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Trade- Lindholm and Hanifin

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13 minutes ago, Kyrule said:

 

In the article it said that Calgary “made it clear they were happy he (Hamilton) departed.”

 

Did anyone see anything about this?

 

Sportsnet

Quote

After the Flames waived his brother, Freddie in January, several things Hamilton did in the latter stages of this season indicated he wasn’t happy here.

Quote

 

“Dougie is a terrific talent on the ice,” said the Flames GM.

“I think I have a good and open relationship with players and so there’s things I’m not going to share. We take everything on and off the ice into consideration here. I’m going to keep that stuff internal.”

 

 

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When i was listening to the Calgary radio station yesterday, they said the only reason Dougie’s brother was a pro hockey player was because of Dougie. He was brought in to make him happy.  

 

That was as far as the conversation about Freddie went though.  

 

There is a lot to read into that situation though.  What were the promises or conversations about his brother? Did Calgary do Freddie dirty and that left a bunch of doubt in Dougie’s mind?  And on, and on.

Edited by gocanes0506

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2 hours ago, AWACSooner said:

This part was the most damning:
 

Interesting on the article that Ferland is a recovering alcoholic...maybe he and Mongo can feed off of each other in common strength.

 

 

I also liked this snippet:
 

This perfectly illustrated why I wasn't too broken up to see either be traded.  They just didn't earn that new monster contract after all the hype of being top 5 (and top 10) picks.

Termed "entitlement"?

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19 minutes ago, gocanes0506 said:

When i was listening to the Calgary radio station yesterday, they said the only reason Dougie’s brother was a pro hockey player was because of Dougie. He was brought in to make him happy.  

 

That was as far as the conversation about Freddie went though.  

 

There is a lot to read into that situation though.  What were the promises or conversations about his brother? Did Calgary do Freddie dirty and that left a bunch of doubt in Dougie’s mind?  And on, and on.

 

Reminds me of the Redskins bowing to demands from RG III. Tail wagging the dog never works for teams.

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23 minutes ago, gocanes0506 said:

When i was listening to the Calgary radio station yesterday, they said the only reason Dougie’s brother was a pro hockey player was because of Dougie. He was brought in to make him happy.  

 

That was as far as the conversation about Freddie went though.  

 

There is a lot to read into that situation though.  What were the promises or conversations about his brother? Did Calgary do Freddie dirty and that left a bunch of doubt in Dougie’s mind?  And on, and on.

Hope we didn't trade money problems for head case problems. It might have been easier to solve the money problems. I know the Canes have not been good for a long time, but I can't remember any locker room issues. Even when Semin was awful, I can't remember him being a problem off the ice.

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Again a lot of details missing.  Supposedly Dougie was laissez faire during the Flames losing streak at the end of the season which contributed to management wanting a change.  Again was that after his brother situation? Does his lack of outspoken want to win mean it isn’t an internal drive? Idk.  I’ll wait until I see dougie fresh in a Canes sweater before I pass judgement.

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My take on the recent Calgary Flames trade:

To Carolina:

Dougie Hamilton (RH RD) - 25 years old, 6’6”, 210lb. Drafted in the first round (9th overall) in 2011.

 Hamilton is a very good offensive defense-man, who has often been prone to defensive gaffs and lazy, undisciplined penalties. He has played most of his career with Top D partners Zdeno Chara and Mark Giordano, who have covered for some of his defensive lapses. Despite being a big man, he plays quite a soft game. Beginning in Boston and continuing in Calgary; there have been persistent (though unsubstantiated) rumours that he doesn’t fit in well with his teammates. Signed to the end of 2020/2021 at $5.75M per.

Michael Ferland (LH LW/RW) – 26 years old, 6’2”, 208lb. Drafted in the 5th round (133rd overall) in 2010.

Ferland is a bottom 6 forward that played quite well with Sean Monahan and Johnny Gaudreau for several months. His career has been consistently inconsistent, a world beater one night, invisible the next. The physical play that he famously displayed against Vancouver in the 2015 play-offs has all but disappeared since his last concussion. Signed to the end of next season at $1.75M per, he will then be a UFA probably looking to at least double his salary.

Adam Fox (RH RD) – 20 years old, 5’11”, 181lb. Drafted in the 3rd round (66th overall) in 2016.

Fox is a good offensive defense-man who doesn’t appear to care much about his own end of the ice. He is a decent skater with great vision and elite passing skills. His size prevents him from having much of a physical presence. He has played for Harvard in the NCAA for the last two seasons and had refused to talk about contract offers from the Flames. This has led some people to believe that he intends to play out all 4 seasons in Harvard. He’d then become a UFA and could sign with the highest bidder.

To Calgary:

Noah Hanifin (LH LD) – 21 years old, 6’3”, 206lb. Drafted in the 1st round (5th overall) in 2015.

