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OBXer

In-Season Talk 2016-17

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3 hours ago, OBXer said:

It was a bit out of character the way BP called out Lack. I'm sure some frustration is showing but in the end he said what we all have been thinking. He called out a player that had been given multiple chances over two seasons to grab the crease. If he hurt his feelings, too bad. Peters has stuck with these guys in trying times and he had enough. Good on him! 

Don't disagree but BP needs to show cajones and do it to others including his 'stars'. He looks lame by waiting this late in the year to pick on one person and then its the back up goalie. BP needs to look in the mirror and rip himself a new one for the teams lack of fight and inconsistency.

 

By the way whatever happened to the vaunted Firemans helmet??

'

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3 hours ago, remkin said:

 

 

He now has immense cap space. More picks by far than any other team, and a bevy of top D prospects. He simply MUST make that move this offseason, even if it is the dreaded overpay. If you are missing one or two key pieces, and have ton of cap space, is one or even two slight overpays, that huge? If it brings the key piece?

 

Add even one elite name to the top of that forward core and everyone else slides down, with Gauthier, Roy, KK and whoever we get at the top of the draft this year in the wings.

 

 

This has been my take all along!! Sometimes you need to overpay and if you can afford it go for it! Playoff revenue can do wonderful things for the bottom line. Let's see if RF can pry either of Landeskog/Duschene/ away from Sakic, Bishop is still an UFA, TJ Oshie wouldn't hurt the team and god knows he would help the shoot out portion of our woes. There are several very good RFA' but that's another story.

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3 hours ago, LakeLivin said:

My suspicion is that it ties into perceived work ethic.  Lack seems to have a "happy go lucky" personality and I can't imagine anything ticking Peters off more than if he thinks a player isn't working hard.  Pure speculation on my part, but something is up given how out of character it is for Peters, and it doesn't seem likely to me that it was based on just the one game.

Haven't seen him this hot since the Semin days. He tends to get pissed when someone doesn't work hard.

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26 minutes ago, raleighcaniac said:

 

 

By the way whatever happened to the vaunted Firemans helmet??

'

It;s been hosed after multiple locker room fires.

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4 hours ago, remkin said:

 

We are now officially the youngest team in the NHL. We have at least 3 potentially high end forward prospects and several on the edge guys. We have defensive depth that is insane. There is a framework, but we need to add to it. We need a legit #1 goalie, and at least one proven, high end forward. There are 3 positions that haunt teams for years if they are vacant: goalie, #1 Dman, top line forward (typically the 1C). I think Slavin is getting close to the #1 Dman, and Hanifin will be there too.

 

So, clearly, we lack that elite forward (or two) and that stud goalie.

 

Really, I think the rest is there.

 

 

We need big physical players.  Just look at Toronto, Edmonton, and few other teams that haven't made playoffs in a while.  Toronto>Matt Martin, Edmonton>Milan Lucic, Zack Dassian, Patrick Maroon. The Caps have Tom Wilson who plays on the penalty kill and pitch in with some goals.  Nashville was floundering around up to mid season and trades for Cody McLeod and Nashville took off and in the playoff race. These are kind of players that will go to the net and screen the goalie.  The Canes players now very seldom will do that and we don't a big defense man to clear out in front of Ward also.  Hockey is a physical game and we need a few big physical players. 

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1 hour ago, top-shelf-1 said:

 

 

 Eddie pissed somebody (read: Bill Peters) off early this year, probably by speaking out when he didn't get the same chances in "the goalie competition" that Cam did. But you know what? He's getting them now, when there is almost zero pressure on, and stinking up the place. FOUR goals on 16 shots? Really Eddie? Maybe you need to make fewer commercials and posts to Twitter and start being a pro--or get outta town, and take your tacos with you.

What do they do with this guy? 3 mil is a good chunk of change for next year. Do they throw him into a packaged deal in the off season? Do we eat the salary? I can't see anyone wanting the Taco Man. If we are to pursue a goalie in the off season Lack has to go.

