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Off-Season 2018

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If Tavares does leave the Isles word on the street is that he wants to go to a contender and not an rebuild.  Doesn't hurt to wish but if I was a betting person I would have to bet against us.:(

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It's easy for an idiot with a microphone to get snarky. That doesn't impress me. Buying a hockey team does.

 

Dundon 1, Microphone Moron 0.

 

 

Edited by top-shelf-1

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4 hours ago, wxray1 said:

This lowball offer thing is really going to haunt Dundon.  The Toronto media won't let it go.  Heard the $400k number used again today on XM as a snarky comeback to a caller talking about Garth Snow.

 

Like it or not, the word is "Dundon is cheap."  That's going to take some work to undo.  Reality really doesn't matter.  Perception is reality, especially when being constantly repeated.

 

Depends on how one looks at it. Sure, they are getting their little digs in at Dundon but I (like to) think that in reality it's a bigger dig at the applicants, with Dundon offering what he thought they and their ideas are worth. In other words, he was far less impressed with the candidates than the Canadian media. 

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3 hours ago, remkin said:

One way to change the cheap thing would be to back up the cash truck and dump it on John Tavares.

 

Not saying he'd come here, but it would get rid of the cheap label, oh and with a better goalie, make us contenders with two moves.

 

The other way would be to throw some cash at JVR.

 

I'm sure TD will find out what Tavares' agent thinks he is worth on the open market (if he makes it that far) and make a reasonable offer. He'll probably give it an honest shot but he won't get into a bidding war and over-pay. I'm actually fine with that because whomever signs him for the projected $12m + will most likely have to dump salary and offer players in trades.

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1 hour ago, cclifford10 said:

Has anybody noticed Morgan Geekie's playoff numbers? 14 goals, 7 assists, in 7 games played.  That's getting it done!

 

Yea Ive put a couple of updates in “in the system” portion of the site about our junior hockey prospects.  Tri-city is smoking the playoffs right now as the number one.  Were undefeated through 6 games.  Geekie is only scoring 3 PPG right now. No biggie?.  He should be fun to keep up with next year in Charlotte.

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Watched the 3rd period of LVK vs LA last night, of course won by Knights 1-0 with ugh Fleury in goal, but got me to thinking about something. As incredulous as this entire Las Vegas story is, one of the more saddening elements, if one is a Canes fan if you think about it, is how that team was forced by injuries I guess, to use 5 or 6 goalies along the way to this unprecedented run, and seemed to win with them, yet we are unable to find JUST one goalie? 

 

So much for "pity party" thoughts. But then I thought, and possibly it's been mentioned elsewhere, but in this present goalie dilemma we have, is there not one of that group that could be pilfered from them? I know Malcolm Subban was one, and likely a few could not be used for full seasons, but surely there must be one of those that might offer  glimmer of hope for full time service?

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1 hour ago, KJUNKANE said:

Watched the 3rd period of LVK vs LA last night, of course won by Knights 1-0 with ugh Fleury in goal, but got me to thinking about something. As incredulous as this entire Las Vegas story is, one of the more saddening elements, if one is a Canes fan if you think about it, is how that team was forced by injuries I guess, to use 5 or 6 goalies along the way to this unprecedented run, and seemed to win with them, yet we are unable to find JUST one goalie? 

 

So much for "pity party" thoughts. But then I thought, and possibly it's been mentioned elsewhere, but in this present goalie dilemma we have, is there not one of that group that could be pilfered from them? I know Malcolm Subban was one, and likely a few could not be used for full seasons, but surely there must be one of those that might offer  glimmer of hope for full time service?

 

KJUN, I was thinking the same thing last night.  Even more maddening is all the goalies who have roots in PITT, with JR.  Argghh!

 

But if you need some schadenfreude, just look at the Flyers.  As I watched the first few minutes of the game last night (all I could stomach), it appeared to me that Darling was reincarnated in the form of Elliot.

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I think it is a reasonable point Kjun. Subban was a waiver wire pick up. There was some luck involved though. If Vegas did not have a goalie crisis, they probably don't make that move. The team taking him has to put him on the roster, can't send him down to the AHL. At that point I guess we could have carried 3 goalies, but Subban was struggling so much that the Bruins put a rare first round goalie prospect out on the curb, so at the time putting him on the NHL team would have been pretty bold.

 

That said, almost analogous to the GM situation where the argument that gives Dundon the ultimate draw is that there are only a handful of these jobs open world wide, at the most. Well we only really need to find one goalie. Darling or Cam can back up, and there are only a handful of #1 goalie openings at any one time since most are claimed. Yet finding that guy has proven elusive and is (I was going to say arguably, but really it is not arguable) the single biggest reason for our failure.

