Jump to content
The Official Site of the Carolina Hurricanes
Sign in to follow this  
OBXer

The Search (Hurricanes need a GM)

Recommended Posts

1 hour ago, Manwolf said:

This season was lost in the February homestand. 

I felt the season was lost in November.  Losing to Colorado 5-3 and then Arizona 2-1 in a SO was all I needed to see.  The February homestand was the lock swinging on the gate to the playoffs.

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, coastal_caniac said:

 

And which is EXACTLY why I take nothing the Canadian media throws out there as fact.

Yup. Hockey is the Canadian press corps' Hollywood.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Though I have no basis other than applying my own (limited) common sense to what I have seen of Dundon’s approach to owning the Canes, I’m not buying the idea he was lowballing GM candidates before he even apparently settled on one for the job. I think the guy is smart enough to know that he is placing the future of the franchise in the hands of his new GM. Can’t see him cheaping out and offering a salary equal to a journeyman playing on a 2 way deal. That said, anyone have any idea what Francis was making, or what Peters’ salary is. For comparison purposes to the alleged $400,000 figure, I have no idea what the now deposed GM was paid.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

My Remkin-esque post over in the draft thread got me thinking about the work cut out for the new GM and how utterly ****ed RF was when he took over. There have been a lot of comments about how RF was afraid to "lose" a trade. I am beginning to think he just thought we didn't have enough value to be able to overpay for anything without going broke. Every team is give N value in picks that is adjusted by the standings and their ability tok scout. That value then gets adjusted by the teams ability to develop prospects intok NHL players. This team doesn't have enough players to trade bad ones for a good one and still field a full lineup. All the discussions we have had on here show at best maybe 1/3 of a NHL lineup that people would keep. How does trading the other 2/3 bring us back better quality? I don't think it can, we have to add value in FA this year or we repeat the same next year.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
12 hours ago, top-shelf-1 said:

Or a very shrewd way of getting AGMs all over the league thinking about it. Guys who engineer $700 million buyouts typically think (much) longer term. Would you want any of the candidates already floated if they WERE willing to interview with another team before the current campaign is over? And if the 400k price really was floated, what self-respecting hockey lifer is going to take it? Not one I'd want, either. 

top, I like the way you framed this present quagmire, and do so for several reasons. 1st and foremost, I'm sick and tired of being what appears from our (Canes' fans) rather sheltered corner, the butt of all the jokes throughout the league whenever any other fanbase wants to shrug off their own woes. This started with the inception of the team in 1997, and all the condescending talk then was of Mayberry and NASCAR. I just wonder if any other fanbase has suffered similarly and can't think of any? My point is that I WANT our new leader, Tom Dundon to be miles ahead of these other smug billionaires in his innovative thoughts.

 

2nd, as young as this owner is comparatively, I cannot accept that he has entered into this possibly shark filled tank we call the NHL, lacking similar experiences in his other business dealings. Thus, in agreement I think with your thoughts, I prefer to believe that rather than a massive blunder, I think his initial GM volley was a calculated, back handed genius zugzwang move, simply because I PREFER NOT TO CONSIDER OTHERWISE.

 

Finally, as so many of you have previously said in so many words, it is completely inconceivable to me, that a newly minted hockey organization owner who's had the where with all to purchase  an NHL team, and well known in other dealings to accommodate fan experience to grow that enterprise, would instantly cheapen his purchase by attempting to "low ball" a position that could be the true linchpin of the success in moving his organization forward. Now I know that the media has sullied these waters by underhandedly suggesting that Dundon is equivalent to a Czar overseeing his fiefdom, thru his puppet GM who "reports directly to him", and further that the organization will "be run by committee", but I refuse to buy into that theorem simply because the Old Vanguard has had its feathers ruffled by his somewhat swift, unprecedented actions. 