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45 minutes ago, playruffcaniac said:

We need big physical players.  Just look at Toronto, Edmonton, and few other teams that haven't made playoffs in a while.  Toronto>Matt Martin, Edmonton>Milan Lucic, Zack Dassian, Patrick Maroon. The Caps have Tom Wilson who plays on the penalty kill and pitch in with some goals.  Nashville was floundering around up to mid season and trades for Cody McLeod and Nashville took off and in the playoff race. These are kind of players that will go to the net and screen the goalie.  The Canes players now very seldom will do that and we don't a big defense man to clear out in front of Ward also.  Hockey is a physical game and we need a few big physical players. 

I don't disagree. We need a reworking that brings a couple of gritty physical guys in too. But no amount of grit will put the puck in the net enough times to matter if we don't get the high end forward or two.

 

Every year we go through this debate. We aren't tough enough and we don't score enough. Probably both are true but scoring is more important. We weren't any tougher when we had it going this year but we were scoring and winning. Every year since the lockout, we have been woefully short of the needed Goals For to make the playoffs, let alone contend for the cup.

 

Bottom 5 Goals for:

 

26. Carolina Hurricanes

27. Detroit RedWings

28. Vancouver Canucks

29. New Jersey Devils

30. Colorado Avalanche

 

Top 5 Goals for:

 

1. Pittsburgh Penguins

2. Washington Capitals

3. Minnesota Wild

4. NY Rangers

5. Columbus Blue Jackets

 

Offense correlates with playoffs better than defense. (We are #14 in defense). The only team in the top half in scoring that is not in the playoffs or right at the cut line is Dallas. But they are #1 worst team in the league in goals against, and only #11 in offense.

 

Right now the top 6 teams in the East are at an average goals for: 191, Top 6 in West: 186: Canes: 151.

 

We've had this debate before too. I am not saying that grit and defense are not needed. I am saying that adding grit and sandpaper and tough, will not make this a playoff team, while adding scoring will. Also, at this point, we are already in the top half on defense, and that is stocked for the future.

 

Add toughness, yes. Even though it is a smaller part of the game than it used to be, we need more of it. But add more scoring too. Do both, but the greatest of these is, by far, scoring.

Edited by remkin
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34 minutes ago, remkin said:

 

We've had this debate before too. I am not saying that grit and defense are not needed. I am saying that adding grit and sandpaper and tough, will not make this a playoff team, while adding scoring will. Also, at this point, we are already in the top half on defense, and that is stocked for the future.

 

Add toughness, yes. Even though it is a smaller part of the game than it used to be, we need more of it. But add more scoring too. Do both, but the greatest of these is, by far, scoring.

I agree we need scorers. Need some that will go to the net, fight for rebounds, screen goalies. There are players that play tough and score also. Wayne Simmonds, Lucic. Look at Ovechkin of the Caps, leads the league in goals scored and will hit anything moving. Someone like a Brad Marchand would help the team. Ron Francis said last year he wanted to get bigger and more physical.  

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19 minutes ago, playruffcaniac said:

I agree we need scorers. Need some that will go to the net, fight for rebounds, screen goalies. There are players that play tough and score also. Wayne Simmonds, Lucic. Look at Ovechkin of the Caps, leads the league in goals scored and will hit anything moving. Someone like a Brad Marchand would help the team. Ron Francis said last year he wanted to get bigger and more physical.  

 

I really do agree. I thought of Lucic when he left the Bruins and the Kings. A couple of years ago, I led the call for a gritty winger who could score. We have yet to find that guy. We definitely could use him. In fact, trading a guy like TT, for a guy like that, is a possible move.

 

We do have a couple of gritty wingers with the possibility of becoming scorers in PDG and McGinn, but neither has become a consistent top 6 type scorer yet. Also, while both guys play hard on the boards and lay hits, they are not instigator or drop the gloves guys.

 

We do have a couple of guys in the pipeline who could fit the bill. Gauthier is a huge specimen with what I see as very high end skill, and Roy is massive with good skill.

 

But a couple of under the radar guys are David Cotton (really big and lighting it up for BC), Spencer Smallman, and Matt Filipe. In terms of grit and sandpaper and work ethic and "heavy game", Smallman and Filipe fit that exact description, especially Smallman.

