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In-Season 2018-2019

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41 minutes ago, KJUNKANE said:

Something is really nagging at me, and while we indulge from time to time in conspiracy theories around here, I'd like to throw this out. I'm not sure where in the rather closed society that is the Hockey World our 2 leaders, Dundon and Waddell, are perceived, but WHAT IF Dundon's obvious disdain for "tradition" has been taken as an affront and a sort of "black ball" mindset, obviously not publicized, now exists? Could this be why it's been so difficult to consummate any trades so far? Think of the snippets we've heard so far this season, We put together a better package for a goalie than another team yet the goalie is traded to that team; or An eleventh hour trade with a western conference team that falls thru? I'd hate to think that some collusion exists, yet I wouldn't put it past some of these Old School owners. Now I know we hear how hard trades are to make, but for me, it seems like we are always on the cusp but never succeed?

 

On the other hand, it also is quite possible that our GM is just inept? 

I think it is more of the inept piece.If the last rumor around a west coast team trade is true,it is very disturbing.We will never know the specifics,but I'm hoping it wasn't a DW or Dundon decision that we may of been over paying. For God's sake we have the cap.Dundon has reached out to other NHL teams to review their operations for ideas so there is that. I believe that many of the trade potentials of the past came down to players not having the Canes on their preferred list. I think the only way the Canes are going to acquire a few top 6 players is to overpay either through adding additional picks or AHL assets with our C+ or B- Nhl talent in a trade or to overpay in the FA market.If the GM cant get it done evern with an overpay situation,then it's time for a new GM.

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Barring some sort of sudden turn around, and if this team starts to gain some more space between it and the last WC spot, then we need a new GM as soon as possible. I have no idea if Waddell is better than we think. But it certainly sounds like he was about the only guy in the hockey world willing to be TD's GM, and only after being asked 3 times. We also know that he does come in with a great C.V. of building winners. He came here for a nice business job of running the business side, and suddenly he's GM, reluctantly at that. 

 

The GM decision though, could be key. I tend to agree with bluedevilcane on this one. First, a strong GM would lessen concerns that we are being run by a novice owner. Second, the new GM could make the coaching decision. Third, a new GM would wash the Skinner move out as it would not be his, fourth, as BDC has pointed out, we need to make a deal or two, and the committee has not shown any great aptitude for this, and I'm thinking Waddell has not really won or even tied a lot of his trades in Atlanta. Fifth, this whole thing needs a scrub down, and the quickest way to buy some credibility is to reverse the whole bizarre debacle that was that GM search and fail mission complete with it's lowball rumors, by installing a new GM (preferably a younger up and coming guy from a winning organization). 

 

I'm sure there are more reasons, but I'm still tired from listening to all of that Brass Bonanza over on the GDT for tomorrow.

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1 hour ago, KJUNKANE said:

Therein lies the problem, you are going to appear to be a raving lunatic because there's no proof, thus further ostracizing you from the closed society? Better to just grin and bare it. And hope that you might gain a friend or two? 

There’s gotta be paper and phone trails there

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33 minutes ago, remkin said:

 

 

 

I'm sure there are more reasons, but I'm still tired from listening to all of that Brass Bonanza over on the GDT for tomorrow.

Glad I could be of assistance ;)

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1 hour ago, slapshot02 said:

My only complaint with TT is that he needs to shoot more. Always looks to make a perfect pass for a higher percentage shot when he already has a clear shot. He likes to get the goalie moving for another shot when at times he is at point blank range.

I agree, but (as you know ) that's how playmakers think. Unfortunately, TT is as good a playmaker as he is a shooter, and I agree he is still figuring out which option is the better one in given situations. But I do think he's figuring it out. He just turned 24, the start of most forwards' prime. (Lindholm turned 24 last December). We haven't seen chemistry like that between TT and Aho in a very long time here, if ever--and Aho is still a couple years from his prime. 

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I would just reiterate that to me we need to keep our forward skill. We've just lost two skilled guys in Skinner and Lindholm. 

 

I'm reminded of the line from the classic Monty Python and the Holy Grail about the castle in the swamp that kept sinking in but finally stayed up, where the father tells the son that his bride to be has huge...tracts of land. And the son says, "but I don't want land". And the father says, "Son, we live in a swamp. We need all the land we can get." 

