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To Trade, or not to trade

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The only way I can see RF trading for Tavares now (as compared to pursuing him in FA or as a potential rental at the trade deadline) is via a sign and trade.  Even if we could get him for the rest of the season, I wouldn't give up the assets that would require unless it was guaranteed he'd be signed with us going forward.  JT isn't a backup goalie who you stand a good chance of re-signing by dangling a nice contract and a promotion to #1.  And while the Canes do have some nice things going for them, I think anyone objective would have to admit the franchise also has a bunch of negatives that offset some of those positives.  In other words, while we may not be the least attractive destination in the league, you'd be hard pressed to convince me we'd be one of the most desirable to one of the most sought after pending UFAs in a while, either (at least one who has a decent chance of hitting the open market).

 

Now, if you can lure JT into a sign and trade and work out a mid season deal with the Isles, I don't know that anyone should be off the table except maybe Slavin and Aho (age/potential ratio).  Top, I hear your rationale for wanting to move Jordan, but regardless of how much anyone agrees of disagrees with those, what would you realistically put the odds at of Jordan being willing to waiving his NTC for a move to the Isles?  To me he seems pretty invested in the Canes franchise.

 

So, if a sign and trade for Tavares isn't in the works, that leaves me with the question of whether the Canes should:

  1. keep most of their powder dry for a run at Tavares as a UFA
  2. go after a lesser young center like ROR or RNH for the remainder of the season and beyond, but might rule out pursuit of a (potential) UFA Tavares because of the assets we'd have to give up 
  3. go after an older decent scoring forward to help this season and hold down the fort for another year or 2 as our yutes percolate up (would cost less than a young stud)

The answer might depend on what's available as much as what would be preferable, but I do hope that RF is working the phones instead of hoping that we've currently got enough firepower to make the playoffs this year.

Edited by LakeLivin

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18 minutes ago, LakeLivin said:

I wouldn't give up the assets that would require unless it was guaranteed he'd be signed with us going forward. 

Agree completely, and based on what we've seen of RF, I don't think he would either. Sure would be a nice splash for Dundon. 

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32 minutes ago, LakeLivin said:

what would you realistically put the odds at of Jordan being willing to waiving his NTC for a move to the Isles?  To me he seems pretty invested in the Canes franchise.

As of now I'd put it at "don't know if you don't ask him." He'd be closer to his brother Mark, and we know it's a close family. Maybe he'd jump, maybe he wouldn't; he'd have the same contract terms, and it's a deal that gives the Isles more options than the one I'm sure JT will want.

 

Assume for a moment Jordan will go. The question, I would guess, is whether JT is going to insist on a full NTC for the full term of his next deal. If so, RF may not be interested. My hope is that the org never gives anybody other than the franchise player a full NTC, and that even if it does, it doesn't last beyond the guy's 32nd birthday.

Edited by top-shelf-1

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I've also been a long time foe of the NTC. But to entice Tavares to come to Raleigh? I have to thing he's getting a NTC wherever he goes. 

 

Most players would not jump to come to a small market team with a recent history of losing and playing to an empty building. But we do have a niche that would at least give us a chance. We are the most player friendly market in the NHL according to Rod Brind'Amour. If you want a relatively stress-free NHL life, and raise a family in a low key city, we're it. If you combine that with a new owner and a team on the rise? It could be appealing. And the attendance is building and would shoot up if Tavares signed and we won. 

 

If Tavares comes here, he has the potential to be the biggest Cane in history as he takes this young team into years of cup contention. He would be the legend rather than a legend. He definitely wants to win, but this team is on the cusp without him, and has a deep system. It would all suddenly be good here right as he came on board. 

 

We also have Jordan to take on the other team's top line. 

 

So I'm saying there's a chance.

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1 hour ago, LakeLivin said:

 

 

So, if a sign and trade for Tavares isn't in the works, that leaves me with the question of whether the Canes should:

  1. keep most of their powder dry for a run at Tavares as a UFA
  2. go after a lesser young center like ROR or RNH for the remainder of the season and beyond, but might rule out pursuit of a (potential) UFA Tavares because of the assets we'd have to give up 
  3. go after an older decent scoring forward to help this season and hold down the fort for another year or 2 as our yutes percolate up (would cost less than a young stud)

The answer might depend on what's available as much as what would be preferable, but I do hope that RF is working the phones instead of hoping that we've currently got enough firepower to make the playoffs this year.

I vote for the most realistic, option 3.

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45 minutes ago, sleekfeeder said:

Who here thinks Skins is going to re-up after next season?

 

I think it depends in large part on what happens over the course of the next year.  Canes are at the corner: do they make the turn, or not?  Even if we don't make the playoffs this year, if we're solidly in contention next season (and I don't mean just for a Wild Card spot), I could see him wanting to stay.  He's as aware of our youth and pipeline as much as anyone. 

Edited by LakeLivin

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2 hours ago, sleekfeeder said:

Who here thinks Skins is going to re-up after next season?

I have zero doubt he does. (Quick, somebody cue the waa waa waaaaaaaa...)

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4 minutes ago, top-shelf-1 said:

I have zero doubt he does. (Quick, somebody cue the waa waa waaaaaaaa...)

Just making sure. I'm preparing a blockbuster.

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2 hours ago, remkin said:

I've also been a long time foe of the NTC. But to entice Tavares to come to Raleigh? I have to thing he's getting a NTC wherever he goes. 

I don't doubt this. I just want a graduated decline in its protection for the player as he ages out, whomever it might be. Full NTC til 32, submit a 10-team list between age 32 and 36 if requested. I don't think that's asking too much.

