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Hello,

My name is Jordan Staal. I will gladly restructure my contract if my brother Eric can come play here for a home discount of 7.5m a year on a 5 year term in 1 dollar unmarked Canadian bills because that is what Toronto will offer him and what the market will bare. What do ya say Ron?

 

After that awesome Rangers performance , no more than 3mil and no more than 2 years for any team not named Hurricanes. Toronto in serious rebuild and I think they pass.

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Jordan is under contract for 6 more years at $6 million per. He may have a no trade clause, but he does not have a MUST trade clause. I certainly hope RF will only consider a trade of Jordan if he truly believes it will make the Hurricanes a better team. No one forced Jordan to sign a 10 year contract. Eric certainly benefitted from a long term contract that paid him at a level exceeding his performance for the last few years. The Canes could not walk away from that commitment to Eric and Jordan has to fulfill his contract if he wants to play in the NHL.

This year, Jordan finally performed at the level the team expected when it made that 10 year commitment. I hope he still wants to be here to build on that season.

As far as Eric returning, if he understands his role, and will take a contract that is reasonable based upon at least the last 2 years' performance, both in money and term (no more than 2 years), then I guess it could work out. After his non-contribution to the Rangers prior to and in the playoffs, I can't imagine anyone will offer anything close to $7.5 million or a 5 year term. As far as him signing with Toronto, I thought they were going all in for Stamkos. How Eric's future works out will be interesting, but I can't see him back here (so he'll probably sign with us on July 2nd).

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Something is definitely up. Mountains, molehills, I don't care.

 

Jordan had two opportunities since the season ended to full-throatedly say, "I can't wait til next year." In neither case did he, and in neither case was he oxygen deprived (i.e., speaking after a game). The first was in the perfect venue to set things up on a positive note for next year, and he has been in the league more than long enough to know it. Two weeks later he gets another chance and opts to keep the drama coming.

 

These Staal boys--enough already. I hope if Ron has any inkling that J is trying to manipulate the situation, whether to lobby for Eric's return, to get the C, or to renegotiate his deal, Ron asks what teams he's willing to go to and says, "Thanks Jordan, this meeting is over."

 

Jordan's play this year was awesome. His behavior/comments since it ended have sucked.

Edited by top-shelf-1

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If Jordon is not fully committed to this team with no caveats then move him.  I am just 100% against him being the Captain, he's another introvert like his brother.  Whenever he is interviewed he stares hard at the floor while he talks with the little nanosecond glances at the reporter.  Thats lame.  He's been around long enough to have a better presence. Also, lets not forget that Jordan was pure crap the first half of the past season. And while no-one can hold his leg injury against him he was a mediocre Cane before his leg break.  Basically since he has been here he has had one excellent HALF season of hockey.  BFD.

 

For instant stability, credibility and the intangible of leadership we should try and sign David Backes out of St. Louis who's a UFA in July.  I think he's 31 and would be a help to the young guys on the Canes.  He scores, fights to change a games tempo, sticks up for teammates, something that can't be said of Jordan.

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"Go over a few things on the table and go from there"????

 

Whats is there to go over?  You have 6 more years on your mega contract, there should not be anything to discuss except:  He wants E back or he wants to request a trade.    I knew that the second E got traded, professional or not, He came here for a career beside his bro winning Stanley cups, that dream is done, he doesn't want  to be here taking over big bros sloppy seconds.

 

There is  Still a slim chance RF talks him into/makes him stay and stick it out for a year and see how it goes

.

I'm gonna predict we trade him for something we will all be very happy about.  He is our best trade bait anyway besides Faulk and maybe Skinner.  Lets just do it and move on from the Staal era.

At this point if he wants to stay he better make an announcement convincing everyone that he wants to retire a Hurricane and loves this team.

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As always I lead with "I think it all gets worked out and we move on with Jordan here."

 

If Jordan is upset that Eric was traded, I get that on an emotional level, but really, one does not have to think too deeply to see that there was really no choice. (Huge unfulfilled contract having been paid, major drop-off in production, went through multiple coaches, still wanted too much term, on a team trying to rebuild, the brothers had 4 seasons to get it done and missed the playoffs 4 times, etc).