 

OK that was a long way to go, but we are forward skill deprived, we need all the forward skill we can get. TT has it. He is more of a complementary guy but a high end one who could complement the heck out of the right linemates. 

 

I'm opening up to the idea of trading Staal. I love his possession, his defense, and so on, and I'd love him on our third line, but he just doesn't have the scorer's touch and he might fetch something. Rask too. 

 

Anyways, keep the forward elite talent: Aho, TT, Svech and Necas at the very least. Personally I like what Ferland brings, and even like Martinook on the 3-4th line as a keeper. I still think Foegele will tick up. PGD and McGinn have really started to look like perma grinders with a slight 3rd line upside. 

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38 minutes ago, remkin said:

I'm opening up to the idea of trading Staal. I love his possession, his defense, and so on, and I'd love him on our third line, but he just doesn't have the scorer's touch and he might fetch something. Rask too. 

 

I'm more open to somebody that pushes him to the third line, for good.

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6 minutes ago, coastal_caniac said:

 

I'm more open to somebody that pushes him to the third line, for good.

I'm good with either option, whichever makes us better. I believe paying a third line C $6 million a year is the stuff TD's nightmares are made of, despite the obvious upside, if you strengthen the top 6 enough to make the dance. Old guys become young again in the second season, and having Jordan in the room and on the ice would be great. The problem is I doubt we get there before his trade value is at its lowest.  

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8 hours ago, top-shelf-1 said:

You (well, your "good buddy in Chicago") were wrong then, and you ("he") are wrong now. Turbo has been incredibly consistent, and only getting better, throughout his time here, despite an ever-changing cast of characters on his opposite flank. He's on pace for 60-plus points (again) this year, on one of the most offensively impotent teams in hockey. When he's not scoring goals he is putting up primary assists, and vice versa. If you don't believe me, you could look it up--but seeing as you can never be bothered to do that, despite the convenience of the internet (hint, you're on it right now) I won't hold my breath.

 

Fake news.  There are multiple night where he is invisible. 

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2 hours ago, slapshot02 said:

I think it is more of the inept piece.If the last rumor around a west coast team trade is true,it is very disturbing.We will never know the specifics,but I'm hoping it wasn't a DW or Dundon decision that we may of been over paying. For God's sake we have the cap.Dundon has reached out to other NHL teams to review their operations for ideas so there is that. I believe that many of the trade potentials of the past came down to players not having the Canes on their preferred list. I think the only way the Canes are going to acquire a few top 6 players is to overpay either through adding additional picks or AHL assets with our C+ or B- Nhl talent in a trade or to overpay in the FA market.If the GM cant get it done evern with an overpay situation,then it's time for a new GM.

 

I'm guessing that limiting trade issues may not be as much related to "overpay" or salary cap issues as they are to what teams want in return for the level of player we're after.  E.g., on another board they were discussing what the Blues would need in return for Tarasenko.  Slavin's name came up, but they knew that wasn't going to happen.  So most Blues fans insisted on one of our better d-men not named Slavin, along with Necas and a plus.  Given that Tarasenko is a legit star, the value may have been close, but I can't see giving up Necas (other than Aho, probably our only likely chance at a top 6 center) and his ELC as part of a package for a 27yo wing, even one as good as Tarasenko.  Or an unprotected #1 pick with Hughes out there and us looking to be in the lottery (what must Ottawa fans be feeling like right about now?:o)  But I understand the Blues perspective; if they're giving up a star they want a return that at least has a good chance of producing a star, and from us that's Necas or an unprotected first, which Dundon has said he won't part with.

 

I know you need to give to get.  But it seems like unless there's an underlying personal reason to move a high end player most teams are looking for something comparably high end In return rather than a "package".  And it seems like the few pieces we have that fit into the "high end" category fill key spots that we can't afford to lose.  I could see us being willing to slightly overpay, but only as part of a package, and I wonder if that limits our ability to close a deal for the type player we're trying to bring in?   