 

 And one final thing I'd like to address. I keep seeing comments from several during these admittedly confusing times, doubting the quality not only of this team, but also that of our AHLers. Its funny, but similar to the high and low swings we experience thru this looming 9th year of playoff absence as our team wins or loses games, our moods vacillate between proclaiming this to be a playoff team vs a pathetic shell of a team? My question here is, before we wring our hands over what we've been led to believe is just a bunch of 3rd or 4th liners in Charlotte, whose judgement of that are we accepting? It would appear to me, at this point in the year, that a good percentage of this board has discounted both RF's and BP's abilities in several dealings, and further it is I believe their pronouncement of our Checkers players that suggest they are lacking? I guess what I'm saying here, as with much of the previous above, I think as we distance ourselves from another disappointing year, the ominous black clouds that are swirling now will dissipate, and we'll recognize that our position is better than we thought. One MAJOR COUP, like a Tavares or some unforeseen fortune in the draft could be an instant game changer?

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 hours ago, KJUNKANE said:

One MAJOR COUP, like an  Tavares or some unforeseen fortune in the draft  actual #1 goaltender could would be an instant game changer

FTFY.

 

Which is not to suggest we don't need to upgrade Ryan and PDG, and let Faulk (definitely) and maybe Rask seek their fortunes elsewhere. I think Skinner can still be a force with line mates who can get him the puck, but moving him might be prove more valuable in the longer term, too.

 

Still, goaltending separates winners from losers in this league. Always has, always will. If the guy in your crease can't stop the puck more often than the guy in the other one on a nightly basis, you're toast. If you doubt that, just look at the Isles: They have the #1C so many of us want, and a killer top line. And they've missed the playoffs seven times in the past 10 years. 

 

I'm not necessarily saying it's an either/or situation. Even great goaltending can't uh, save :) an otherwise hapless roster. But with it, and two bonafide #2 centers and solid 1-4 D, a team can win in this league. Take away any one of those three things and winning gets exponentially harder.

 

Right now we have 1-1/2 (Lindholm) #2 caliber centers. We have solid 1-4 D, but we're using what should be our 3-4 in the 5-6 slot, and those extra minutes for the not-as-responsible guys have been killing us. (TVR, Fleury and even Dahlbeck have earned more minutes than they're getting most nights; Hanifin and Faulk have earned less.) And our goaltending is well below average. So we're nearly there with skaters; I think Lindholm has taken great strides in his all-around game under Peters (and is becoming an absolute beast). So have Aho, TT, Nordstrom and McGinn. Willy and Jordan practically coach themselves. On the D side, Steve Smith clearly "reaches" Slavin, Pesce, TVR, Fleury, and Dahlbeck.

 

But... goaltending.

 

Pekka Rhine reached 40 wins last night, for the third season in his career--joining Brodeur (who did that a ridiculous eight times), and a handful of others who have achieved it. And guess whose team sits atop the NHL, four points better (even!) than TBL?

 

And don't get me started on the Preds' coach. Sooooo glad we let THAT guy go. 

 

Now, we have a solid core of young players and a coaching duo that's proven it can bring out the best in them. With a GM that lets BP freely swing the hammer and a bonafide #1 keeper, I agree that this team is closer than it has been in a long while, and better structured, from an overall organizational standpoint, than it has been since I've been a fan (2004-05). I'll take passionate, hands-on ownership over the malaise forever approach every day of the week.

 

(/Tolstoy)

 

Edited by top-shelf-1
  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, top-shelf-1 said:

FTFY.

 

Which is not to suggest we don't need to upgrade Ryan and PDG, and let Faulk (definitely) and maybe Rask seek their fortunes elsewhere. I think Skinner can still be a force with line mates who can get him the puck, but moving him might be prove more valuable in the longer term, too.

 

Still, goaltending separates winners from losers in this league. Always has, always will. If the guy in your crease can't stop the puck more often than the guy in the other one on a nightly basis, you're toast. If you doubt that, just look at the Isles: They have the #1C so many of us want, and a killer top line. And they've missed the playoffs seven times in the past 10 years. 

 

I'm not necessarily saying it's an either/or situation. Even great goaltending can't uh, save :) an otherwise hapless roster. But with it, and two bonafide #2 centers and solid 1-4 D, a team can win in this league. Take away any one of those three things and winning gets exponentially harder.

