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2015/16 In-Season Talk

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Maybe partly due to the fact that HIlton Head is in SC, which has controls on gill netting? Pretty sure NC is one of the few states (only state?) that doesn't control gill nets  . . . Ask coastal after he gets back.  Pretty sure this is right in his wheel house.

I fish primarily at Emerald Isle. The Nets have killed much of the shore fishing. You can probably catch a few fish at Holden although it will be slow. I fish primarily with cut mullet. Last time out I caught  a few flounder, a trout,spots and a huge stingray. Not my fish of choice but it was a great 1/2 hour fight.

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What I'm beginning to see is a team I can watch. We are getting to see a hint of the future and at times they are playing really good hockey.  Could it all go sour again, sure. Could we lose some really good players and fan favorites as this team evolves, I expect it. But I'm beginning to see a system that can work and players who are beginning to believe in themselves.

 

My expectations are tempered with the reality that this may not be a playoff year but I will be disappointed if they don't at least challenge for a spot. I hope the market can get behind the team again.

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A Night at a Canes game use to be my families favorite past time.. Now its hard to get any of them to go.. Mind you they are not die hard hockey fans like most here, but in their minds why go if your team seldom gives you anything to cheer about year after year.. Wonder if this is the mind set of a lot of fans out there,,Then is it the cost factor?????Family of 4 decent tickets, parking, food, 2hr drive, a beer or two and you just spent 650.00 to watch the visiting teams fans cheer....

 

I can see the light at tunnel, the yutes are coming to Carollina and if the fort stays in tact good days are a head... But until then the woes of rumors, trades, Over inflated contracts and reality of it all must be endured....

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No playoffs for a long time, plus long rebuild, plus no superstar for fans to come and watch, is a formula for low attendence. I certainly wouldn't pay more to go to a restaurant that had bad food, so why would anyone pay more to see a bad hockey team. The Canes are fortunate to be in a market with so many fans from other teams, or attendence would be even lower.

You pay to go see a team when they are not playing well to keep them in your town, so they can hopefully improve and be a team you can enjoy watching in the future. Otherwise, they will not be there to enjoy at all. They don't stay there forever just in case you might feel like attending someday. It's called being a fan, and not a bandwagoner!

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Well opening night this year was a sellout, and I don't think it always has been. Yes, Detroit's fans helped, but really, that was mostly Canes fans in there. Opening night showed that there are fans out there, hungry for hockey. Look there are maybe 10 markets that will sell out every game no matter how awful the team is. The NHL has expanded way past those. We need something to cheer for. We need some winning. Some playoff hockey. A star. Used to be I would be excited to go watch Skinner. Even he who shall not be named-"sky" was fun that one year. In this market there have been so many serial dissapointments.

 

Really hockeysmitten, I get the sentiment, but that's a lot of money for people to watch a lot of futile hockey, at home. It's not just one bad year. That's 5 years of letdowns in a row. People don't put out hundreds of dollars just to "support hockey in Raleigh". That's what people do to "support the Little Sisters of the Poor", or "support PBS", or "support Big Brothers". Not realistic. Sure the rabid fans in Toronto live, breathe and die hockey. Most of them played it. That's not really a donation to hockey, they just can't get enough because they are certifiable. Its in their DNA. That is their bread and butter. They would give up 5 world series wins for one cup. (I'm guessing).

 

Even Chicago's stadium sat mostly empty for years while they stunk. Pittsburgh's team almost went bankrupt when they stunk.

 

This market cannot sustain years and years of losing. Last year was a gut punch. Even those of us rabid enough to come on here when all hope is lost find this kind of chronic losing hard to deal with. Last year even the illusion that "this year could be diffrerent" was shattered 8 games in. Seriously? Essentailly the entire year was futile. It amounted to preseason games in terms of what it meant for that season. I can't imagine based on that that we are at a nadir now. This is as low as it goes without a full on rebuild.

 

As the the quick fix in last year's draft, there were only two marquis uber stars who would sell tickets this year: McEichel. To be assured one of them we had to full on tank and even then, outtanking Buffalo would have been very hard as they were committed to it from probably the year before or sooner.

 

That said, I do think we got a franchise D man. This is very good long term, but not this year, and rookie defenseman don't sell tickets. So the quick fix: tanking, was really not going to happen. And this year the drafting rules really do inhibit tanking. (Last year, the Buffalo was a can't miss, this year there are not two superstars and teams are not assured of only dropping one spot. Last year was the year of the tank.)