 

Then Francis really seemed to handle the trade with deference and kit gloves effusively thanking Eric for accepting a trade to ONE team where his other brother was.

 

Then there is the practical matter. If Jordan wants out, why? But also, where? Does he harbor illusions that Francis will trade him to the Rangers (Marc) or WEEUP (wherever Eric Ends Up)? Both of those seem a bit of a stretch. If Francis were to trade Jordan, he needs a bigger market than two teams.

 

Maybe we're all missing something. Maybe the issue is something else. Who knows what might have happened along the way. And regardless of how the handling of Eric would seem to have been with major deference, who knows how Eric feels, and that could be seeping into this too.

 

I do think that Jordan is in a place where he is at a bit of a low emotionally. Missing the playoffs again, and having your brother traded.

 

But I also think that unless Jordan has a deep, almost unfixable desire to be away from here, he would be well served to meet with Francis, clear the air, and get back on board the Cane's train. As part B of a duo that was handed the keys to the kingdom, and collectively took the money and produced little, his reputation here could go south fast.

 

I think the guy sits at the precipice. An honest assessment of his first 3..5 years here is heavy to the "underperform" side. All while his brother clearly and majorly underperformed. Yet, an honest assessment of his final 4 months is one of a guy who found his game, played like an All Star, picked the team up, and is the single biggest reason we could at least pretend we were in the race for a while.

 

He is positioned to pick this team up, make it his, and emerge a hero. Or he could whine and look like a bit of a prima donna. He really could very easily go either way.

 

I hope he gets the bad taste out, whatever it is, refocuses and goes the hero route.

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chicken-little.jpg

I get the intended humor, and this pic is cute and funny--but it implies that I (and others) are "worried," about the J situation ("The sky is falling!").

 

I won't pretend to speak for the others but as far as I'm concerned, I couldn't care less, one way or the other, whether J stays or goes. I just want the (totally unnecessary) drama to end. I'm tired of this family holding our organization hostage, despite taking MILLIONS OF DOLLARS from it.

 

Jordan has now blown two chances to say the right things. Instead, he is being - in a word - a butt. "My big brother is gone! Waaaaaaah!" Grow up, play hockey LIKE YOU'RE BEING PAID EXTREMELY WELL TO, or take a freakin' hike. Let us know now, because we have more important things to do than coddle your crybaby a$$.

 

YOU'RE DONE, HOCKEY NAZI. 

 

b64c0df38cf0276b1deaeb6e8fa001df.jpg

 

NEXT!!!???

Edited by top-shelf-1

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Does he harbor illusions that Francis will trade him to the Rangers (Marc) or WEEUP (wherever Eric Ends Up)? Both of those seem a bit of a stretch.

Really? Cuz I think Magnitogorsk would be glad to have 'em both.

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At this point I'm excited about the idea of what return we could get for Jordan.   Just got to hope someone wants that huge contract for a 40-50point per  year guy.   Of course it helps his value tremendously that he is  one of the best defensive forwards in league.  If he stays than great too, he might be about to hit his prime or he might do the usual Staal slump half the year.  I definitely wont cry over losing a 45point guy that costs 6mil year.  

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I think we should keep in mind that J has made no public demands. His only reference to E was that he wasn't really happy with the trade. He has publicly stated there are "issues on the table" he and Francis will probable talk about but we have no ideas how big or small those issues are. 

 

Best case we go out and get another center and J stays.

Worst case we trade J and get another top 6 center.

 

I hope we get a clue after J and RF meet but we may never know what the issues are. Right now we are a better team with J than without him.

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I just think it's ridiculous we can even be seriously having this conversation, but while no, i wouldn't expect J to say "i'm glad the jackwagon is gone", i'd also expect a little more "i'm ready to lead this team to the playoffs next year" and a little less being 'uncomfortable' moving on without E and 'issues on the table' (granted they may not be about E, but right off i can't imagine what else they'd be).  "I'm gonna miss the big lug, but i'm here to play hockey".  Over and done.  I mean again, there are 20-something other Hurricanes who don't have brothers on the team and i don't hear RF saying he's giving them some time and then they'll discuss those issues.

 

If J is a happy camper and is excited about leading the Hurricanes to the playoffs next year, then jolly good.  If not, go ahead and trade him and a couple other JR projects for Malkin and be done with it.  You know JR would do his part to get big bubba there as well...