 

Right now we have 1-1/2 (Lindholm) #2 caliber centers. We have solid 1-4 D, but we're using what should be our 3-4 in the 5-6 slot, and those extra minutes for the not-as-responsible guys have been killing us. (TVR, Fleury and even Dahlbeck have earned more minutes than they're getting most nights; Hanifin and Faulk have earned less.) And our goaltending is well below average. So we're nearly there with skaters; I think Lindholm has taken great strides in his all-around game under Peters (and is becoming an absolute beast). So have Aho, TT, Nordstrom and McGinn. Willy and Jordan practically coach themselves. On the D side, Steve Smith clearly "reaches" Slavin, Pesce, TVR, Fleury, and Dahlbeck.

 

But... goaltending.

 

Pekka Rhine reached 40 wins last night, for the third season in his career--joining Brodeur (who did that a ridiculous eight times), and a handful of others who have achieved it. And guess whose team sits atop the NHL, four points better (even!) than TBL?

 

And don't get me started on the Preds' coach. Sooooo glad we let THAT guy go. 

 

Now, we have a solid core of young players and a coaching duo that's proven it can bring out the best in them. With a GM that lets BP freely swing the hammer and a bonafide #1 keeper, I agree that this team is closer than it has been in a long while, and better structured, from an overall organizational standpoint, than it has been since I've been a fan (2004-05). I'll take passionate, hands-on ownership over the malaise forever approach every day of the week.

 

(/Tolstoy)

 

 

So we make a run for Price or Lundqvist?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
49 minutes ago, bluedevil58 said:

 

So we make a run for Price or Lundqvist?

 

Neither .  Price is too injury prone and Lundqvist is getting to the end quickly, and why take that much of a step down.

Edited by winger52

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, bluedevil58 said:

 

So we make a run for Price or Lundqvist?

Price is battling a condition from which some never recover (CFS). Lundquist is too long in the tooth--although he's almost worth it, in terms of forcing the Rags' fans who masquerade as Caniacs - until the Bluesh*ts come to town - to make a freakin' decision.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8 minutes ago, bluedevil58 said:

The reason I mention those 2 is because those 2 are the only ones who night be available.   I do not see another legit #1 being available.

 

 

Therein lies the rub.  If there were 62 legitimate NHL starting goaltenders out there, it would be pie... but there don't seem to be.  So there are 3 options - 1) draft and develop one, 2) take a chance on someone's backup, or 3) throw cash and prizes at a proven veteran (in the case of FAs - otherwise throw it at his team to try to bring them in via trade) and hope they have enough years in the tank to make it worth it.  If i knew the sure-thing answer, then i'd be applying for the GM job.  But alas...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, Caniac514 said:

Do you think Montreal will let Price go?

 

Why?  That's an anchor of a contract and he is battling chronic fatigue.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Consider this my application for the GM position:

 

Forwards

Keep:

Aho LW

Teravainen RW

McGinn LW

Staal C

Lindholm RW

Rask C

PDG Extra

 

Promote:

Zykov RW

Foegele LW

Wallmark C

 

Acquire:

F Via Jeff Skinner trade

F Via Justin Faulk trade

F Via FA

 

Defense

Keep:

Slavin LD

Pesce RD

Hanafin LD

TVR RD

Fluery LD

Klas Dahlbeck Extra

 

Promote:

McKeown RD

 

Goal

Keep:

Ward #2

 

Acquire #1 using picks and prospects, including this years #1 unless we finish top 3 in the lottery.  Don't Use Necas, and if all possible, don't use Kuokkanen.

 

 

Acquisition Strategy:

Acquire one center - Back up the bank truck to Tavares.  If not successful, use Faulk and/or Skinner to target top center.

Acquire one LW - If Tavares acquisition is successful, use Skinner and/or Faulk to acquire 2nd line LW.  If Tavares acquisition fails, target JVR in FA.