 

So the (wholly theoretical) question becomes: Would you trade Jordan for JT right now, and/or up to the TD (assumes the Canes are in the mix or on the bubble), if he is the price the Isles demand?

Edited by top-shelf-1

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1 minute ago, top-shelf-1 said:

I don't doubt this. I just want a graduated decline in its protection for the player as he ages out, whomever it might be. Full NTC til 32, submit a 10-team list from between 32 and 36 if requested. I don't think that's asking too much.

 

So the (wholly theoretical) question becomes: Would you trade Jordan for JT right now, and/or up to the TD (assumes the Canes are in the mix or on the bubble), if he is the price the Isles demand?

If it was a trade and sign, I would if Jordan would wave his NTC, but it would not be the deal I'd want to make. 

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Just now, remkin said:

If it was a trade and sign, I would if Jordan would wave his NTC, but it would not be the deal I'd want to make. 

Understood. Thx.

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Senators are moving

supposedly only Karlsson and Stone are the only two untouchables.

 

Brassard and Hoffman makes sense.  Either one would be good additions.  Interesting to see how quickly this happens.  

 

I really hope GMRF jumps on this quickly.  Pens, Rangers, and Blue Jackets are all looking for offense.  We'll be sucking if those 3 grab up the better available Senators quickly.  

 

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Rethinking that last part of my thinking, and as much as I as well as apparently several others salivate over a top 6 center, wonder if Hoffman might be the better of the 2 strictly because of his PP expertise? He's younger and plays left wing. Also, a knock on him seems to be his defense, which could influence Peters' order of these 2 guys, but just spitballing here, if our PP could become more dangerous because of Hoffman's presence, could that be enough to get us over the hump?

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9 hours ago, KJUNKANE said:

Rethinking that last part of my thinking, and as much as I as well as apparently several others salivate over a top 6 center, wonder if Hoffman might be the better of the 2 strictly because of his PP expertise? He's younger and plays left wing. Also, a knock on him seems to be his defense, which could influence Peters' order of these 2 guys, but just spitballing here, if our PP could become more dangerous because of Hoffman's presence, could that be enough to get us over the hump?

I still go with Brassard due to his net front presence and strengthening us down the middle. A Brassard/Staal combo would make us potent in the middle.

In Season 2017-18 Talk

slapshot02 replied to gocanes0506's topic in Hurricanes Talk

I think RF could accomplish this without the high end 1C we are all looking for.Since they are not available why not look at a proven vet who could center the top six and make his line mates better around him. Doesn't have to be that huge point producer along with a huge contract but someone who offers consistency. I've seen rumors about Derick Brassard possibly going back to the Rangers or CBJ and he doesn't have a huge contract...

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35 minutes ago, sleekfeeder said:

I'm concerned that by the time all the dust settles, it may be too late.

I'm not privy to the legality of Drudon being able to make a move now but I don't see why something can;t be done now if PK an TD agree on a move. Why can't PK make the move and TD/PK worry about the internal dollars later?

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1 hour ago, slapshot02 said:

Why can't PK make the move and TD/PK worry about the internal dollars later?

I suppose. I guess it just depends on how aggressive this new management arrangement is. 

 

Wow Brassard put up 27 in his final year with the Rangers. That would be nice to bring that level of goal scoring. 

Edited by sleekfeeder

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I would think if PK and Drundon agree a move could be made. I suppose a big salary might affect the closing somehow, but I can't imagine they couldn't figure that out pretty easily. It could also be that Drundon wants to be seen as the one coming in and making moves as the majority partner, make it clear he's the man.

 

This team seems to be doing things a bit better on the ice, and is knocking on the door. Getting that one piece we've been pining for could be the difference, assuming Darling remembers how to stop the puck at some point. Another minor thing is that there is an advantage to getting a guy well before the trade deadline. One, you get more games with that person to affect the regular season, and two, it often takes guys a while to adjust to a new team/system, and the more time the better.

 

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I do like the idea of picking a piece off of a falling team. Brassard is solid, and plays center, but I like Hoffman better because he is better and scores more, which, BTW we still need. Hoffman is a top 60 point producer, and a top 50 goal scorer. Very solid first liner and a big upgrade. Hoffman's last three years before this year's team troubles was also a plus 34. May not be a great stat, but still warms me up knowing it.

 

Brassard has the advantage of being cheaper, and more flexibility in that he's only signed for one more year after this. Brassard has put up 60 points before, and is at .65 ppg this year, so he is a major upgrade from Rask, so I'm still smiling if we can get him, but not smiling as widely. Hoffman is a bigger step up and a legit first liner.

 

Hoffman would really be added for the longer term. He's younger and signed for an extra year (3 total). We are getting peak Hoffman.

 

I know disparaging current players is not always pc here, but if we added Hoffman, and needed cap or budget space to sign the dream, Tavares, we could trade Rask for whatever and clear almost the same amount of salary out. Also, if I'm JT and this team that is already on the cusp adds Hoffman, that's another guy for me to play with in Raleigh that is a legit first liner, and another sign that this team is seriously going places.

 

One other thing. Both guys play in a lock down trapping system. When I look at how Kyle Turris flew once he got out of that "wing clipping" place, I do think both Brassard and Hoffman might produce even more once freed from that. This makes me really like the idea of either of them. But I go Hoffman.

 

Of course, as with all trades it comes down to price. If we can get Brassard without giving up a major player, then he could well be the better option: Rask plus non roster considerations would be pretty good.

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