 

As luck would have it, I turned on Prospect Radio and they were talking about a gaggle of our later round picks from the last 2 years with Tony MacDonald. I offer my recollection of the comments on 6 guys (including Cotton, Smallman, and Filipe) and my thoughts here: (scroll to the last post): http://fans.hurricanes.nhl.com/community/topic/23777-ranking-the-prospects-an-ongoing-effort/  

Edited by remkin

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56 minutes ago, remkin said:

 

I really do agree. I thought of Lucic when he left the Bruins and the Kings. A couple of years ago, I led the call for a gritty winger who could score. We have yet to find that guy. We definitely could use him. In fact, trading a guy like TT, for a guy like that, is a possible move.

 

We do have a couple of gritty wingers with the possibility of becoming scorers in PDG and McGinn, but neither has become a consistent top 6 type scorer yet. Also, while both guys play hard on the boards and lay hits, they are not instigator or drop the gloves guys.

 

We do have a couple of guys in the pipeline who could fit the bill. Gauthier is a huge specimen with what I see as very high end skill, and Roy is massive with good skill.

 

But a couple of under the radar guys are David Cotton (really big and lighting it up for BC), Spencer Smallman, and Matt Filipe. In terms of grit and sandpaper and work ethic and "heavy game", Smallman and Filipe fit that exact description, especially Smallman.

 

As luck would have it, I turned on Prospect Radio and they were talking about a gaggle of our later round picks from the last 2 years with Tony MacDonald. I offer my recollection of the comments on 6 guys (including Cotton, Smallman, and Filipe) and my thoughts here: (scroll to the last post): http://fans.hurricanes.nhl.com/community/topic/23777-ranking-the-prospects-an-ongoing-effort/  

Rem, If you can trade TT for a big physical scorer, you wouldn't be GM of the year, you would be the bamboozeler of the year.

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43 minutes ago, caniac6 said:

Rem, If you can trade TT for a big physical scorer, you wouldn't be GM of the year, you would be the bamboozeler of the year.

:letssee:. Might have to sweeten the pot, depending on the player in question. But TT is skilled, 40 points pace, and even though he's not at all physical, his plus/minus is not bad (#7 on the team) and he's not in his prime yet.

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5 hours ago, playruffcaniac said:

We need big physical players.  Just look at Toronto, Edmonton, and few other teams that haven't made playoffs in a while.  Toronto>Matt Martin, Edmonton>Milan Lucic, Zack Dassian, Patrick Maroon. The Caps have Tom Wilson who plays on the penalty kill and pitch in with some goals.  Nashville was floundering around up to mid season and trades for Cody McLeod and Nashville took off and in the playoff race. These are kind of players that will go to the net and screen the goalie.  The Canes players now very seldom will do that and we don't a big defense man to clear out in front of Ward also.  Hockey is a physical game and we need a few big physical players. 

I've echoed this in the past in my case for us to get more physical. This doesn't mean we become goons on skates. These are the teams that go far into the playoffs and can handle physical play thrown back at them. I wanted us to nab Francois Beauchemin from Anaheim before the Avs nabbed him. We could use a Lucic or Dustin Byfuglien style player too. This would compliment our speed and make us better rounded.  Either way I see us as a pretty soft team and we should address that.

Edited by surfzone365

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All this can be over-analyzed to death with numbers and stats and that's fine. 

 

All you really need to win are guys who refuse to lose and bring the rest along with them.  These players can be found in all shapes, sizes, and colors.

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16 hours ago, slapshot02 said:

What do they do with this guy? 3 mil is a good chunk of change for next year. Do they throw him into a packaged deal in the off season? Do we eat the salary? I can't see anyone wanting the Taco Man. If we are to pursue a goalie in the off season Lack has to go.

Expose him and hope Vegas takes him. Eddie seems perfect for Tinsel Town. Otherwise yeah, package him, or it's off to the AHL ECHL.