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5 hours ago, KJUNKANE said:

Something is really nagging at me, and while we indulge from time to time in conspiracy theories around here, I'd like to throw this out. I'm not sure where in the rather closed society that is the Hockey World our 2 leaders, Dundon and Waddell, are perceived, but WHAT IF Dundon's obvious disdain for "tradition" has been taken as an affront and a sort of "black ball" mindset, obviously not publicized, now exists? Could this be why it's been so difficult to consummate any trades so far? Think of the snippets we've heard so far this season, We put together a better package for a goalie than another team yet the goalie is traded to that team; or An eleventh hour trade with a western conference team that falls thru? I'd hate to think that some collusion exists, yet I wouldn't put it past some of these Old School owners. Now I know we hear how hard trades are to make, but for me, it seems like we are always on the cusp but never succeed?

 

On the other hand, it also is quite possible that our GM is just inept? 

It's the GM  ,  If  there is anyone here who is more ANTI   don waddell  on these forums i would sure like to meet them cause in my opinion it is me  who has been screaming at the top of my lungs to  Fire Don Waddell !     He is  as bad as mike milbury  .   he destroys teams and leaves them to rot for years on end .   

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1 hour ago, LakeLivin said:

 

I'm guessing that limiting trade issues may not be as much related to "overpay" or salary cap issues as they are to what teams want in return for the level of player we're after.  E.g., on another board they were discussing what the Blues would need in return for Tarasenko.  Slavin's name came up, but they knew that wasn't going to happen.  So most Blues fans insisted on one of our better d-men not named Slavin, along with Necas and a plus.  Given that Tarasenko is a legit star, the value may have been close, but I can't see giving up Necas (other than Aho, probably our only likely chance at a top 6 center) and his ELC as part of a package for a 27yo wing, even one as good as Tarasenko.  Or an unprotected #1 pick with Hughes out there and us looking to be in the lottery (what must Ottawa fans be feeling like right about now?:o)  But I understand the Blues perspective; if they're giving up a star they want a return that at least has a good chance of producing a star, and from us that's Necas or an unprotected first, which Dundon has said he won't part with.

 

I know you need to give to get.  But it seems like unless there's an underlying personal reason to move a high end player most teams are looking for something comparably high end In return rather than a "package".  And it seems like the few pieces we have that fit into the "high end" category fill key spots that we can't afford to lose.  I could see us being willing to slightly overpay, but only as part of a package, and I wonder if that limits our ability to close a deal for the type player we're trying to bring in?   

When I refer to overpay I include salary,existing NHL assets,AHL assets and draft picks. Salary should be a non issue when it comes to UFAs as our CAP is a non issue. I read many of the Blues forums this morning as well and I would pull the trigger on many of their proposed deals. This organization flaw for years under RF and now DW is that we never want to give up potential AHL nuggets along with existing NHL talent for existing proven high end talent.At some point that is a gamble you have to take to make your team better today.We can continue to wait for AHL talent to develop which may take years or maybe not at all or you can improve your team today.Some and perhaps many would say Faulk,Necas and a first round pick is way to much of an overpay for Terasanko. I say pull the trigger.We have the D Assets,we loose Faulk's salary,we do loose a great AHL asset and a first round pick but we gain a 60 pt guy, a PP asset,someone who goes to the net. Cant keep holding nuggets hoping they turn to gold bars. 

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8 hours ago, surfzone365 said:

We have a talent gap and a coaching situation that is in over its head. A trade or two is a step in the right direction 

I think we also have a management situation that is in over its head as well.

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Getting hard to watch.  I've been onboard with the rebuild, but then we trade 2 5th overall picks and a top goal scorer for basically nothing.  The coach doesn't have much to work with, be he has a real knack for getting the least out of what he has.  

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I hope someone in Canes management reads this-or Admin please pass this on- whoever came up with the “Whalers night” WTH- really what are you building here - my team is the Carolina Hurricanes - TD your actions are speaking louder than your words...GM-Waddell ? Trades-Skinner/Lindy...2 NHL players for AHL (possibly) players ? You don’t renew the voice of the Canes Chuck K -but then have dumb Whalers Night ? I think I get it-you’re in it for the money-me...I’m in it to win it - I had tickets for tomorrow’s game-until it became “whalers night” I’m not going -got my email as a STM “reserve your Whalers Jersey” didn’t reserve it- not my team- hope you make a ton of money with your “whalers night” as a Canes fan I really hope you start really investing in our team...you purchased the CAROLINA HURRICANES- and right now with they way they are struggling tomorrow should be tons of fun for them- “let’s play in a jersey of a team that doesn’t even exist” smart move owner 🤦🏻‍♀️

