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11 minutes ago, coastal_caniac said:

I wonder who the author of that blurb is?  Av's fans don't think much of Adran Dater's recent revelations.  Lot's of smoke though, which is normal when two teams seem to fit well for a hockey trade in the age of click bait.

CBS Sports

Here are five NHL trade rumors gaining steam as the March 1 deadline approaches by Cody Benjamin

 

Trade rumors are just that no matter who generates them but there is a lot of smoke. I'm thinking we don't make this trade but what do I know. If I'm the AVs I keep this rumor going to try and obtain my price be it from us or another club.

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Assuming that Faulk is truly in play for Duchene, and that by proxy, he'd be available in other trades if Francis thought those were better and available, which would you prefer:

 

  1. Faulk for Duchene straight up.
  2. Faulk for Landeskog straight up.
  3. Faulk for Draisaitl straight up.
  4. Faulk for RNH and Puljujarvi.
  5. Faulk for W. Nylander and 2017 1st round pick.
  6. Don' trade Faulk.

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1 hour ago, MinJaBen said:

Assuming that Faulk is truly in play for Duchene, and that by proxy, he'd be available in other trades if Francis thought those were better and available, which would you prefer:

 

  1. Faulk for Duchene straight up.
  2. Faulk for Landeskog straight up.
  3. Faulk for Draisaitl straight up.
  4. Faulk for RNH and Puljujarvi.
  5. Faulk for W. Nylander and 2017 1st round pick.
  6. Don' trade Faulk.

 

Off the top of my head, and without looking at things like contracts or exact ages, I'd say Draisaitl.  I'd love to get someone that projects as a franchise #1 center for the next decade.

 

But the combo of RNH and Puljujarvi would be pretty tempting as well, in large part due to Puljujarvi's potential ceiling. 

 

The only trade I might hesitate to make is the Nylander one, in large part because I don't see the Leafs 1st round pick this year as being as valuable as I'd want (supposed to be a weak crop, and Leafs stand a good chance of finishing in the top half of the league)

Edited by LakeLivin

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2 hours ago, MinJaBen said:

Assuming that Faulk is truly in play for Duchene, and that by proxy, he'd be available in other trades if Francis thought those were better and available, which would you prefer:

 

  1. Faulk for Duchene straight up.
  2. Faulk for Landeskog straight up.
  3. Faulk for Draisaitl straight up.
  4. Faulk for RNH and Puljujarvi.
  5. Faulk for W. Nylander and 2017 1st round pick.
  6. Don' trade Faulk.

Have to say no way do 3 or 4 happen from the Oiler's point of view, IMO. That said, all of them are intriguing and I'd take all of 1-5 probably. Not 6 though.

 

3. Draisaitl has already become all of that. Already on a near 70 point pace, big, center. If the Oilers didn't have McDavid, all they'd talk about it Draisaitl. I have coveted him for at least two years, but he has gone from basically untouchable to untouchable.

 

4. RNH and Puljujarvi. Frankly I would do Faulk for Puljujarvi straight up if we dropped back or out of things. Yes, Columbus sort of dissed him by picking DuBois ahead of him, and no, he isn't in the NHL at 18, but down in the AHL, and yes he only put up 8 points in the 28 games with the Oilers, BUT, he is up to .73 ppg in the AHL, and he just drips talent at 6'4" 203. Not sure I want RNH. If we got him, I'd probably trade him immediately. He is on a 40 point pace, but with a staggering team worst plus/minus that is in another zip code from the next worst guy.

 

5. W. Nylander and 2017 pick. This is intriguing, because I would not think of Toronto as a trading partner. W. Nylander is on a 56 point pace as a 20 year old though. Toronto's pick is likely a mid round pick in an off year draft, but still has value. I doubt they do it, but I'd do it.

 

 

I'd do 1-5, but if we could get Draisaitl for Faulk? Francis should win GM of the year on one trade.

 

It's really hard to see the non AVs trades happening, but good to think outside the box, because you know Francis is.

