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2015 Training Camp and Pre-Season

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It was good to see Tolchinsky hang in there as long as he did.  Admittedly, I wasn't as high on him as some of you here, but my hopes for him as an NHL player have gone way up.

 

On McGinn, I've never looked at him as a top-6 kind of guy, so I don't think playing on the fourth line would hinder his development, so it will be interesting to see how that plays out.

 

Ryan is an interesting story as well.

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I'm just relieved Hanifin looks good out there and is actually contributing.  If he was like a deer lost in head lights out there then I would be more concerned abotu the chances of this team being competitive.  I'm betting Pesce or Slavin might replace Murphy if he doesn't step his game up.

 

Chuck K. was on the XM morning show and he pretty much said Hanifin is on the team.  His comments on Hanifin were very, very positive.  He also said Fluery would likely be returning to Red Deer at some point.

Edited by coastal_caniac

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Ryan and Nord will have to go through waivers if cut.  Fleury, Slavin, and Pesce do not,  So I expect these 3 dmen are the next to get cut unless something crazy happens or one of them beats out Murphy.  Ryan doesn't really strike me as a 4th liner, Nordstrom does.

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Not being able to see the team play during exhibition has hindered some of the couch potato evaluations I like to play around with. Even if I had seen them I'm not sure I would be able to predict who our final cuts would be.

 

With Drew MacIntyre being returned to Charlotte and Wards showing yesterday I would think it is officially game-on for Lack and Ward.

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Say It Ain't So

 

Peters refers to Brock McGinn as Ginner. I can't wait for him to use Ginner and Skinner in the same sentence.

 

Peters Post Game Audio

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On McGinn playing the fourth line:  I don't see that as a bad thing.  If he has the chops most of us (myself included) think he does, he'll work his way up the lines.  We carried Brandon Sutter almost a whole season on the fourth line, and he's stuck in the NHL.  We also carried Tlusty there, and he gradually worked his way up.

 

On Murphy:  I think this organization should give him a full season before deciding on moving him.  I mean, last year he was on pace to reach over 30pts, which is good for a young defenseman.  He did improve at the end of last season, and he's done ok in the preseason.  If that's not the route GMRF wants to go with him, then it might be in the best interest of the franchise to trade him for a forward prospect or pick.

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The status of Dwyer as another unemployed ex-Cane is telling.  A lot of guys that leave here without a contract do not find other employment in the league.  That tells a lot about the talent level of a lot of guys that have been in the locker room.  When player after player leaves and can't find a job, that says a lot about the talent level of the organization.

 

Also, my inner hockey nerd gets perturbed with no game stats.

Edited by super_dave_1

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McGinn put up 43 goals and 85 points in 58 games on a "just ok" Guelph team in the OHL two years ago (1.47ppg).  The prior year he scored at a .79ppg rate.  Granted, that's the OHL, but the kid has shown he isn't necessarily just a banger.   Unless he's actually going to make a difference to the Canes chances this year (unlikely imo), I'd like to see us continue to develop him like we say is important to do with/ for our yutes.  Maybe put him on a line with Tolchinsky and let them develop some chemistry that might carry over to the Canes a year or 2 down the road?  If he's earning it in Charlotte, let him taste the NHL as a call up when the inevitable injuries occur and at the end of the season.        

Edited by LakeLivin

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The status of Dwyer as another unemployed ex-Cane is telling.  A lot of guys that leave here without a contract do not find other employment in the league.  That tells a lot about the talent level of a lot of guys that have been in the locker room.  When player after player leaves and can't find a job, that says a lot about the talent level of the organization.

 

Also, my inner hockey nerd gets perturbed with no game stats.

 

:goodpost: 

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On Murphy:  I think this organization should give him a full season before deciding on moving him.  I mean, last year he was on pace to reach over 30pts, which is good for a young defenseman.  He did improve at the end of last season, and he's done ok in the preseason.  If that's not the route GMRF wants to go with him, then it might be in the best interest of the franchise to trade him for a forward prospect or pick.

 

Agree. Plus we can hide him in the #6 slot and even scratch for certain games (say vs high octane offenses). Need to see what we have, and frankly also make him more tradable.