Edited by Pkling40
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57 minutes ago, Pkling40 said:

I hope someone in Canes management reads this-or Admin please pass this on- whoever came up with the “Whalers night” WTH- really what are you building here - my team is the Carolina Hurricanes - TD your actions are speaking louder than your words...GM-Waddell ? Trades-Skinner/Lindy...2 NHL players for AHL (possibly) players ? You don’t renew the voice of the Canes Chuck K -but then have dumb Whalers Night ? I think I get it-you’re in it for the money-me...I’m in it to win it - I had tickets for tomorrow’s game-until it became “whalers night” I’m not going -got my email as a STM “reserve your Whalers Jersey” didn’t reserve it- not my team- hope you make a ton of money with your “whalers night” as a Canes fan I really hope you start really investing in our team...you purchased the CAROLINA HURRICANES- and right now with they way they are struggling tomorrow should be tons of fun for them- “let’s play in a jersey of a team that doesn’t even exist” smart move owner 🤦🏻‍♀️

Post of the month. Maybe the year so far. When did we last see Tommy? Since this team turned into a s*** show, he’s been scarce. Since he loves the Whalers thing, maybe he’ll show up tomorrow. Keep working the gimmicks, Tom. Can’t wait for the outdoor game. That’s much more enticing than doing something to field a competitive team. But after attending tonight’s beat down, here’s some advice. Schedule the outdoor game against the Penguins. Otherwise, you may see what a hockey game looks like with 10,000 people in Carter Finley stadium.

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I'm with the above 2.  You forgot burning the organ and instead playing tape loops that Larry did in 1999.

 

But no worries, our enhanced fan experience now includes a Stormy* that can dance with the girls.

 

Screw this green.  No way on earth would I buy any of it.

 

* - For the record, I like that the new Stormy can dance.  Can't skate though.  Oh well.  So we're even on Stormy-isms.  Not an enhancement.

Edited by wxray1

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Its Whalers day! 

 

Jeopardy question: "Why didnt the Carolina Hurricanes invest new monies in its team in 2018?"  Answer: They used the monies to purchase GREEN WHALER Uniforms!  WOOT!

 

I think its a great comparison.  Now lets look at it a bit deeper for you young pups that may just now be tuning in:

 

  1. The Whalers only played in the NHL for 20 years.  Thats right Puppies equal or just a wee bit less than the Carolina team. (they were a WHL team prior)
  2. In 20 years that glorious Franchise from Hartford managed to win 1 - Thats right 1 playoff series only
  3. They managed to score more goals for than against just 4 times in 20 years. 
  4. THEY FINISHED HIGHER THAN 4th in the Adams/Northeast/Norris 1 time in 20 years

Now I am not putting down anyone that is a fan of the Whale.  In fact I applaud anyone that is loyal to a team. Particularly a team that was so unifomaly bad for so long (does this resemble anything current in history?  Anyone? Anyone?)

 

However - I have to take may hat off to current Carolina Hurricanes owners and the GM to want to pay homage to a team known as a 0.500% perennial winning team over an NHL carreer thats not as long or as winning as the Carolina Hurricanes are now after 20 years in Raleigh.

 

In some circles they strive to exceed mediocrity.

 

Here we celebrate it.

 

Embrace subpar and average and lets bring home the "Participation Chalice" this year!

 

Go Whale!

 

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Our owner knows nothing about hockey and has done everything in his power to give the middle finger to all of the respected GMs and hockey owners out there. Why would any other team want to even consider a trade that would help him? (Unless he makes a laughing stock deal like giving Skinner away for a bag of Puu.  I love the Canes and always will but he has turned us into a joke. This Whaler night is joke in my opinion. 

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Hope for the season is pretty much gone.  This team is once again lost in something just below mediocrity.  All the talk from TD about winning turned out to be nothing more than hot air, and this Canes team is nothing more than the teams of years past that sucked.

 

Hurricanes fans deserve better than this.  I would love to see a Boycott Night where not one fan shows up.  

 

 

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Why are ya'll surprised that this team is done?  It has the lowest payroll in the league in a division with Washington, Pitt, NYR.  Team will have to spend more to be competitive. 