Edited by remkin

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7 hours ago, KJUNKANE said:

top and rem, I love your debate and see merits in both sides. As I see it, the term "grit", as likely does many concepts we banter around in these threads, has a unique meaning depending on who's using the term. To some, it might be the hulking presence frequently in the past known as an enforcer. Others might equate the term, not to size, but to a player capable of separating an opponent from the puck, no matter the physical size of the hitter. Another definition that can be seen is one who "has his teammates' back". I see "grit" applied to the player who goes into dirty corners and comes out with the puck, or one who refuses to be moved when he gets in front of the net? Maybe one associates the term with those players who sacrifice their bodies in front of 100mph shots?

 

Different combinations and permutations of all of those attributes are each of our mind's eye view of a "gritty player". I certainly can't answer who is my "gritty player", but what I do know, that for about as long as I can recall, our team, the Hurricanes, are epitomized as the antithesis of a "gritty team". Easy to play against, the "Candy Canes", etc are other synonyms for our guys.

 

The other thing I know is about as long as I've heard those derogatory terms used to characterize this team, I've also heard the complaint of "no net front presence".

 

The grittiness term crystalizes for me, when I see, 1st hand, a term which displays it on the ice in comparison to our guys. I mean, we get pinned into our D end for excruciatingly long periods of time, opposing players set up camp around Cam, our guys tire and invariably I see a goal against.

 

Now maybe this all points out that there needs to be  an entire team by in, as no single player can provide all these elements, but, like top I think if focusing on, I surely would like to see just one player who can be that factor in the paint, and be an unmovable presence in front of the opposing goalie. To me, and I'm forgetting the Red Wings' player who use to epitomize that, but when you have someone of that ilk, it exponentially increases a team's sniper's abilities. That is where I'd like to see our "grit".

 

You got me thinking, and I came up with 7 distinct things that can be thought of as tough or gritty:

 

1. The pure enforcer. This is pretty much gone from the league. The Goon, if you will. 

2. Goes the the areas. Corners, front of net. Digs hard, wins puck battles. We have a few of these for the corners, but not so much the net.

3. The Pest. Scraps, jaws, maybe hits a little, maybe slashes a little. Chad LaRose. Don't really have that guy.

4. The dirty player. Bad hits. Stickwork. The league is trying to get rid of these guys too.

5. Will fight. This a guy who is tough, but not a tough-guy. For the moment, you still have to have someone who will fight.

6. Makes huge hits. The only big hitter we have really is McGinn. We have lots of guys who hit, but not that soul crushing hit that Ruutu used to lay on people every now and then.

7. Blocks shots.

 

Really, #2, 6 and 7 can affect plays, but there aren't that many of those #6 guys. #1 and 4 are going away.  Not sure you need #3. We could probably have a few more of #5, this is the guy who will step up for his teammate. Eventually fighting will be gone and that won't be needed either. So really, it's 2, 6 and 7 that will remain, and teams do need guys who will do those things.

 

Edited by remkin

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Serious debate time.  Hall was traded for Larson straight up.  Faulk is way better than Larson.  Trading Faulk and getting anything less than a consistent  70 point /year player would be a complete and utter bust.  RHD men make good money.  RHD men who score up to 15 goals a season make big money and fetch a huge return.  I'm not sold on Faulk for Duchene is a fair deal and leans towards the AVS.  Lands for Faulk is highway robbery and it goes to the AVS.  It's either going to be a packaged deal or no trade at all.

Edited by bluedevil58

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I don't know BD58, Faulk sports a -81 lifetime plus/minus to Larsson's +22. That's over 100 more goals in Faulk's team's net.

 

Keeping the puck out of the net has to at least figure in a little for defenseman.

 

 

Edited by remkin
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Seems to me that a trade is a "dynamic event", dependent both on the circumstances at the time it takes place, and the traders. Attempting to predicate the value of one player or the other fails to account for events "in the moment" so to speak. How is one of the players performing at the time of trade, how credible are past performances and surely how desperate is one or the other teams, although I'm sure these GMs attempt not to be, all has to weigh in to a trade. Therefore I doubt that we can say: because A brought B therefore X brings Y.

 

Finally, as many have concluded, I'm not convinced Faulk is all that. 

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I don't think he is all that.  But I hope if it is a straight up trade for Duchene

  Then he will be the guy ripping howitzers from the blue line while on the PP.  Also, Larson had the benefit of Schneider where Faulk had Ward.  Kind of like comparing a Ferrari to a Yugo.