 

All of the gnashing of teeth and hair pulling about scoring (me), no 1C (also me), co captains, too soft, coaches stink, Faulk's defense, etc. etc. etc. pale in comparison to the institutional inability to find a franchise goalie. Comparatively the others barely matter. It's like the complaining about the deck chairs when the ship has a gash and water is pouring in the side.

 

I was half joking when I wrote a while ago, that all Dundon needs to do is find a GM that can find us a good goalie, even if that GM isn't really good at anything else.

 

Francis tried twice and fired blanks, stood pat on other occasions when he should have tried again, and the result single-handedly kept us out of the playoffs. If he had succeeded in this area, he is probably in his job. This is also, to me, the single biggest factor why I voted to keep Peters. Darling goes .500 we finish with 109 points. Again, I am really thinking I can drop the mike here.

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To add to the need for a GM. Elynuik is considering not signing with us and re-entering the draft.  It is according to Freidman's 31 thoughts.  

 

I hope we sign him because he would be a solid center for Charlotte next season and could compete with Wallmark for a last center spot here.  

In the end, the roster is so deep it will be hard for him to make the squad anytime soon.  

 

He has to compete with:

Wallmark, Kuokkanen, Geekie, Roy, and Necas for the last 2 center slots, of course adding in any draft.  Necas is a pencil in.  Basically 5 dudes competing for 4th line center for the next 4 years.  

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5 hours ago, gocanes0506 said:

To add to the need for a GM. Elynuik is considering not signing with us and re-entering the draft.  It is according to Freidman's 31 thoughts.  

 

I hope we sign him because he would be a solid center for Charlotte next season and could compete with Wallmark for a last center spot here.  

In the end, the roster is so deep it will be hard for him to make the squad anytime soon.  

 

He has to compete with:

Wallmark, Kuokkanen, Geekie, Roy, and Necas for the last 2 center slots, of course adding in any draft.  Necas is a pencil in.  Basically 5 dudes competing for 4th line center for the next 4 years.  

Maybe some of those guys not named Necas will be used as pieces to help us get a proven goalie and scoring help.

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16 hours ago, bluedevilcane said:

Maybe some of those guys not named Necas will be used as pieces to help us get a proven goalie and scoring help.

 

I think this is where Dundon is going to try to improve the team.  We are pretty deep in the minors.  We can afford to move some picks and prospects for some immediate help.  That is where you will get value.  Free Agency, not so much.

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Question for some of the deep dive stats guys. This is the initial Canada roster that BP gets to coach. Any of these guys UFAs? Only 1 keeper so far Darcy Kuemper, Yotes. It’s one advantage of getting picked to coach the team. Players get to know him and pass the word around about playing for him. Maybe when they fill out the roster it will include a UFA or two for BP to get to ‘informally.’

006C8BEB-A605-4219-97EE-65B9419BFF16.jpeg

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2 hours ago, raleighcaniac said:

Maybe when they fill out the roster it will include a UFA or two for BP to get to ‘informally.’

 

It's probably an NHL ethics violation. I just want him to coach well and enjoy the tourney. If the players respect him word will get around should the Canes show interest in some of them.  

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Watching the Jets play last night reminded me of just how far away we are. Wow. Those dudes layed a beating on a darn good Wild team in every department.

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It's actually been interesting for a few years now to me when I watch playoff hockey or even in season rivalry games the intensity that our team doesn't even come close to touching. Doesn't come close to touching it even when their winning as well.

Edited by legend-1
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So I suppose to add onto that thought, can you imagine what a team that rather effortlessly can barely miss the playoffs could do if they all found Williams level of intensity?

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6 hours ago, sleekfeeder said:

Watching the Jets play last night reminded me of just how far away we are. Wow. Those dudes layed a beating on a darn good Wild team in every department.

 

Totally agree.  I just can't even imagine what the Canes would do with this kind of physicality.  The tragedy of it all is Ronnie Franchise mentioned exactly this problem like the first day on the job.  What the hell happened?  No progress at all.

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http://www.thehockeynews.com/news/article/nhl-fan-misery-index-a-frustration-ranking-of-the-league-s-31-teams

TheHockeyNews had an article ranking Fan Misery.  Looks like they weigh historical results, Cup wins, and fan expectations pretty highly. Here's their top 10  most-tortured NHL fan bases:

 

Blues

Sabres

Leafs

Caps

Canucks

Sharks

Panthers

Flyers

Sens

Jets

 

Canes don't come in until number 23.

23. Carolina Hurricanes
Canes fans have the mic drop of a Cup win in the past 20 years whenever Canadian fans bug them about attendance. New owner Tom Dundon looks like he’s up for disruption. . Canes come in at #23. 

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On 4/14/2018 at 5:33 PM, legend-1 said:

It's actually been interesting for a few years now to me when I watch playoff hockey or even in season rivalry games the intensity that our team doesn't even come close to touching. Doesn't come close to touching it even when their winning as well.