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. . .

I won't pretend to speak for the others but as far as I'm concerned, I couldn't care less, one way or the other, whether J stays or goes. I just want the (totally unnecessary) drama to end. I'm tired of this family holding our organization hostage, despite taking MILLIONS OF DOLLARS from it.

 

Jordan has now blown two chances to say the right things. Instead, he is being - in a word - a butt. "My big brother is gone! Waaaaaaah!" Grow up, play hockey LIKE YOU'RE BEING PAID EXTREMELY WELL TO, or take a freakin' hike. Let us know now, because we have more important things to do than coddle your crybaby *edit*.

. . .

 

Sorry top, but to my ears way more drama seems to be coming from these boards than from Jordan Staal.  Have you ever seen Billy Crystal's "night watchman" Saturday Night Live skit? 

 

Frankie: Boy. You wanna talk about some pain? I bought one o' them linoleum knives the other day, you know?

Willie: With the double edge?

Frankie: Right.

Willie: Yeah?

Frankie: So, I go home, you know, and I spread my toes apart and I just start sawing, back and forth and back and forth, you know?

Willie: Mm hmm.

Frankie: And I take a little thing o' Tobasco sauce, you know?

Willie: Yeah.

Frankie: And just dump it on there. Talk about a hotfoot, mister! Boy, that was rough.

Willie: Boy, that must smart.

Frankie: I know! I HATE when THAT happens.

 

:lol:

 

On a more serious note, the notion that any player is going to unduly influence Ron Francis to do something that's not in the best interests of the organization is at the bottom of my list of concerns this offseason.  Matter of fact, given RFs track record to date, I find the idea that a player might have the notion that they could do so to be relatively far fetched.  I think it's pretty clear that RF is in charge and everyone knows it.   

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Jordon has signed a long term maga deal to play what is in essence is play a kids game.  Just honor what he signed.  The Rage were on of the teams his brother agreed io be sent. Deals such as this happen in the NHL all the time.  If he is having fit because his brother is no longer here arrange for a trade

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I think it's pretty clear that RF is in charge and everyone knows it.   

Were it not for the NTC I'd agree with you. But just as it handcuffed RF with Eric, Jordan can play it the same way if he chooses--and based on his comments so far and his brother's behavior, I think caution based on that possibility is a whole lot more prudent than some vague belief that things will just work out.

 

We agree that RF is in charge. But that doesn't mean Jordan/Eric are not/will not try to leverage the situation to their advantage.

 

Let's say Jordan really has the team's best interests at heart. If that's the case, give me one good reason why, instead of saying everything is great and he's eager to take the next step next season, he has opted to play it this way, instead.

Edited by top-shelf-1

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If it ever came to trading Jordan, which again, I doubt, a couple of issues would be key.

 

1. How heavily would his December-March factor into his valuation? He was not far off a ppg during most of that time. But he started the year so offensively challenged that he only ended up at 48 points.

 

If you go by the year total, the return will not likely be in our favor.

 

2. How limited would his "approved teams list" be? Would it be down to the NYR and whatever team Eric ends up on? Is it more about leaving here and getting into a bigger market? Since he has the JR Special, full NTC, he would absolutely rule some teams out. How many would also determine the return.

 

Bottom line, the odds are pretty good that Jordan is worth a good deal more to us than he would bring in a trade. Unless there is a GM out there (JR?) who has a real J love. This could happen if anyone was paying close attention to what he did w/ two non star wingers from December-March.

 

Still, I think he is worth far more to us. He is still central to the "set it and forget it" line with him, Nesty, and Nordstrom that gives us a very very solid NHL line without using other talent on it. If he picks it back up w/ Nesty and Nordstrom, he could be 70 point player, while checking the top centers in the game, and freeing up other talented wingers for other lines.

 

I think he and Francis work through it, and I hope they do.

Edited by remkin

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I just think it's ridiculous we can even be seriously having this conversation

Exactly, and as the rest of your post suggests, we wouldn't be if Jordan had said the right things, instead of implying there are "unresolved issues." How anything can be unresolved between a guy under contract at $6 million a year until 2022 and the org that countersigned that same deal is beyond me.

