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To Trade, or not to trade

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Marner would be a great addition but he doesn’t solve our issues. He is a bigger Aho.  He has great smarts but isn’t much for getting physical. He is a play maker as well. 

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2 hours ago, danimal-ch1 said:

It seems Lindholm and Rask will never be what we hoped they would be(several seasons of waiting for one of them to break out, its getting ridiculous). 

Lindholm is about to turn 23, Rask 25. If either of them had the hat trick last night, would you still be trading them?

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I missed the part the part where I said we shouldn’t do it.  I only said he doesn’t solve our issues at the moment. Which we could solve with another trade. Read it like you want.

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10 hours ago, Cane_Addict2 said:

Long time no post... been about 8 years. Was Cane_Addict previously but forgot the password. Followed the boards since just without commentary.

 

Two things: glad to see we finally played a physical game for the first time this year. Even a few minor scrums. I cant help but think BP told the team this needed to be done. Very noticeable compared to the team that dodged contact and let up on hits regularly.

 

Couple that with the fact that we finally had a net-front presence and look what happened.... screens, redirects, and goals! How about that! Definitely need to keep that presence if we want to keep the goals coming.

 

Secondly: Luke DeCockVerified account @LukeDeCock 14h14 hours ago

Big crowd of NHL scouts (by November standards) at PNC for Canes-Stars: BOS, TOR, WSH, CHI, PHL, LAS, WPG, ARZ.

 

"Unusual" according to Luke.

Welcome back on Cane Addict.

 

On your second point we trade a lot with Chicago, and Toronto wants D and has O, and only Washington is in our division. I'm guessing that Francis picked up the phone a lot prior to our recent run when goals were few and things were close to getting off the rails, and this is an extension of that. He may be a bit less eager now, but the right move could still put us over the top.

 

Trying to predict anything on trades is almost pointless. Just ask Eklund. So much smoke, so little fire. I would think though, with Turris and Duchene off the market that Toronto might have what we're looking for up front (we need high end scoring), and they need D. There has been a bit of smoke around a trade between us and Toronto.

 

Boston has substantial injury problems and is fading in the standings. Philly also falling back to Earth. I do think that the whole American Thanksgiving cut line might push a trade for a team that feels like it is falling out. It's just harder for me to see who they'd give us.

 

Then again, they could all have been scouting Dallas. I doubt it though.

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Much ballyhooed rumors on us being in on Tyler Bozak?  Please god tell me why we would take him off Toronto's hands, except if they'd throw in JvR in the deal?

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6 minutes ago, KJUNKANE said:

Much ballyhooed rumors on us being in on Tyler Bozak?  Please god tell me why we would take him off Toronto's hands, except if they'd throw in JvR in the deal?

IF we traded with Toronto and Bozak was the only asset coming to us on that trade, I'd be leading the pitchfork/torch parade myself 

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14 minutes ago, PenaltyKiller17 said:

 

I read a rumor yesterday that we were in fact interested in JVR.  I’d imagine a deal could involve JVR/Bozak and Rask/prospects/picks.

 

Toronto is right up to the contract limit like we are.  Could include picks to prevent overages.  I don’t see Toronto, in the thick of a cup chase, giving up 2 roster players for 1 and picks.  Bozak doesn’t seem like a trade GMRF makes. A 31 year old upcoming UFA for anything on our roster?  Thats not GMRF.  Even JVR is an upcoming UFA.  Just isn’t his style.

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12 minutes ago, PenaltyKiller17 said:

I was just messing around.  It was just a thought.  I do think that if there’s a chance Marner turns into the next Patrick Kane, you take the deal and run, regardless of the semantics.

 

 

I agree with gocanes that Marner isn't really our answer right now.  That said if i could get him for the price of Justin Faulk, i'd probably pull a muscle diving for the phone.

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Trade talk has begun early this season. This is a place to talk about the possibility or reality of trade moves.