You can't compare regular season hockey to playoff hockey IMO. They are as different as apples and oranges. 

 

The beauty of team sports is that guys rise to the occasion and support each other. I'd be willing to bet that every fan in Philly was at least thinking that the Flyers were not going to win a game in their series against Pitt, after the Game One beat down. Two nights later they go out and beat down the Pens in their own barn. 

 

I get that it's been so long since we've seen it in our barn that playoff speed looks blinding. But I'll finish where I began: Regular season hockey and playoff hockey are two different things. It's what makes playoff hockey the best hockey there is.

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I have said this is a very important off-season for us. It'll be interesting to see the strategy of our long term future.  

 

I wanted to take a long look at our weakness of center options:

 

Internal:

Aho- has some comfort issues to work out in the NHL with playing a new position in the middle of the season.  Could easily be a top line center in 2 years.  

Necas- easily proven he can handle men with a .71 PPG in the czech league.  How does he handle North American Ice? How long does he take to accustom himself?   

Lindholm- on again, off again center.  Not much more than a scoring 4th line center at this point. 

 

Youngins:

Wallmark- wasn't given much of a shot to prove himself when up.  Seems like a 3C in a couple of years.  Has more than a PPG average in Charlotte

Kuokannen- centered the top line in U20 play this year, seemed like a fast riser, then hit a wall after the tourney in Buffalo.  Respectable .7 PPG average in Charlotte. probably needs another year.

Geekie- Talk about a fast riser this year and has taken his game to another level in the playoffs.  Hard to say if he could make the roster at this point.

Elynuik- Could reenter the draft, could make the roster with his size and speed, and could be in charlotte next year.  Hard to know. 

Roy- needs another year in the AHL.

 

UFA

Tavares- answers everything but will he and what would it cost?

Stastny- He would be a solid answer to a scoring 3C for 2 years to give Necas and Aho some time to figure out being a center in the NHL.  

Not much else I would consider

 

RFA

JT Miller- solid play all the way around.  His -3 rating is okay but does a lot of damage on the PP and over 50% in the circle.  Will be expensive and a 2C type.  Adds depth. TBL are capped strapped so he could be had for league ready prospects.

Reinhart- 50 points this year. At 22 he is still learning.  Not your physical presence of others mentioned but skilled.  Could be a 1C if he puts it all together.  Could be a 3C if he gets timid again. Could just be a RW.  He is a gamble.

Larkin, Red Wings- seems like a young defender and young center type swap candidate.  He is more a pass guy but Aho and Zykov could easily benefit from his play making. Detroit is hurting for cap space.  

Nylander, maple leafs- another young defender/young center swap candidate.  He'll be expensive to re-sign. How much of his production is from playing next to Matthews?  How ready is he to play center?   Would add a young "name" to the offense. 

 

More than a RFA Trades

ROR- With Reinhart getting 50 this year plus needing a new contract and ROR's comments make him expendable?  Solid play veteran that is a higher scoring center than Staal and more expensive.  He can play any spot and could be a solid buffer and mentor for Aho and Necas.

Marner- Has played mostly RW so far.  He can play center.  Another young guy on TML's roster that will need re-signing next off-season.  TML will have a hard time keeping Marner, Matthews and Nylander. 

RNH- he is 25 and could be finally putting it together.  He had a .75 PPG average this year.  Edmonton needs to trade him. He is a 2C now.  If this year wasnt a fluke then he could be a 1C.  Again not a physical presence but definitely skilled.  #1 overall and probably a little rushed and had a TON of pressure early.  He is a gamble but a bargain if he, at a minimum, maintains his scoring pace from this year.   

 

I didnt see many other Trade partners based on age and need for us/them.  Welcome to add to the list. 

In conclusion, there are options for trade and signing.  It really depends on how the GM and coach want to build the team to see if we stick with internal options of Aho and Necas.  Surround those two with big wingers that are a mix of veterans and young + match their speed. Or do we see veteran centers with Aho and Necas playing wing until some veterans complete contracts / they get more comfortable at center?  There are plenty of hybrid guys who could play center now and let Aho and Necas ease into it (Statsny, ROR, and JT Miller).  

 

I can do wingers later, if you want.  Although that gets really tricky without assuming we go internal or external for centers.     

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Thanks gocanes0506 for your thorough coverage of the outlook for the C position, both internal as well as external. Am I the only one on here reading this with just a little bit of skepticism? Seems like for many years, the general consensus on these boards(minus a few well known outliers) is one of unmitigated optimism, yet we've failed to come close year after year. Further, it appears to me that for at least the last 5 years, perhaps with the single exception TT, that our successes are rarely above 3rd or 4th lines, and failures are catastrophic(Darling). Williams back also qualifies as a successful acquisition, but just once, I'd like to see us hit a home run?

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