 

Anyway, I really do believe that if this team starts winning this year, the building will start to fill as the year goes on. If not....can we sustain a full on rebuild? Who knows?

 

This is why I still think the key to a quick dip then improvment is signing E and probably Ward, but to contracts that can be moved. I know I get some push back on this NTC thing, but if a guy is not working out, you can always trade him: but for two things: 1. His play/contract are way too out of alignment (but even then you can almost always get a bad trade to move the guy). 2. Player has a NTC and blocks the trade.

 

So, if we get Ward and E back on more reasonable deals, with no, or very very limited NTC's. We can try them to keep us from absolute disaster, but move them if the overaching plan is not working.

 

If we don't and especially if they walk. Imagine the average remaining fan. Remember, we on this board, are uberfans, most fans think of Eric as our star, and Ward probably next. If they both walk, leaving the team with the same team minus it's top scoring forward and top goalie? And no return? But with too many wins to get at the Austin Matthews'? Where is the hope in that? 

 

In a way, the worst possible case would be for this team to be around the cut line at Thanksgiving, and to have Eric holdling out for a NTC and too much cash. What do you do? If you wait, the trade deadline deal either doesn't come together (see Ray Whitney) or is a much smaller return than we would get now.

 

Francis has made a lot of nice moves to this point. How he handles Eric Staal, and Cam Ward will be determine a lot of where this team will go and how long it will take to get there.

 

Apparrently he has laid out December as the time to make this happen. There is a holiday trade freeze and I bet he's eying that in a hope to have this resolved by Jan 2.

 

OK,  anyway, this team is currently right on the cusp. IF their improved play of the 6 games before Tampa, is indicative, and IF they can find a way to activate Skinner and Linholm offensively, they still have 8/12 at home, and they can finish the month in a  playoff position.

 

If this team claws back into it, and is able to resign Ward/Staal on good deals, then attendance will build. If we go South, and E and Ward will not re-sign for our offer, BUT they'll let us, we trade them for picks/players and get ready for another dive, but at least we'll have a heck of a lot of draft picks to work with. I prefer option 1 because then we have them but can trade them. Francis holds the cards. But if they refuse a workable deal or refuse to lose the NTC, then we have to get something back.

 

The bad news is that this team came out weak and prompty went 2-6. The good news is that they battled out of it and got to 5-6 before tossing the dreaded home return game to Tampa. So they sit 5-7. They are in range, but by Thanksiving? That is the next post.

Edited by remkin

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You pay to go see a team when they are not playing well to keep them in your town, so they can hopefully improve and be a team you can enjoy watching in the future. Otherwise, they will not be there to enjoy at all. They don't stay there forever just in case you might feel like attending someday. It's called being a fan, and not a bandwagoner!

 

How's the view from the Ivory Tower?

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You pay to go see a team when they are not playing well to keep them in your town, so they can hopefully improve and be a team you can enjoy watching in the future. Otherwise, they will not be there to enjoy at all. They don't stay there forever just in case you might feel like attending someday. It's called being a fan, and not a bandwagoner!

First off, I want to say that I respect your opinion and I can sense your passion for the game and team. And I agree, in a perfect world with no monetary limitations or other entertainment options, you should go support the team to keep them in town.

However, in reality, family budgets and entertainment value do matter. I may not be the best example since I live in an area devoid of major professional sports, but it is currently too costly for me to drive 2+ hours, deal with traffic, pay for parking, tickets, food, etc., when I could sit comfortably at home and watch the game on tv. My only live sporting options are a couple of minor league teams, which offer a family-friendly environment for my young kids, plus the tickets are cheap and the entertainment value is still good. It all comes down to a personal decision based on entertainment value against budget. I would love to attend a Canes' game one day. It's just not feasible at the moment.

Also, I don't think everyone who doesn't make it to a game should be labeled a "bandwagoner". Everyone has their own level of fandom, but a professional sports team doesn't survive on die-hard fans alone. That's why marketing departments are out to try to get the "casual fan", because that's the only way their business can grow. They know they already have the die-hards, but if they can get more casual fans in the seats, then maybe over time, they become die-hards as well.

Again, I respect your opinion, and I don't want the Canes to leave either. I just don't think it's as simple as "everyone show up or the team will leave".

