - according to Seidel...

 

.....the hiring of Mike Vellucci.

 

The Canes need to come away a few years from now with a good draft class from 2015.

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