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13 hours ago, KJUNKANE said:

Much ballyhooed rumors on us being in on Tyler Bozak?  Please god tell me why we would take him off Toronto's hands, except if they'd throw in JvR in the deal?

Bozak does nothing for our team, I say no. He's a minus 88 in his career. Now JVR is another story:D

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To Avs: Faulk and Staal

To Canes: Landeskog and Carl Soderberg.

 

Why: Long-term history indicates we are short one scorer. Prospects are that three more years, not six, should be plenty for the Wallmarks and Roys to step into a Jordo/Soderberg-type role.

 

Pluses for us: Creates an instant top line of Landeskog, Rask and Lindholm, which had great success at the Worlds. Sheds our long-term commitment (and lessens the payroll cost and cap hit) for Jordan (thru 2023) while bringing back a truly, fully defensive center with only a three-year commitment, a veteran who still eats minutes and would be a great mentor to his fellow Swedes on the aforementioned top line. Minimal risk of your old player hurting you (since trading with the West). Instantly solves the C problem which was so ham-handedly created by the brain trust mere weeks (which seem like years) ago.

 

Pluses for them: Sends them the established NHL D-man Joe claims he wants, and provides them with a younger, more offensive-minded veteran shutdown C. With a ring.

 

Minuses: It's a calculated roll of the dice, betting that what we saw two nights ago from Jordan's line isn't the new normal. If it is, this deal is unnecessary. But that's not what history indicates. And, would Jordan waive to go to The House Crazy Joe Torched?  

 

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Whoa really!  Sodererg had 14 points in 80 games last year.  Landeskog had 33points in 72.   I don't understand how you think Faulk and Staal for those two is even or makes sense for our team that's lacking in scoring and a first line center.  anyone that got Staal and Faulk should be sending back their first line center or something similar.

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It's odd to me that with all the early trade speculation the Hurricanes are hardly mentioned. It could be just a case as with all things Hurricanes not many outside of Raleigh pay attention. Maybe but curious. A lot of teams are looking for scoring forwards if you can believe the hype. I'm thinking the GM meeting later this week could see some deals at least talked about. I'm still not sure a "big" move if any move is in the cards for us.

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1 hour ago, danimal-ch1 said:

Whoa really!  Sodererg had 14 points in 80 games last year.  Landeskog had 33points in 72.   I don't understand how you think Faulk and Staal for those two is even or makes sense for our team that's lacking in scoring and a first line center.  anyone that got Staal and Faulk should be sending back their first line center or something similar.

On the worst team in the league and given their much better histories, those numbers are about right. Landeskog is a long-term Captain, former Rookie of the Year, and three times the offensive player of Jordo. He would more than replace what we're losing from Stemp. You might want to read this.

 

Jordo is no 1C. We got him as a #2 because that's what he is. As for Faulk, he would be a 5-6 on most other teams; he couldn't hold his spot on the PP, given his recent inability to find open shooting lanes--his best chance to be that "offensive" defenseman he is so roundly applauded for being. And our barn is full with guys who play much hungrier, IMO. 

Edited by top-shelf-1

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I like some of your thoughts here, top, but I just question why we would deal Jordo presently, when his line of Finns and JS seem to be establishing scoring potential? Now, undoubtedly Landeskrog has "potential" in his makeup, but wouldn't he require some adjustment into the present chemistry, and there is always the chance that he might not be a good fit? IDK on your proposal?

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2 hours ago, top-shelf-1 said:

 

To Avs: Faulk and Staal

To Canes: Landeskog and Carl Soderberg.

. . .

 

   NHL career goals/game  

Landeskog  0.277

Staal           0.247

Faulk          0.161

Soderberg  0.146    

 

I'd also look at points in addition to goals, but as long as the points stat includes secondary assists I'm never sure how useful that stat is. 

#includeonlyprimaryassistsinpoints!