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https://translate.google.ca/translate?sl=auto&tl=en&js=y&prev=_t&hl=en&ie=UTF-8&u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.journaldemontreal.com%2F2015%2F09%2F27%2Fcontenir-louragan&edit-text=&act=url

 

Anybody read this asinine article?  I got it from another board.  It claims Eric is seeking $9mil per season.  I highly doubt this is true, but if it is, don't let the door hit you where the good lord split you.

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https://translate.google.ca/translate?sl=auto&tl=en&js=y&prev=_t&hl=en&ie=UTF-8&u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.journaldemontreal.com%2F2015%2F09%2F27%2Fcontenir-louragan&edit-text=&act=url

 

Anybody read this asinine article?  I got it from another board.  It claims Eric is seeking $9mil per season.  I highly doubt this is true, but if it is, don't let the door hit you where the good lord split you.

Someone is grasping at straws...either that reporter, or Eric.  Either way, the $9 mil is just not going to happen...no matter what team Eric ends up playing for.

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Knowing how much teams overpay in FA I really wouldn't be surprised if he could get 9 in the open market and I agree see you later at that price. 50-60 points a year isn't worth 9 mil to this team.

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Someone is grasping at straws...either that reporter, or Eric.  Either way, the $9 mil is just not going to happen...no matter what team Eric ends up playing for.

I tend to agree, but stranger things have happened. A desperate GM and one deep playoff run could be all that's needed to get Eric his "golden parachute."

 

Remember, if we deal him anytime between now and the end of the year, he's off our books and onto someone else's, relatively cheaply. If he goes someplace that hasn't tasted the playoffs in years and if that team gets in the dance and makes a run, it will face fan pressure to sign him over the summer. 

 

The real question to me is whether Eric is willing to roll the dice on a flashy annual number for fewer years, or can be happy with a smaller number for a longer term. If he signs here for four years at $7 million (about 500K more than I'd offer, but let's just say) he stands to make $28 million if he lasts the whole contract. That's a million more than he'd get on a 3-year deal at $9 million per year - and I seriously doubt that whatever team signed him at 9 would give him that much in the last two years of the deal. 

 

So, if he accepts an adjustment that reflects how we intend to use him going forward, AND shows he can meet those demands, he probably has a deal here. But if his agent has convinced him that he should try to prove something that has absolutely nothing to do with hockey and everything to do with ego, he may very well find a GM enabler to partner with. Here's hoping he's smarter than that.

 

(Reminder to everybody, we've got a separate thread going for all things related to Staal's contract status here.)

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So I came across a couple of articles ranking our prospects. One thing is pretty clear. The cupboard is full of defenseman, and bare of forwards. Not surprising in the way we have drafted and even traded (McKeown was the prospect), and we have drafted defenseman in the first round 3 of our last 4 picks: Murphy, Fleury, Hanifin (only Lindholm was a forward).

 

So we are really pretty stacked w/ defensive prospects, though some will, by pure statistical reality, not pan out, we have some later round dmen looking good too. Murphy was a #12 pick and in a way the key to how embarassing the riches will be. IF he becomes a slick offensive dman, he could be traded for a forward or play bottom pair and PP.

 

The one article ranks our prospects: Hanifin, Fleury (duh), Carrick, McKeown, Pesce. The other only goes 5 deep but puts Hanifin, Fluery and Pesce at 1,2,5.

 

But...they are no longer counting Murphy as a prospect, and if you look at who's still on the roster and has really shown well you also have to add one Jacob Slavin. Another college player (Hanifin, Pesce also), but a 4th round pick, he is 6'2" 205 (all of the sudden a bit small for us) and has really peformed very well at all preseason steps. Trevor Carrick, a bit more herolded d prospect, who put up .71 ppg last year of juniors and .42 ppg in his first season on a bad Charlotte team, and is a good prospect too, is back in Charlotte, while Slavin, temporarily gets more looks in Raleigh.

 

When you factor in that Justin Faulk, a second round pick is still so young....it is looking really good and should really start showing up  as elite around 2 years from now.

 

My take:

 

Noah Hanifin: super elite. The real deal. Will play this year and be solid. Then look out.

Hayden Fleury: elite. Also for real, my guess is next year on the roster, two years starts putting it together. A bit surprising amt of offense.

Ryan Murphy: #12 pick. High end offensive skills. Needs to quickly prove he is not the defensive Zach Boychuk.