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20 minutes ago, top-shelf-1 said:

Expose him and hope Vegas takes him. Eddie seems perfect for Tinsel Town. Otherwise yeah, package him, or it's off to the AHL ECHL.

 

So Vegas will choose between these four for us:

 

Stempniak

Nordstrom

Dahlbeck

Lack

 

who do you choose?  Im picking Stempniak all day.  We'll be stuck with Lack.

Edited by gocanes0506

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15 hours ago, remkin said:

I don't disagree. We need a reworking that brings a couple of gritty physical guys in too. But no amount of grit will put the puck in the net enough times to matter if we don't get the high end forward or two.

As you know, this is my argument for Landeskog. Even if it means overpaying a bit, he's a trifecta of the things we need: he hits, he leads, and he puts up points. He's been at a 20-or-more goal pace in every year in the league, and just look at the assists. Plus the I don't see the fall-off that has concerned some isn't there others do. He missed 7 games last year, and if you extrapolate his numbers across those games, he finishes with 58 points last year. That's an average of 60 per game across his first three (full) seasons. This year is definitely off, but he's also playing on a team the coach abandoned a month before camp. 

 

2012–13 Colorado Avalanche NHL 36 9 8 17 22
2013–14 Colorado Avalanche NHL 81 26 39 65 71 7 3 1 4 8
2014–15 Colorado Avalanche NHL 82 23 36 59 79
2015–16 Colorado Avalanche NHL 75 20 33 53 69

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1 minute ago, gocanes0506 said:

 

So Vegas will choose between these four for us:

 

Stempniak

Nordstrom

Dahlbeck

Lack

 

who do you choose?  Im picking Stempniak all day.  We'll be stuck with Lack.

You're probably right. But the ECHL works for me. Send him down and let him pull a Babchuk.

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11 minutes ago, winger52 said:

So who will we bring in next season to blame the flop on?

 

Mr. State Fair.

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Eddie has four goals against in the game with Tampa ( 18th in the league ) and gets a public lashing from Peters. Cam has four against Arizona ( 29th in the league ) and there is silence from Peters. I think somebody has lost control. Either his emotions or the team. 

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2 minutes ago, winger52 said:

Eddie has four goals against in the game with Tampa ( 18th in the league ) and gets a public lashing from Peters. Cam has four against Arizona ( 29th in the league ) and there is silence from Peters. I think somebody has lost control. Either his emotions or the team. 

 

How about BP tearing a strip off of Lindholm?  I know he's playing well, but ooooh maaan, that missed open net just set a really bad tone.

 

BP preached that Eddie didn't make timely saves.  Well our forwards can't make timely open net goals.

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There's def more to the Lack thing than meets the eye. Bottom line, he's not BP's type of player, whatever the reasons may be--and if the choice is between BP's judgment and Eddie's "personality," I'm siding with BP every time.

Edited by top-shelf-1

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25 minutes ago, winger52 said:

Eddie has four goals against in the game with Tampa ( 18th in the league ) and gets a public lashing from Peters. Cam has four against Arizona ( 29th in the league ) and there is silence from Peters. I think somebody has lost control. Either his emotions or the team. 

Winger, I'm not a Cam apologist, and while I haven't seen either game completely, we all know that of any player on the ice, the goalie's game is a reflection of the TOTAL body of work from the team on any given night. Additionally, we have no way to know how long this angst has been brewing between BP and Lack? As top just pointed out, I'm hopeful Peters is using this as a motivational thing than that he's "lost the team" and trust his judgement in this affair.

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Every year there is a minimum amount of offense you need to make the playoffs, and another, higher, minimum amount of offense you need to contend for the cup. Every year in recent memory we are not just short of that number, but well short of both of them.

 

If a Captain, or a guy with heart and fortitude and work ethic and all of that, can account for  A big chunk of the needed  about 30 more goals,  or if we get a different guy for each role, Fine with me. 

 

If we can find a guy to do both, and maybe Landeskog is that guy, then we check both boxes. I think we will need more offense than Landeskog is likely to bring, but we can try to get that elsewhere. At least we'd be closer.

Edited by remkin

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