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Were it not for the NTC I'd agree with you. But just as it handcuffed RF with Eric, Jordan can play it the same way if he chooses--and based on his comments so far and his brother's behavior, I think caution based on that possibility is a whole lot more prudent than some vague belief that things will just work out.

 

We agree that RF is in charge. But that doesn't mean Jordan/Eric are not/will not try to leverage the situation to their advantage.

 

Let's say Jordan really has the team's best interests at heart. If that's the case, give me one good reason why, instead of saying everything is great and he's eager to take the next step next season, he has opted to play it this way, instead.

 

What leverage? If RF doesn't do what Jordan wants, what are you implying that Jordan will do?

 

Play it what way? As OBX said above, "I think we should keep in mind that J has made no public demands. His only reference to E was that he wasn't really happy with the trade. He has publicly stated there are "issues on the table" he and Francis will probable talk about but we have no ideas how big or small those issues are."   J also said he understands that it's a business, said some pretty positive things about the org and where it's headed, and in the past said something along the lines that he's not tied at the hip to E.  So let me turn your question around: why would you (and others) jump to a worst case scenario as if Jordan had pulled a "Drouin"? 

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There are disgruntled players in the NHL every year, and the GM/Team reactions vary depending on the situation.

 

Two high profile disgruntled's last year were Drouin and Johansen. But there were others too.

 

Johanssen was traded. He had a contract. He was expected to play. But he didn't want to be in Columbus and at some point the GM ends up saying, "we don't want guys who don't want to be here".

 

The Drouin thing was a bit more unique, but still, Yzerman at least "tried" to trade him, and who knows, might still.

 

 

I don't think we've heard enough to think that there are anything close to irreconcilable issues w/ Jordan, but to think it's not possible, or that just because he has a contract that's the end of it, misses that fact that those things do happen, and that in the end GM's don't want guys who don't want to be here. 

 

If it ever gets even close to that level, we have a real issue. Until then, we have a speculation issue, which is a big part of our thing here.

 

 

 

Edit: I referenced Drouin before seeing Lake's post. I do not think Jordan would sit out, but there are other ways for players to mope and drag. In the end, I still think the issues end up resolved, but a guy does not have to go to the "Full Drouin" to push a trade. See Johansen.

Edited by remkin

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So let me turn your question around: why would you (and others) jump to a worst case scenario as if Jordan had pulled a "Drouin"? 

That's ridiculous. You can't turn a question around while ignoring the one on the table, Lake, which is simply this: If Jordan intends to be back and to give this team all he's got, why wouldn't he simply say, "Full speed ahead?"

 

Nobody's saying he's pulling a Drouin. But "play it what way"?? You really don't see anything here??

 

Maybe you missed it: The guy has had not one, but TWO chances, two weeks apart, to say the right things. Instead he has been very clear: there are "unresolved issues." When one of your top players is saying that, despite being under a long-term contract - well, is it really unreasonable to at least wonder what's going on? Or should we just ignore it?

 

I have every confidence that RF will handle whatever comes down the pike properly. I also have every confidence that proper handling will not include bowing to whatever "issues" Jordan (or any other contracted player) may try to inject into their business relationship with this org.

 

But I'm also confident that RF isn't just ignoring it when one of his top players is saying there are issues. Because I think Ronnie is smarter than that.

Edited by top-shelf-1

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Sure, speculating is what we do here.  My issue is that over speculation to the extreme negative has a practical effect that starts to border on character assassination even though that's not the intent. (granted, "over speculation" is a very subjective thing)

 

Here's an extreme if ridiculous example to illustrate the point: If Jordan Staal is beating his wife he should go to jail. If that statement weren't so ridiculous it would transmit an unjustified emotional smear of sorts to many people. Of course I don't think that's anywhere near to the speculation about the situation with Jordan and Eric.  I made it as extreme as possible so as to show the principle.

 

Top: no, I don't read anywhere near as much into Jordan's actions as you do.  I'm sure he would like his brother back. He's human with human emotions.  He said he likes the org, the city, and the direction of the franchise.  I don't see it as a black and white issue. I think the fact that the guy has understandable emotions about his brother doesn't necessarily mean he isn't 100% committed to the Canes. 

Edited by LakeLivin

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Top: no, I don't read anywhere near as much into Jordan's actions as you do. 