Roland McKeown: very hard to know. Took a step back in juniors. Didn't make major impression. But LA moved a good player to move up and pick him and clearly has potential to be very solid dman. Needs more developement, but still very young.

Brett Pesce: 6'3": very high potential to be a solid second paing NHL dman. Already has that NHL calm.

Trevor Carrick: hard hitting and physical, yet has already started racking up points in Charolotte.

Jacob Slavin: 4th rounder, but has impressed in camp. Still most likely goes to Charlotte, but a very nice guy to have in waiting, and a bit of a surprise to still be in Raleigh.

 

And to add to those names are others who have shown ability, especially as bottom half dmen:

 

Rissan, Lowe, Biega,

 

And then, on top of all of that, still in Raleigh is Michal Jordan, who might be the actual guy who nabs the #6 slot if Hanifin makes it and Murphy struggles. Not going to be a star but solid.

 

So, eventually Hanifin, Faulk and Fleury really could be the best 123 dmen in the league in a few years. Find just ONE guy from the list above to rise up and be a super solid #4 guy (Pesce, McKeown, Carrick), and we just have to fill out the bottom pair, which is pretty easy, to have one of the best defenses in the league.

 

Yes, we are looking good for years to come back there. And w/ Lack now and Nedeljkovic in developement it could all be really good back there.

 

Just need to draft or sign or trade for some elite front end talent and we'll be there.

Edited by remkin

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Just need to draft or sign or trade for some elite front end talent and we'll be there.

 

I think the first half of this year will determine the importance we place on acquiring more talent or whether we have enough, with one or two elites playing like elites, that the others can be the role players BP requires under his "Detroit East" system. 

 

We have budding elite talent in Lindy and Rask. Will both step up this year? If so, we're suddenly flush with elite talent (E, Skinner, and the Swedes). Distribute four elites among your top two lines and you set up leads for your third and fourth liners, working with the top D pairs, to protect.

 

What BP is doing is pretty obvious. The question is whether everybody buys in, and if not, what we can turn their contracts into, instead.

Edited by top-shelf-1

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So somehow that got a bit long up there.

 

Ironically, the thing I really wanted to post was this. I would say that I follow our prospects fairly closely. I'm sure some on here follow even more closely, but anyways, I was really intersted to see not one, but two separate prospect ranking articles mention a guy that I barely remember us even drafting, as a top prospect. He was a 6th round pick (#169) and our own website does not even show a picure of him, just a shaddow outline:

 

From My NHL trade rumors: http://www.mynhltraderumors.com/2015/08/06/2015-16-carolina-hurricanes-top-10-prospects/

 

Who the heck is David Cotton? The big Texan is a relative unknown but he light up New England prep hockey last season playing for Crushing Academy scoring 27 goals and 69 points in only 33 games. Cotton is committed to Boston College in 2016, so he represents a very long term project, but one NHL scout says he has the makings to be a serious NHL prospect. At only 18 and already 6’3” and 200 lbs his strengths are his puck protection skills, skating, size and offensive skills.

Scouting Report

Texas-born Cotton played prep hockey at Cushing Academy this past season, and at 6’3″ 200 lbs, his opponents had a difficult time containing him. In 33 games Cotton stomped across New England last year, averaging over two points per game and earning Central Scouting’s top ranking among New England prep hockey’s draft eligible players. (Ross Bonander THW)

 

But I was really surprised when a blog on Today's Slapshot shot him up to our #4 overall best prospect and rated his potential as near All Star: http://www.todaysslapshot.com/nhl-east/metropolitan/carolina-hurricanes/nhl-prospects-carolina-hurricanes-top-5-for-2015/

 

4. C David Cotton (7.5) The surprise entry to the Hurricanes top five, but this kid’s upside is just sky-high. We have been touting this native Texan as a huge sleeper in the 2015 draft, and clearly Ron Francis agreed, stealing him in the sixth round (#169). If you have not heard of him, try telling us what is not to like about a 6’2.5-200 pivot who skates well and displays excellent, if raw, offensive talent. Next year, Cotton will start an immense learning curve at the powerhouse Boston College program. If he can hone his talents and gain a skating step, he has top-6 upside at the NHL level.

 

 

These bloggers may be picking up on each other and trying to find that "I called it" long shot picks, but Boston College gets the very best recruits and no sooner than one Noah Hanifin removes a major reason to follow BC, David Cotton gives us a big (pun) reason to follow them again.