Hanifin is a talented “all-around” defense-man who has continued to improve every season. He seldom chips the puck out of the D zone; preferring to skate it out or pass it up to a forward. He is very skilled at O-zone entries; which should eliminate the need for some of the Flame’s “dump and chase” plays. Hanifin is projected to play on the 2nd pairing with veteran Travis Hamonic. This will allow Calgary to move TJ Brodie back to playing on Giordano’s right side, where Brodie had his greatest success. Hanifin is a RFA without arbitration rights coming off of an ELC ($925k Cap Hit, $1.775M AAV).

Elias Lindholm (RH C/RW) – 23 years old, 6’1”, 192lb. Drafted in the 1st round (5th overall) in 2013.

Lindholm is a hardworking, versatile, skilled forward who plays well in the “dirty areas”. He competes well in all 3 zones and has averaged a 52.7 FO% over 5 NHL seasons. His shot could use some improvement; while it is accurate, it’s not especially hard. He is projected to play at RW with Monahan/Gaudreau and will probably share face-off duties with Monahan, depending on which side the draw is. During his draft year, the Flames were reportedly just as interested in him as they were in Monahan. Lindholm is a RFA with arbitration rights coming off of a two year, $2.7M per contract.

 

Overall, I feel that this trade could benefit both teams, but I think that it will take 4 years before we know for sure.

If Carolina pairs Hamilton with Jaccob Slavin, they should have a great Top D pairing for at least 3 seasons. Ferland could help them out for at least one year; as he can play up and down their lineup. For the Hurricanes to win this trade, they would need to sign Fox and hope that he can become their PP quarterback 4 years down the road.

Among other things, Calgary apparently needed a dressing room shake-up and a Top 6 RW. I believe that it's "mission accomplished" on both of those items. They also got a little younger. Lindholm should be able to put up 50+ points playing with SM & JG, anything more will be a bonus. It will probably help that both players are very familiar with Calgary’s new coach (their old coach). For the Flames to win this trade, Hanifin will need to continue his steady development and come close to filling Giordano’s spot in 4 years.

Trivia

Calgary now has 20% of the first round draft picks from the 2013 Entry Draft.

#5 Lindholm

#6 Monahan

#17 Lazar

#22 Poirier

#24 Shinkaruk

#28 Klimchuk

IMO, Lazar is on the bubble; and Poirier, Shinkaruk, and Klimchuk probably have only one more season to make it to the NHL.

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You know what, I think that we fans just have to take these murmurs with a grain of salt? For one, consider the source and possibility of sour grapes trying to cover their potential error(or homers doing that). 2nd, do we fans think we have a bunch of yokels running this organization? Surely Waddell for all you naysayers or doubters, and Roddy have connections that they can get any controversial issues on a trade of this magnitude and not just walk into it blindly? Obviously our leadership group did due diligence knowing full well the "potential" of players they were giving up, so I'm comfortable with the results.

 

Additionally, thanks to our Calgary friend above, 420since1974, for you summation. As many have pointed out prior to me, and much more eloquently, I don't know that "winning a trade" should be our main focus here. IMHO, more than anything, it was a signal that a New Day has arisen, and the Canes' powers to be are getting off the snide so to speak, and actually moving forward!! For gosh sakes, that's been a constant complaint FOR YEARS, and now that its been done, why are we pulling back? Lets embrace this change, because after all, almost to a person, we've gripped about no change for years.

 

We also got tougher to play against, and I for one celebrate that aspect, because I hate seeing Skinner, Aho, and soon to be hopefully Necas and Svechnikov have their heads taken off. So this may also signal another cultural change that doubtful those traded would have accomplished(Lindholm was moving in that direction however).

Edited by KJUNKANE
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24 minutes ago, KJUNKANE said:

You know what, I think that we fans just have to take these murmurs with a grain of salt? For one, consider the source and possibility of sour grapes trying to cover their potential error(or homers doing that). 2nd, do we fans think we have a bunch of yokels running this organization? Surely Waddell for all you naysayers or doubters, and Roddy have connections that they can get any controversial issues on a trade of this magnitude and not just walk into it blindly? Obviously our leadership group did due diligence knowing full well the "potential" of players they were giving up, so I'm comfortable with the results.

 

I heard the terms“due diligence” and “no red flags” thrown around a lot by management when we signed HWSNBN.

 

I think this is different and I’m not trying to be a downer, just expressing some concern.

 

Hopefully, as Waddell said, it is true that the Bruins were also trying to get Hamilton back. That would ease some concerns.

 

Also on this point, in TD’s recent interview he talked about how nice of a person Svechnikov is, but followed it up with “I would draft him even if he was a jerk.” Kidding or not kidding (don’t think he was), TD doesn’t seem to be the type of a guy who cares about hugs and kisses in the locker room, he just wants wins. Whether this is true or not, or a good thing or not, I guess we’ll see.

 

.