Edited by RNT82

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I wanted to look at what it might take to be in a playoff position by Thanksgiving.

 

It is not as easy as it looks. Bottom line it will take another winning streak and is unlikely, though possible.

 

Right now the playoff cut line is .640 winning percentage. The final number last year was 61% wins and 60% of available points. Roughly, we will likely need at least about a 60-62% winning percentage at year's end to make the cut.

 

We have dug a hole, but partially filled it in, but we are going to need a couple of nice winning streaks against at least .500 hockey at minimum.

 

Actually goint to Thanksgiving dinner in the playoff group is going to be very very hard to do. We are currently 5-7. Which is not bad given the start, but the dirty little secret in the NHL is that it is actually very hard to close points with position: ie the cut line. For every Ottawa that might drop back there is a Florida that will go on a winning streak. Then there's all those loser points. Then there's the pesky fact that we alwasy seem to have played more games.

 

The problem is that there are only 10 games between now and Thanksgiving. That means at Thanksgiving, we will have played 22 games. The record that equates to .620? 13-9. 

 

Now 13-9 is not some kind of killer record, but to get there in the next 10 games is. We are 5-7. To get to 13-9 we need to go 8-2 from now to Thanksgiving.

 

8-2. Currently 3 teams out of 30 are on 8-2 runs: Montreal, Dallas, and Washington. So right there one could guess that there is about a 1/10 chance for a team to go 8-2. But those are also 3 of the best teams in the league. Those are straight up contenders.

 

The good teams go on runs: 6-2, 7-3, etc. So hopefully we can, but it is a tall order. Plus it is custom ordered over these exact 10 games.

 

Technically, if we go by % of available points that made the playoffs last year, we need 15/20 points before Thanksgiving. That would mean we could go say 7-2-1. A better shot would be 6-2-2. Somehow that seems more doable, and still gets us to 14 points more vs 15. Still likely on the cusp.

 

 

So ony Francis knows (if even he does) what he is looking for by Thanksgiving, but I think it is fair to say that .500 is the bare minumum, and really for me at least showing .650 during this homestand is key. That is, just a hair above the cut line winning percentage for the playoffs during the homestand itself. This would be, 13 of 20 points. 6-3-1.  It probably leaves us 2-4 points out. But on the cusp.

 

To me, that is the magic record: 6-3-1 or better. That would put us 11-10-1 on Thanksgiving day. That would not put us over the cut line, but we would be right there.

 

Anything that brings less than 10 of the 20 points on the table? Well it depends on how far off the mark and what the circumstances are, but that would mean no closing of the gap by Thanksgiving, which would bode badly for playoffs this year. The cut line last year for the playoffs was 60% of the available points. It would also mean no gains during our homestand.

 

The tough spot would be 9-11 points. It would leave the heavy lifting for the future, but not knock us out.

 

It is next to unheard of for a team that is more than 10 points out on Jan 1 to make the playoffs. Ottawa was around there but that was a insanely sick run they went on.

 

So...by my calculations, a team needs at minimum 37 points by New Year's eve. Now stay with me here, because this supports the idea of at least playing playoff percentage hockey during the next 10 games (60% of available points).

 

While 37 is the minumum by New Years, it still puts you too far out. Really you need to be within 5 points to have a reasonable shot. That would be 41 points. We have 10. If we got 12 more (60%) over the next 10 games we would be at 22 points, with 16 more games by New Years: 16 x .60 (staying at the playoff cut pace) is 9.6 points. Plus 22 is 41.2 points the target to be 4-5 point out with just over 3 mos to go. 

 

BUT the last two in Nov December has a lot of tough games. So we really do have to make up at least a chunk of the gap before Thanksgiving.

 

So, 6-3-1 or better over the next 10 is a go.

4-5-1 or worse, and time to make big changes fast.

In between? 10-12 points? Tough call.

Edited by remkin

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How's the view from the Ivory Tower?

No Ivory Tower here, just don't want to lose my team...but I guess no one else sees my point quite the same way. Only time will tell I guess. And wasn't meaning everyone should go out and become a STH today. Just meant it's sad for the few who do show up for these games and see all those empty seats and wonder how long this can last. Sorry for the downer.