Edited by remkin

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I have our defensive prospects ranked (in order):

 

Hanifin

Fluery

Slavin

Pesce

Carrick

McKeown\Biega\Rissanen\Lowe

Wesley

 

I guess you could consider Murphy a prospect but I don't.  I consider him an NHL project, much like Jordan.

 

As far as the offensive prospects go, we have a long way to go to get more high-end skill in our lineup, to the point the team would considered to be deep in that regard.

Edited by coastal_caniac

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Coastal, I consider you one of our defensive experts. I am interested in your impressions on Slavin. Do you think he makes the team out of camp? Does he push Murphy for that spot? Do we go w/ 7 guys back there and rotate? What little I've seen of him has been good.

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These bloggers may be picking up on each other and trying to find that "I called it" long shot picks, but Boston College gets the very best recruits and no sooner than one Noah Hanifin removes a major reason to follow BC, David Cotton gives us a big (pun) reason to follow them again.

 

I have a friend in Boston who follows BC hockey religiously (all Hockey East for that matter).

 

I am sure I will hear a lot of updates about this kid if he is worthy of them, I'll pass them along as I hear them.

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Coastal, I consider you one of our defensive experts. I am interested in your impressions on Slavin. Do you think he makes the team out of camp? Does he push Murphy for that spot? Do we go w/ 7 guys back there and rotate? What little I've seen of him has been good.

 

Well, only from what I've seen personally, I've been quite surprised to see what we have after watching the kid on the ice.  He did attend Colorado College, and that's a great hockey program.

 

I think Pesce and Slavin are both wonderful defensive prospects, but they are different.

 

Both are big kids.  Slavin, to me, is a very smooth skater who really moves the puck well, knows when to jump into the play, and has some really nice offensive upside.  What's also apparent watching him, and what's impressed me the most, is that he can transition from a shut-down role to an offensive role as the game dictates.

 

Pesce skates okay, but needs some work there, and I expect he will get better.  When I watch Pesce I see more of a shutdown defender who moves the puck well, and can pitch in some offense from time to time.  I expect him to play more of a shutdown role.

 

In terms of who is better now, I give the slight nod to Slavin due to his skating and offensive upside.  IMO, if Murphy doesn't improve defensively, Slavin is the guy who might replace him in the pecking order.  But Murphy brings that right shot.  Slavin was playing on the left side in Traverse City and preseason and is a left shot.  Peters included Slavin as one of two or three standouts at the Traverse City tourney, if I remember correctly, so he's getting noticed, and it seems he made the most out of that opportunity.  He's also looked really good in practice.  I found a replay of his goal from Sunday, check it out.

 

https://twitter.com/NHLCanes/status/648259499761905665

 

 

I expect both Slavin and Pesce to go down to Charlotte, but I also expect both to see some NHL action this season.

Edited by coastal_caniac

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Agreed Coastal, that's how I see our D prospects as well.

The word you keep hearing with Slavin is "poise", and he seems confident when jumping into the play offensively. He also seems a bit more mobile than Pesce. I think Pesce is going to have to change his skating stride a little as it/he seems awkwards at times.

What also stands out to me is Hanifin's upright skating style, yet he can explode and move laterally with ease with short foot movements. Many of the elite defensemen exhibit this ability as it allows them to keep their head up with good vision, read the play, and react accordingly in a quick manner. Being 6'3 doesn't hurt either. I see this with Fleury as well but to a lesser degree at this point. I think Hanifin is just a rare/gifted skater.

A guy like Pesce seems to skate a little more choppy with his feet farther apart, and that usually means less mobility. Still, this is stuff that can be worked on to a certain degree.

Anyway, good evaluation. Can't wait to watch these guys develop.

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I think McKeown not catching your eye kind of sums it up.

He really doesn't seem to stand out in any one area. Everything seems ok, but he just looked vanilla to me. I didn't see him try to assert himself in any one area. Maybe he is just trying to be steady/solid, but when a guy is competing for a spot on the big club I just think you have to make yourself noticeable in some way. I just didn't see it from McKeown.

Of course this is all based on little exposure so...

I'm sure others have seen him more and can provide a better analysis.

.

Edited by Kyrule

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