Edited by bluedevil58

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If there is any deal for Faulk / Hanifin  and a pick for Landeskog / Duchene and RF doesnt pull the trigger, he's nuts...no way we have that kind of talent in the hopper, thats remotely close...

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10 hours ago, bluedevil58 said:

Kind of like comparing a Ferrari to a Yugo.

It never ceases to amaze me how salesmen can justify any number. In their minds.  

 

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13 hours ago, bluedevil58 said:

I don't think he is all that.  But I hope if it is a straight up trade for Duchene

  Then he will be the guy ripping howitzers from the blue line while on the PP.  Also, Larson had the benefit of Schneider where Faulk had Ward.  Kind of like comparing a Ferrari to a Yugo.

You know, bluedevil58, I realize it seems that I'm picking on you, but I can assure you that isn't the case. On these trades, and I'll assure that I'm as sentimental as anyone on here, thus frequently regret giving up ANYBODY, but I think one has to be a bit pragmatic to the event. To make a point, I believe I've seen a post or 2 of yours(and if not, I apologize), but you seem to rue the trade of Eric Staal, just as the above suggests that you'd feel about trading Faulk? Now, to me for sure, Faulk is a little different bird than ES, in that Faulk is just a step below awesome in our system, just that I, as it seems others, feel he's somewhat challenged in the defensive area, though obviously an offensive jewel. Just, I think we can replace the latter, possibly not this year, but with some coming along in the pipelines.

 

Eric, on the other hand, seemed to have completely burned out in the circumstances of OUR SYSTEM, and further projected and influenced our developing youngsters with his laissez faire attitude. Now, that he seems to have rekindled a spark that we saw early in his career, I'm happy for him, I really doubt that would have occurred here?

 

My point is, that a trade has to be consummated based on the "here and now", If a GM, or any of us, views a trade retrospectively, regretting it because a player suddenly develops a unanticipated scoring touch, going from an also ran to a 1st liner, than I think very few trades are made?   

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14 hours ago, remkin said:

I don't know BD58, Faulk sports a -81 lifetime plus/minus to Larsson's +22. That's over 100 more goals in Faulk's team's net.

 

Keeping the puck out of the net has to at least figure in a little for defenseman.

 

 

I'd take it.  with Faulk gone we still have Slavin,Pesce,Hannifin, Fleury, Bean, Mckeown, Hainsey, Tennyson.  Duchene is a guaranteed 25goals or more and 55points or more.  That would be our leading scorer right next to Skinner and Aho. I'll take the extra offensive points and a 1st line center for Faulk.  Not mention I believe Duchene could(I believe) find an offensive partner to pair with that will make both players even more productive.  Lands point production has me on the fence, we need a guaranteed 25plus goal guy, nothing less at this point if we are giving up one of our top D guys/prospects.  

 

 

 

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41 minutes ago, RonnieFranchise said:

I am just a little curious about the availability and asking price for a Nugent Hopkins or a Jordan Eberle. Could Skinner be in play? Skinner is very talented but does he make the players or team around him better.

 

We are not at the point where we can get rid of Skinner's offensive production.  His production is needed.

Edited by JCLA

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25 minutes ago, RonnieFranchise said:

I am just a little curious about the availability and asking price for a Nugent Hopkins or a Jordan Eberle. Could Skinner be in play? Skinner is very talented but does he make the players or team around him better.

 

I am not super tuned into this, but what I've heard, and looking at stats, the asking price on both of these guys has to just keep dropping. RNH is just not getting much done, and talk about "not playing defense".  But Eberle might be a hidden value....

 

I'm not sure if you're suggesting Skinner for Eberle straight up, because that one I'd pass on. But as to trying to get Eberle? Maybe.

 

I know that he's been on and off the market for years, but lately I don't know for sure. I heard a couple of guys on Sirius/XM saying they wouldn't touch him, but he does keep putting points up. He has 2 more points and 2 better plus minus than Milan Lucic. And is #3 on the team after McDavid and Draisaitl. Still, his scoring has dropped back, and he's on a 45 point pace. Could he be in decline? That would be a key question. If not, then he could be an interesting pick up, depending on the price.