Acquire one RW - Use Faulk and/or Skinner to acquire 2nd line RW.  None of the top 6 RW currently available are going to make it FA.

 

Development strategy change: Develop NHL centers by playing prospects at center in the AHL instead of at wing in the NHL. 

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 3/19/2018 at 2:22 PM, bluedevil58 said:

  Timing leads me to believe that TD saw we were in the hunt, watched Francis do nothing, then was like *edit*.  Anyone else think the same?  I know it was clearly stated they were in agreement at the TDL that no moves could be made.  But I am just not buying it due to the timing of the events.

Absolutely agree even though TD stated he was in agreement with RF. TD has stated he is impatient and IMO he wants to make the team better immediately. RF always thought that giving up prospects along with a young D Men was taboo. TD respected RF but has stated that they agreed on many things although they differed on how we get there. To me this signals the difference in opinion on trades and utilizing draft picks and prospects. RF liked to rebuild within and TD was open to all options especially the one's that were quicker fixes. IMO this is why I feel RF resigned and was not fired.RF did not want to see his years of hard work and building of assets dismantled on trade deadline moves or future trades that seemed to HIM as being an overpay. RF could not adjust his mode of operation and thought it was time to go. TD mentioned that the two of them spoke frequently for weeks up to the "promotion" which had to include trade deadline moves and their opposite opinions on how to get there. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
16 minutes ago, slapshot02 said:

Absolutely agree even though TD stated he was in agreement with RF. TD has stated he is impatient and IMO he wants to make the team better immediately. RF always thought that giving up prospects along with a young D Men was taboo. TD respected RF but has stated that they agreed on many things although they differed on how we get there. To me this signals the difference in opinion on trades and utilizing draft picks and prospects. RF liked to rebuild within and TD was open to all options especially the one's that were quicker fixes. IMO this is why I feel RF resigned and was not fired.RF did not want to see his years of hard work and building of assets dismantled on trade deadline moves or future trades that seemed to HIM as being an overpay. RF could not adjust his mode of operation and thought it was time to go. TD mentioned that the two of them spoke frequently for weeks up to the "promotion" which had to include trade deadline moves and their opposite opinions on how to get there. 

 

That's how I read the tea leaves

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
14 minutes ago, super_dave_1 said:

That's how I read the tea leaves

Me three. Or four, or whatever we're up to.

 

I frankly like the new guy coming in and shaking things up (and especially peeing in the traditionalists' Cheerios). I also liked TVR's support of the current roster the other night. Despite the crummy finishes of last week, I see no evidence that BP has lost the room. Bold moves sometimes have a way of pulling folks together, and absent a TDL move, I think this was TD's way of affirming that he's not afraid to make changes, and anyone wanting to be here next year better make their best case, toot sweet.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
58 minutes ago, cclifford10 said:

Consider this my application for the GM position:

 

Forwards

Keep:

Aho LW

Teravainen RW

McGinn LW

Staal C

Lindholm RW

Rask C

PDG Extra

 

Promote:

Zykov RW

Foegele LW

Wallmark C

 

Acquire:

F Via Jeff Skinner trade

F Via Justin Faulk trade

F Via FA

 

Defense

Keep:

Slavin LD

Pesce RD

Hanafin LD

TVR RD

Fluery LD

Klas Dahlbeck Extra

 

Promote:

McKeown RD

 

Goal

Keep:

Ward #2

 

Acquire #1 using picks and prospects, including this years #1 unless we finish top 3 in the lottery.  Don't Use Necas, and if all possible, don't use Kuokkanen.

 

 

Acquisition Strategy:

Acquire one center - Back up the bank truck to Tavares.  If not successful, use Faulk and/or Skinner to target top center.

Acquire one LW - If Tavares acquisition is successful, use Skinner and/or Faulk to acquire 2nd line LW.  If Tavares acquisition fails, target JVR in FA.

Acquire one RW - Use Faulk and/or Skinner to acquire 2nd line RW.  None of the top 6 RW currently available are going to make it FA.