 

Landeskog scores a bit more than Staal, but is by no means a "scorer" (their g/gm averages suggest Landy would give you only an additional 2.5 goals per season over Staal).  Soderberg is 3 years older than Staal and is a career -17 compared to Staal's +42.  Canes biggest needs imo:

  • strengthen the center position
  • add a legit top 6 scorer

I don't see this trade as doing either.  Hard pass for me.

 

Now, if RF can engineer a trade around Faulk for Landeskog, count me in!  Maybe throw in a good prospect not named Bean or a draft pick from the Canes if necesary?

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4 hours ago, KJUNKANE said:

why we would deal Jordo presently, when his line of Finns and JS seem to be establishing scoring potential?

As I mentioned in my proposal, history shows we've had plenty of flashes of increased scoring but painfully little has lasted. A Landy-Rask-Lindy line would assemble three guys with already-proven chemistry--potentially for the next 10 years.

 

3 hours ago, LakeLivin said:

Landeskog scores a bit more than Staal, but is by no means a "scorer" (their g/gm averages suggest Landy would give you only an additional 2.5 goals per season over Staal).  Soderberg is 3 years older than Staal and is a career -17 compared to Staal's +42. 

Yet again, a couple of years with the wrong team is queering the averages. Soderberg was a net +12 in three years with Boston, but that went to Boston thanks to joining the Avs in 2015. Landeskog, before Roy lost the room that same year, was a .8 ppg guy across the prior four seasons. Ignoring the impact of the Avs past two seasons on both guys would be like ignoring, in the case of Jordo's stats, the effects of playing for Carolina versus Pittsburgh.   

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I just don't want anybody else's guys who are "under producing" or "may need a change of scenery".  IMO their is no point in a trade unless we acquire someone who consistently scores 25goals and 50 points per year and is on pace for that this year.  We have an all-star captain to offer(Faulk), we have a 1st round 5th pick Dman to offer(Hannifan), We have a Lindholm, we have a Rask. 

   Giving up one or any combination of those guys should bring back the return we need if its available.  No slumping, streaky, had a bad year last year, or off to a slow start this year guys!!  We got those!!!  Aka Landeskog.  Hey come slump and underperform with us now and take our allstar D man who is probably about to turn it around and be really good again.  

  By the way I believe Faulks values is down right now due to a mediocre start.  He will turn it around, score double digit goals and get his D game on soon enough. Might not be the best time to sell him while his value is down. He seems to always be a slow starter.  My two cents.

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2 hours ago, top-shelf-1 said:

Yet again, a couple of years with the wrong team is queering the averages. Soderberg was a net +12 in three years with Boston, but that went to Boston thanks to joining the Avs in 2015. Landeskog, before Roy lost the room that same year, was a .8 ppg guy across the prior four seasons. Ignoring the impact of the Avs past two seasons on both guys would be like ignoring, in the case of Jordo's stats, the effects of playing for Carolina versus Pittsburgh.   

 

Landeskog had only 1 year at .8 ppg and Staal's best year was .81 ppg.  Landeskog's highest season goal totals: 26 and 23.  Staal: 29 and 25.  Sure that was when Staal was with Pitt.  But you just made the argument that we should take the team into consideration, and what team has been more offensively inept than the Canes since Jordo has been here?

 

Bottom line: I'd love to get Landeskog, but no way do I see him as much of an offensive upgrade as you do, and nowhere near worth Faulk and Jordon (I see Soda as not much more than a throw in right now).  And if we're trading our best center, we better be getting a better one back.

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19 minutes ago, sleekfeeder said:

Just curious danimal, who is on your wish list? Who in your eyes fits that description and would potentially be available?

No idea besides the names thrown around on here.  James Van Riemsdyk fits that description perfectly. Not sure if he's really available.  Hoping RF has something nice in the works .  It's asking a lot to acquire someones 25 goal guy but we have some good  bait to dangle.

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