Edited by Kyrule

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We did alright in the trade. Sometime the phrase change of scenery is over used but in hockey for some reason that is just what a player needs.

 

 

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47 minutes ago, caniac6 said:

Hope we didn't trade money problems for head case problems. It might have been easier to solve the money problems. I know the Canes have not been good for a long time, but I can't remember any locker room issues. Even when Semin HWSNBN was awful, I can't remember him being a problem off the ice.

Fixed ;)

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4 minutes ago, Kyrule said:

 

I heard the terms“due diligence” and “no red flags” thrown around a lot by management when we signed HWSNBN.

 

I think this is different and I’m not trying to be a downer, just expressing some concern.

 

Hopefully, as Waddell said, it is true that the Bruins were also trying to get Hamilton back. That would ease some concerns.

 

Also on this point, in TD’s recent interview he talked about how nice of a person Svechnikov is, but followed it up with “I would draft him even if he was a jerk.” Kidding or not kidding (don’t think he was), TD doesn’t seem to be the type of a guy who cares about hugs and kisses in the locker room, he just wants wins. Whether this is true or not, or a good thing or not, I guess we’ll see.

 

.

While I agree in part with The potential glib use of words like "due diligence" and "no red Flags" Kyrule, we are now being governed by a different group, and besides as I state, I have faith in them to cover their crucial bases.

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3 minutes ago, OBXer said:

We did alright in the trade. Sometime the phrase change of scenery is over used but in hockey for some reason that is just what a player needs.

 

 

See our former #12

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Caniac6, you named HWSNBN. 

 

You must shave all of the hair off of your body. ALL of it.

 

...and repent.

 

Those are the rules.

 

.

Edited by Kyrule
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Also, I'd suggest that TD has a different way of viewing the world and Phrasing it. His comment "I'd draft him , even if he was a jerk" may have lacked an emoji on it for clarification?

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17 minutes ago, KJUNKANE said:

Also, I'd suggest that TD has a different way of viewing the world and Phrasing it. His comment "I'd draft him , even if he was a jerk" may have lacked an emoji on it for clarification?

 

Only he knows.

 

Oh, and it was a podcast thingy so I heard it rather than reading it.

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5 minutes ago, Kyrule said:

 

Only he knows.

 

Oh, and it was a podcast thingy so I heard it rather than reading it.

I too heard it, and just filed it away?

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32 minutes ago, Kyrule said:

Caniac6, you named HWSNBN. 

 

You must shave all of the hair off of your body. ALL of it.

 

...and repent.

 

Those are the rules.

 

.

I couldn't remember all those letters. Please give me a second chance! 

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Just my two cents, but all this speculation about “whispers” and “rumblings” is terribly non-specific and seems to be put out there by these clubs in order to manage the emotions of their customers. So Hamilton didn’t want to fly to Vegas and bro down with Lucic et al. Lucic is a guy who told Dale Weiss in the handshake line that he was going to “****ing kill him”. That’s tolerated but somehow the guy who doesn’t want to go do Vegas with his teammates isn’t and is somehow defective.  Maybe it’s not his thing. Maybe he’s socially awkward. Maybe he’s health-conscious and doesn’t want to be exposed to drinking, strip clubs, etc. just to try and fit in. Who knows?  It could be a hundred different things. 

 

I hope everyone recognizes this guy is a talent and gives him a chance. Brind’Amour is okay with the guy apparently. And I’d be shocked if talking to Jordan wasn’t part of the due diligence.

 

Dougie will enjoy Raleigh’s museums!  

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14 minutes ago, Californiahurricane said:

Just my two cents, but all this speculation about “whispers” and “rumblings” is terribly non-specific and seems to be put out there by these clubs in order to manage the emotions of their customers. So Hamilton didn’t want to fly to Vegas and bro down with Lucic et al. Lucic is a guy who told Dale Weiss in the handshake line that he was going to “****ing kill him”. That’s tolerated but somehow the guy who doesn’t want to go do Vegas with his teammates isn’t and is somehow defective.  Maybe it’s not his thing. Maybe he’s socially awkward. Maybe he’s health-conscious and doesn’t want to be exposed to drinking, strip clubs, etc. just to try and fit in. Who knows?  It could be a hundred different things. 

 

I hope everyone recognizes this guy is a talent and gives him a chance. Brind’Amour is okay with the guy apparently. And I’d be shocked if talking to Jordan wasn’t part of the due diligence.

 

Dougie will enjoy Raleigh’s museums!  

Vegas certainly has never been my style, but I'm not sure I would have had the guts to stand up for myself at that age. Good for him for sticking up for himself.

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Just now, coastal_caniac said:

I'm not familiar with the Vegas "episode" but Lucic plays for the Oilers.  Not getting the connection here?

 

I’m guessing this stems back to when they were teammates in Boston.

 

I never heard anything about this either, but then I never looked so...

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