 

Development strategy change: Develop NHL centers by playing prospects at center in the AHL instead of at wing in the NHL. 

 

Williams?

 

#1 keeper?

 

I'm sorry, this interview is over :o:lol: 

Edited by top-shelf-1
  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 JVR should be on the shopping list anyway. We do have his brother after all.

 

I also think a deal w the oil can be made. I think they consider themselves to be close contenders and may be willing to trade down for "mature' players. 

 

Say they score a higher position than expected. Put together a "move up" package with Skinner or whoever + and get RNH and move up to get a young instant impact skill player. Lots of ifs, but hey there were lots of ifs starting our season too.

Edited by sleekfeeder

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
12 minutes ago, sleekfeeder said:

I think JVR should be on the shopping list anyway. We do have his brother after all.

Yeah, and brothers have worked out so well for us already! /snark

 

I've always liked JVR. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 minutes ago, top-shelf-1 said:

Yeah, and brothers have worked out so well for us already! /snark

 

I've always liked JVR. 

Lol. And of course there's that goalie thing-a-magig I have 0% idea or input on how to fix. Good luck Mr next GM.

Edited by sleekfeeder

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, top-shelf-1 said:

Me three. Or four, or whatever we're up to.

 

I frankly like the new guy coming in and shaking things up (and especially peeing in the traditionalists' Cheerios). I also liked TVR's support of the current roster the other night. Despite the crummy finishes of last week, I see no evidence that BP has lost the room. Bold moves sometimes have a way of pulling folks together, and absent a TDL move, I think this was TD's way of affirming that he's not afraid to make changes, and anyone wanting to be here next year better make their best case, toot sweet.

 

I don't know that I'm all warm and fuzzy about what is happening, just that the styles of TD and RF did not probably sync.  Whether BP has lost the room is another issue.  On that, I'm not sure.  I'm beginning to wonder if he ever had the room

 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, slapshot02 said:

IMO this is why I feel RF resigned and was not fired.RF did not want to see his years of hard work and building of assets dismantled on trade deadline moves or future trades that seemed to HIM as being an overpay. RF could not adjust his mode of operation and thought it was time to go.

Other than the "thought it was time to go" you've described a classic flaw of a failed leader.  Stand back and admire your work and surely everyone should see how right you are as you lose sight of the goal.  However, the flawed leader seldom sees it is their "time to go" but defends the work they've done.

  • Like 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
54 minutes ago, sleekfeeder said:

 JVR should be on the shopping list anyway. We do have his brother after all.

 

I also think a deal w the oil can be made. I think they consider themselves to be close contenders and may be willing to trade down for "mature' players. 

 

Say they score a higher position than expected. Put together a "move up" package with Skinner or whoever + and get RNH and move up to get a young instant impact skill player. Lots of ifs, but hey there were lots of ifs starting our season too.

Share some of these thoughts sleek.

 

If JVR has an interest in playing with TVR, we have an in. And I agree this is a far cry from the two headed Staal monster. The guy will not be cheap though as he's on a 36 goal pace with 31 already netted, a career goals year.  Assuming that we lose out on Tavares, JVR is a blue chip UFA. And he does what we need: put the puck in the net.

 

I also like the idea of dealing with the Oilers. There has to be something worthwhile in that carcass of highly drafted forwards. And if ever there should be a team that should be utterly numb at the idea that more high draft picks are going to help it's them. Maybe we can move up. Heck, I'd trade up just to get their lottery winning ping pong balls. But yes, somehow coming away with a player and swapping first round picks would be a coup, especially if the lose a few more games. I know they are only a few picks ahead of us, but even a chance to get Wahlstrom, another possible 1C? Yes.

 

Imagine putting that together and coming away with RNH, JVR, and drafting Wahlstrom. Not bad.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, top-shelf-1 said:

 

Williams?

 

#1 keeper?

 

I'm sorry, this interview is over :o:lol: 

And PDG as an extra has to go, The pay grade is now down to $250,000. 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Loading...
Sign in to follow this  

×
×
  • Create New...