Please cite anywhere that I have said anything about what specifically he is doing. I don't know, and I don't pretend to.

 

My problem is that, given two chances to take a positive tone and act like a grown up, he has demurred. Pure and simple.

 

Saying "full speed ahead, can't wait for next year," etc., that would leave no doubt and give everybody something to be excited about next year. Instead, he has chosen not only to leave doubt, but to continue doing so, with his comment yesterday. Unprofessional at best, mealy-mouthed without question, and - if you intend to fulfill your contract - absolutely uncalled for, by any reasonable standard.

Edited by top-shelf-1

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That's ridiculous. You can't turn a question around while ignoring the one on the table, Lake, which is simply this: If Jordan intends to be back and to give this team all he's got, why wouldn't he simply say, "Full speed ahead?"

 

Nobody's saying he's pulling a Drouin. But "play it what way"?? You really don't see anything here??

 

Maybe you missed it: The guy has had not one, but TWO chances, two weeks apart, to say the right things. Instead he has been very clear: there are "unresolved issues." When one of your top players is saying that, despite being under a long-term contract - well, is it really unreasonable to at least wonder what's going on? Or should we just ignore it?

 

I have every confidence that RF will handle whatever comes down the pike properly. I also have every confidence that proper handling will not include bowing to whatever "issues" Jordan (or any other contracted player) may try to inject into their business relationship with this org.

 

But I'm also confident that RF isn't just ignoring it when one of his top players is saying there are issues. Because I think Ronnie is smarter than that.

 

To answer your question: because I don't see the issue as being absolutely binary.  I think Jordan can be committed to the team and still have an emotional response to his brother leaving.  Especially so soon after the fact.

 

And I'm not suggesting that it's something that we just ignore. Rather I'm suggesting that we don't act as if the worst case scenario is happening when in my opinion the evidence doesn't come close to suggesting that.

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To answer your question: because I don't see the issue as being absolutely binary.  I think Jordan can be committed to the team and still have an emotional response to his brother leaving.  Especially so soon after the fact.

 

And I'm not suggesting that it's something that we just ignore. Rather I'm suggesting that we don't act as if the worst case scenario is happening when in my opinion the evidence doesn't come close to suggesting that.

Non-answer. The question was: why WOULDN'T he simply say "full speed ahead"? 

 

I'm really not trying to push buttons or drag this out, Lake. But the guy has been in the league for 10 years. He's made two deep playoff runs. He's got a ring. He said himself that he knew there was a chance Eric would leave. He said himself that he is a professional and he has his own contract. He said himself "this is a business, I understand that." Really? So why are you raising doubts at all - let alone doing it in the media - if you truly have every intention of playing here next season?

 

And that's my point. He's sown doubt. RF's job now is to get an answer out of him, one way or the other. Doing so not only allows the org to move forward but also spreads the word: There's real management in Carolina. Do your job and uphold your contract and you'll be fine. Eff around with them and you'll be looking for work. 

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Please cite anywhere that I have said anything about what specifically he is doing. I don't know, and I don't pretend to.

 

My problem is that, given two chances to take a positive tone and act like a grown up, he has demurred. Pure and simple.

 

Saying "full speed ahead, can't wait for next year," etc., that would leave no doubt and give everybody something to be excited about next year. Instead, he has chosen not only to leave doubt, but to continue doing so, with his comment yesterday. Unprofessional at best, mealy-mouthed without question, and - if you intend to fulfill your contract - absolutely uncalled for, by any reasonable standard.

 

Top, I don't think you're doing it intentionally. But to me, the strength of some of your responses makes me wonder if you're actually open to the possibility that there might not be much there.

  • [your suggested response from RF]: "Oh, for crying out loud. You want dad to coach you, too? This isn't bantams, Jordan. Grow up or waive your NTC. We're trying to build something here, and if you're not 100 percent in, tell me now."
  • "My big brother is gone! Waaaaaaah!" 

And later, from another poster:  "If he is having a fit because his brother is no longer here arrange for a trade." Now maybe that's totally unrelated to your speculation. But is it possible that seed was subconsciously planted by your original speculation?  Even Dinz may not know for sure.  And that's my problem with speculating so much about worst case scenarios that involve someone's character.

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