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14 hours ago, slapshot02 said:

When I refer to overpay I include salary,existing NHL assets,AHL assets and draft picks. Salary should be a non issue when it comes to UFAs as our CAP is a non issue. I read many of the Blues forums this morning as well and I would pull the trigger on many of their proposed deals. This organization flaw for years under RF and now DW is that we never want to give up potential AHL nuggets along with existing NHL talent for existing proven high end talent.At some point that is a gamble you have to take to make your team better today.We can continue to wait for AHL talent to develop which may take years or maybe not at all or you can improve your team today.Some and perhaps many would say Faulk,Necas and a first round pick is way to much of an overpay for Terasanko. I say pull the trigger.We have the D Assets,we loose Faulk's salary,we do loose a great AHL asset and a first round pick but we gain a 60 pt guy, a PP asset,someone who goes to the net. Cant keep holding nuggets hoping they turn to gold bars. 

 

We're mostly in agreement.  The one place we're not is Necas.  I don't view him as just a great AHL asset, I view him as our best (and perhaps only) hope, along with Aho, as a legit top 6 NHL center, something we'll need in order to become long term Cup contenders imo.  If I thought someone like Tarasenko was the one missing piece to get us to the next level, I might be more willing to roll the dice on trying to find a long term legit top 6 center elsewhere.  But I don't think he alone gets it done, plus he's 27 years old and will likely start to decline by the time we are legit Cup contenders (I'm thinking we could do it in 2-3 years).  

 

Make no mistake, I'd also love to get Tarasenko, and am willing to "overpay", but not if it includes Slavin, Aho, Svech, or Necas.  I view them as the backbone of a team that could be competitive long term.  We have a huge scoring hole we need to fill, but giving up one of those opens up a different hole that would be just as difficult to fill imo.  Given our struggle to find centers, I'm rolling the dice that having Necas for 10 years through his prime ultimately proves more valuable to the Canes than having Tarasenko from 28-31 years old. .

 

Having said that, we're in agreement about needing to cash in some of the very good young assets RF stockpiled in exchange for more immediate help now.

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15 minutes ago, LakeLivin said:

 

We're mostly in agreement.  The one place we're not is Necas.  I don't view him as just a great AHL asset, I view him as our best (and perhaps only) hope, along with Aho, as a legit top 6 NHL center, something we'll need in order to become long term Cup contenders imo.  If I thought someone like Tarasenko was the one missing piece to get us to the next level, I might be more willing to roll the dice on trying to find a long term legit top 6 center elsewhere.  But I don't think he alone gets it done, plus he's 27 years old and will likely start to decline by the time we are legit Cup contenders (I'm thinking we could do it in 2-3 years).  

 

Make no mistake, I'd also love to get Tarasenko, and am willing to "overpay", but not if it includes Slavin, Aho, Svech, or Necas.  I view them as the backbone of a team that could be competitive long term.  We have a huge scoring hole we need to fill, but giving up one of those opens up a different hole that would be just as difficult to fill imo.  Given our struggle to find centers, I'm rolling the dice that having Necas for 10 years through his prime ultimately proves more valuable to the Canes than having Tarasenko from 28-31 years old. .

 

Having said that, we're in agreement about needing to cash in some of the very good young assets RF stockpiled in exchange for more immediate help now.

I'd never give away Aho,Svech,Slavin,but would consider Necas. Is he going to be elite? Perhaps, Is he going to be a super AHL talent,perhaps. He is going to have to bulk up and get tougher or he is going to be steam rolled in the NHL. The fan base has been waiting for 10 years for our "potential" to develop. It's time for a different approach to speed up the process and acquire proven talent.Im not saying to totally giving away the farm system but there has to be a blend of youth and proven talent to be competative until the farm matures.Continually playing the waiting game will drive your fan base away especially the seasoned base who has gone a decade without any major deals.At this pace my grandkids may see a competative product if they even still reside in Raleigh. TD and DW need to get on the same page and do their job and do whatever it takes to acquire talent. That may mean to start spending a little closer to the Cap ceiling, but if you truly want to be a contender that's what Owners and GMs are responsible for. TD,selling T shirts and having an outdoor game isn't cutting it.

Edited by slapshot02
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