 

He's not really the elite guy, but if we could somehow get him without giving away the key guys, we would have dry powder for a bigger move later (off-season or next year).

 

Eberle is also interesting because his size, age, and career numbers actually match up surprisingly well with Duchene in points/game, goals/game and career plus minus on bad teams, are close to even. Eberle is 6 months older.

 

The question is what would it take, and who would you trade, and what would it take. Edmonton is in a playoff spot.

Edited by remkin

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1 hour ago, danimal-ch1 said:

I'd take it.  with Faulk gone we still have Slavin,Pesce,Hannifin, Fleury, Bean, Mckeown, Hainsey, Tennyson.  Duchene is a guaranteed 25goals or more and 55points or more.  That would be our leading scorer right next to Skinner and Aho. I'll take the extra offensive points and a 1st line center for Faulk.  Not mention I believe Duchene could(I believe) find an offensive partner to pair with that will make both players even more productive.  Lands point production has me on the fence, we need a guaranteed 25plus goal guy, nothing less at this point if we are giving up one of our top D guys/prospects.  

 

 

 

Doing mental math, adding a 25goals 55pt player and subtracting a 15goal 45pt player is the equivalent of adding a 3rd/4th liner.

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1 hour ago, RonnieFranchise said:

I am just a little curious about the availability and asking price for a Nugent Hopkins or a Jordan Eberle. Could Skinner be in play? Skinner is very talented but does he make the players or team around him better.

I sure hope not.  Skinner and Aho our only offensive bright spots. Skinner was amazing the first 30 or so games this year, his moves, puck handling, skating and determination were easily noticed.  He's fallen off a little.  That's why I believe someone like Duchene centering him could really boost his game and production. 

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10 minutes ago, PenaltyKiller17 said:

Doing mental math, adding a 25goals 55pt player and subtracting a 15goal 45pt player is the equivalent of adding a 3rd/4th liner.

I thought about that too.  However, what if that first line center helps our other talent light it up a little more?   A first line of Skinner Duchene Aho would be a true NHL first line.  We haven't had that in a while.  If those 3 find chemistry they could all be 30plus goal scorers. We got to do something and we got to give up something. Now you would have  Staal centering the second line and Rask centering the 3rd.  That's where they all truly belong IMO, which could boost everyones production a bit and ware down the other teams a lot more if we are rolling 3 centers(lines) in a row that are a serious scoring threat.  I'm good with Hannifin or Faulk straight up.  I would miss either of them and they would both go on to successful careers, but we are missing that piece badly.

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If Faulk for Duchene is on the table I think you have to take it.  We have players on the back end coming up who can fill in for Faulk.  I don't think we have anybody coming through that is going to be a Duchene.

Edited by JCLA
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40 minutes ago, PenaltyKiller17 said:

Doing mental math, adding a 25goals 55pt player and subtracting a 15goal 45pt player is the equivalent of adding a 3rd/4th liner.

 

This only works if you completely forget all the goals Faulk is responsible for against the Canes. His defense is bad this year and has been average at best over his career.

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4 minutes ago, danimal-ch1 said:

I thought about that too.  However, what if that first line center helps our other talent light it up a little more?   A first line of Skinner Duchene Aho would be a true NHL first line.  We haven't had that in a while.  If those 3 find chemistry they could all be 30plus goal scorers. We got to do something and we got to give up something. Now you would have  Staal centering the second line and Rask centering the 3rd.  That's where they all truly belong IMO, which could boost everyones production a bit and ware down the other teams a lot more if we are rolling 3 centers(lines) in a row that are a serious scoring threat.  I'm good with Hannifin or Faulk straight up.  I would miss either of them and they would both go on to successful careers, but we are missing that piece badly.

I don't foresee Duchene and Skinner on a line, for the same reason Staal/Skinner never really worked.  I think both players need the puck to be fully effective.  I think if he lives up to his potential, I could see Gauthier on a line with Duchene and Aho.  I think another question we should be asking ourselves is where Roy fits into our future plans.  Right now, I'd say he's Carolina's best prospect, and I think his style of play would fit perfectly with Skinner.  If he's in the plans, would that make Rask available?

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