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You pay to go see a team when they are not playing well to keep them in your town, so they can hopefully improve and be a team you can enjoy watching in the future. Otherwise, they will not be there to enjoy at all. They don't stay there forever just in case you might feel like attending someday. It's called being a fan, and not a bandwagoner!
If they move, it will be because they didn't put a quality product on the ice. The commitment has to go both ways. It is not cheap to go to a game. We always spend the night, and have to put the dog in the kennel, not to mention food and gas. You can call me a bandwagoner, but,unless the team puts a better product on the ice, they won't get my money.If you want to keep pouring money down a rat hole,that's you buisness.

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No Ivory Tower here, just don't want to lose my team...but I guess no one else sees my point quite the same way. Only time will tell I guess. And wasn't meaning everyone should go out and become a STH today. Just meant it's sad for the few who do show up for these games and see all those empty seats and wonder how long this can last. Sorry for the downer.

 

Questioning anybody who isn't a STH or dumping tons of money as a "bandwagoner" is pretty Ivory Tower-ish.

 

Look, I was a STH for years and spent a ton of money giving tickets to friends, family, etc. just to get them to the games and try to support the team.  I have tired of the ticket sales games and the current product on the ice.  Life has also dealt me a different set of cards to play with kids in school and tuition bills.  We catch crap in this market for giving the players a break and not holding them accountable.  Why is it any different with ownership/management?

 

No team is going to move until the owners get their billion dollars in expansion fees from new teams.

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Questioning anybody who isn't a STH or dumping tons of money as a "bandwagoner" is pretty Ivory Tower-ish.

 

Look, I was a STH for years and spent a ton of money giving tickets to friends, family, etc. just to get them to the games and try to support the team.  I have tired of the ticket sales games and the current product on the ice.  Life has also dealt me a different set of cards to play with kids in school and tuition bills.  We catch crap in this market for giving the players a break and not holding them accountable.  Why is it any different with ownership/management?

 

No team is going to move until the owners get their billion dollars in expansion fees from new teams.

I never questioned anyone for not being a STH, don't do that. I know everyone is not in the position to do that, but support is another thing. At the last game my seats were the only seats filled in my whole row, and the row behind me had three people in it. Looking across the arena there were whole sections with only a few scattered people in them. They say we have 12 thousand people there, but there is much less than that by the looks of it. I haven't seen it this empty since the team first came here. I guess it's just freakin me out. I hope you're right about them going nowhere, I'll count on that.

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Season Ticket Holders vs TV Ratings vs Merchandise sales. You can argue who is most important until the cows come home but in the end they all are.

 

Fan support comes in all forms and unless it is strong across the board your franchise struggles.

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Well, when you point out that you are a STH and then find fault in all the people that aren't there, I guess it's normal to infer certain things.  My bad...I guess.

 

This organization has been floundering in stormy seas with no rudder and no captain for years.  Is it strange that even the rats are abandoning ship?  People have too many entertainment options now to blindly throw their money away on entertainment when they are not entertained.  That is a new variable that has to be accounted for by those that are making policy. 

 

In a league where half the teams make the playoffs every year, you can't fail year after year and not expect some fan kickback, especially when you decide to "right size" your ticket prices during the drought.

 

If you build it, they will come.

Edited by super_dave_1

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OK, I am caught up in the distraction of what it would take mathmatically to make or miss the playoffs and how that relates to our Thanksgiving cutoff and the well known January 1 cutoff.

 

I was basing the playoff cut line at needing 60% of available points, on last year. Now while that is the safe cutoff, (since the last several years that makes the cut every time in both East and West). BUT last year in the East was the tankathon for McEichel. The last 4 teams fighting Buffalo for the bottom (26-29) averaged 5 points each (23 points total) less than last year. And the effect was throughout the bottom. Those points flowed to the teams in the hunt causing a higher cut off last year than in the past.

 

Last year in the East it took 98 points to get in. But in the past 3 seasons before that 93 got you in (57% of available points).

 

Bottom line though, 60% of available points gets you in nearly every time, but 57% will get it done most years.

Edited by remkin

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So...

 

I made the claim: 4-5-1 or worse, and time to make big changes fast. This is based on sub .500, not even NHL .500 during our longest home streak, and being well out of it on Tday.

 

Is that really time to pull triggers? Quick answer: yes.

 

If we go 4-5-1 in the upcoming 10 games before Thanksgiving we would be 9-12-1 and 19 poitns, or worse, having won 45.2% of our games. Based on the last two years, that would be good for 14th or 15th on Thanksgiving Day. And that's if we go 4-5-1, obviously anything worse would be....well worse.

 

I have postulated that realisically a team needs to be no more than 6 points out on Jan 1. (Yes, no team has made it 10 points out, but almost none at 9 games out, very few at 8 etc). 6 points out on Jan 1, would be estimated to be 45 points. Thus, at the worst, we need to have at least 45 points by Jan 1. This still leaves a lot of uphill climbing for the rest of the year.

 

If we go 4-5-1 over the next 10, then we end up a the 19 mentioned above and have 16 games (9 of which are on the road, and 9 of which are vs very good teams) left to get to 45. Thus we would need 26 points in 16 games (26 of 32 available points: .812). That is a near impossible pace (13-3). And that just gets us to the bottom of the hill that would need to be climbed Jan-April.

 

In reality then, even NHL .500 hockey over this homestand will almost surely not be enough, but yes, 4-5-1 or worse, leaves us essentially out of the playoff run on Thanksgiving Day. That is nuts, but true.

 

Best case, we use the 93 point cutoff (from years before last year) and assume we could climb in if we got to 7 games out by Jan 1. That is the bare minimum, realistically there is still a chance line. Thus to get to that point, and to have a small, but real shot, we would need to bet to 42 points by Jan 1. If we went 4-5-1 in the next 10, we would need 23 points in 16 games between then and Jan. 1: we would need a 70% win % or going 11-4-1. 

 

But that is the best case scenario from that point. The smart bet would still be against us. GMRF has to decide whether to hit the accelerator and go toward the playoffs knowing we would need to go 11-4-1 in a stretch that has us playing Rangers, Dallas, Anaheim, Pittsburgh, and Chicago all on the road, and Washington, Washington again, Montreal, and Florida at home, as half of our games. Tough to make that bet from there.

 

No. I'm sure if I can figure this out w/ 8th grade math our new math genius we hired has placed this type of analysis on Francis' desk.

 

I stick with it:

 

6-3-1 or better, over the next 10, or we probably are better to assume we miss again and plan accordingly.

Edited by remkin

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I never questioned anyone for not being a STH, don't do that. I know everyone is not in the position to do that, but support is another thing. At the last game my seats were the only seats filled in my whole row, and the row behind me had three people in it. Looking across the arena there were whole sections with only a few scattered people in them. They say we have 12 thousand people there, but there is much less than that by the looks of it. I haven't seen it this empty since the team first came here. I guess it's just freakin me out. I hope you're right about them going nowhere, I'll count on that.

 

Yeah, I freaked out too, and said so in the game thread.  I haven't seen it look like Sunday since 2001.

 

I want hockey to stay here.  I've gone through various STH plans, and am currently on a partial plan.  I love hockey.

 

I don't love $5 peanuts and $5 cokes.  Really?  Really?  Really?  

 

But you know what?  The last few years have really made me re-evaluate my priorities.  Unfortunately, the last lockout was a wake up call.  It got me looking at other stuff.  I think a lot of people forget about lockout 2012.  It was VERY damaging to markets like ours.

 

I discovered some other passions that Fall, and they haven't lost a grip on me.  Before 2012, I always thought: "If I move, I need to move to a city with NHL hockey."  It was that important.  Today, I don't care.  I've found other things that cost 10% or less of the cost of NHL hockey.

 

Now, give me a winner, and maybe my mind will change again.

 

One more thing: if the Canadian cities hate us so much and are willing to spend so much money to pay millions to sports "stars" -- they can have it.  I don't care.  There's more to life than the Jets and Evander Kane.  Oh wait.  That goes for Buffalo too, our "almost Canadian" city.   :)

Edited by wxray1

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So...

 

I made the claim: 4-5-1 or worse, and time to make big changes fast. This is based on sub .500, not even NHL .500 during our longest home streak, and being well out of it on Tday.

 

Is that really time to pull triggers?

 

Well, if that happened we would be 9-12-1 and 19 poitns, or worse, having won 45.2% of our games. Based on the last two years the best guess based on % points won over the last two years, that would be good for 14th or 15th only 1-2 points from last at Thanksgiving. And that's if we go 4-5-1, not if we do worse.

 

I have postulated that realisically a team needs to be no more than 6 points out on Jan 1. (Yes, no team has made it 10 points out, but almost none at 9, very few at 8 etc). 6 points out on Jan 1, would be estimated to be 45 points. Thus, at the worst, we need to have at least 45 points by Jan 1. This still leaves a lot of uphill climbing.

 

If we go 4-5-1 over the next 10, then we end up a the 19 mentioned above and have 16 games (9 of which are on the road, and 9 of which are vs very good teams) left to get to 45. Thus we would need 26 points in 16 games (26 of 32 available points: .812). That is a near impossible pace (13-3). And that just gets us to the bottom of the hill.

 

In reality then, even .500 hockey over this homestand will almost surely not be enough, but yes, 4-5-1 or worse, leaves us essentially out of the playoff run on Thanksgiving Day. That is nuts, but true.

 

Best case, we use the 93 point cutoff and assume we could get in if we got to 7 games out by Jan 1. That means at the bare minimum, to have a shot, we would need to bet to 42 points by Jan 1. If we went 4-5-1, we would need 23 points in 16 games: 70% win % or going 11-4-1. 

 

But that is the best case scenario. GMRF has to decide wether to hit the accelerator and go toward the playoffs needing to go 11-4-1 in a stretch that has us playing Rnagers, Dallas, Anaheim, Pittsburgh, and Chicago all on the road, and Washington, Washington again, Montreal, and Florida. 

 

No.

 

6-3-1 or better, over the next 10, or we probably are better to assume we miss again and plan accordingly.

Rem, i love all your stats, and your  passion... Keep it going. and the  island is not closed..

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I went to the Full Season Ticket Holder get together last night. I noticed a considerable low attendance.

I know some of it was it was a Monday night and the weather was probably part of the issue as well, but I found it really easy to meet the whole team last night, get autographs off all the players and had time to spare. A couple of the tables had long lines but for the most part, they weren't.

 

I understand the finance thing. I get it. I started out as a playoff run ticket holder in 2002 during the run to Stanley Cup Finals and have been a STH of some type since. I've done every plan they've offered except for the fan zone. I sit in 304. I remember my section being between $25-30 a game in 2002. Now their around $60. Price has more than doubled in 13 years. Is that an expected inflationary price? Plus they did hold the prices down for a number of seasons after we won the Cup.  With as many transplants that live in the area, we should no longer consider this a non-traditional hockey market. Nashville is just as "non-traditional" as we are. They've been able to put butts in the seats. I think their prices are pretty much on par with ours.  Columbus is technically in a more traditional market, but their struggles have been known as well.

 

Product on the ice has been fair (and I am being generous in that assessment) since 2009. They need us as fans to support this team. This season I see a small  glimmer of hope. Outside of 3 games so far this season, we've been competitive. It has been entertaining.

Edited by hopper915

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But you know what?  The last few years have really made me re-evaluate my priorities.  Unfortunately, the last lockout was a wake up call.  It got me looking at other stuff.  I think a lot of people forget about lockout 2012.  It was VERY damaging to markets like ours.

 

I love hockey too, but that needless lockout made me wake up and smell the coffee.  It honestly doesn't matter what I do as a fan, I'm always going to be at the mercy of what the whim of the owner decides.  Didn't we all know the owners were going to end up with a 50/50 split?  They started so ridiculously low because they knew they wanted to kill the season until the new year because that's when they start selling tickets and making money. 

 

That left a bad taste in my mouth, and has had an impact on my ticket buying decisions. 

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I've got a novel idea. How about a couple of home win streaks ?  I'll bet that would put some butts in seats. Fans will get the idea that they have better than a 50/50 chance of seeing a win in person. The upside is they will be happier and won't feel like they are throwing money into the toilet.

Edited by winger52

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Rem, i love all your stats, and your  passion... Keep it going. and the  island is not closed..

Thanks dinz, I pollished those posts up a little.

 

My bottom line, starting Friday and ending the day before Thanksgiving Day: 6-3-1 or better. Do it, and I'm in. Below 4-5-1 and it's blow up time. In between? Maybe-land.

 

Just our luck Dallas is hot, Pittsburgh is finding their game, NYR on the road, Minnesota, Anaheim, LA....it is going to take some doing.

Edited by remkin

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I don't think we have been exposed to the high power teams yet. Look at what happened when we played the Caps. We got owned. We just don't have the forward depth to compete against NYR, Wash, and Pitt....

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