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Well it is good news that the sky has not fallen on Fox, and I agree a mid first rounder or bust. 

 

To me the playoffs just make all Canes talk that much easier and sweeter!

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40 minutes ago, super_dave_1 said:

Make the playoffs for the first time in a decade last night. Kvetch about Fox today.

 

and they say we can't multi-task. Another non traditional hockey market myth disproved.

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Calgary was eliminated in a blowout to the Avs last night, and lost its series 4-1.  After its fast start and domination of the Western Conference, much was said about the Calgary/Carolina trade and coaching changes.

For the record, since Jan 1 the Canes have been the better team.  It isn't possible to make a definitive judgement on the trade, even now, because of ongoing variables, such as Fox's status and trade return value, Ferland's future, and Hamilton signing an extension.  

I do know, at least for me, that since the night Elias Lindholm dissed the Canes and their fans after the Storm Surge, I did not care how far they went.  The culture of the Canes locker room and fandom was forever changed for the better with the changes, and the future looks bright.

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I know people have been posting about this elsewhere, but this is the player movement thread and I can't be searching everywhere for it.

 

Ferland. I don't know what Tripp was talking about when he said he wouldn't put Ferland back in even if he could go, but I do think that Ferland's days in Raleigh are pretty much over. It's too bad because he is the type of player we want, and he is yet another piece of that trade that is seemingly frittered away (Fox talk has died down, and we might at least get something for him in a trade, and luckily for the most part Hamilton has delivered). But it just does not seem meant to be.

 

The injury ended up being the deal killer probably. But there were problems either way. If he had not been injured, and kept his pace up on the top line, he'd be priced out of us keeping him, probably by a lot. But the injury took him out, and when he was back he could not find his way onto that top line, and he could not produce offense on the third line. From his point of view, it had to stink watching your once sky-high value first drop, then probably drop a lot while you play with guys who don't create offense. From our point of view, we could have gotten a draft pick for him, but we kept him and didn't get good value on that decision so far. He did hit, he did fight, he was worth having, but he did not produce with no goals since returning from his injury. 

 

Injuries are tough. We have no idea how limiting it might be. No idea. We like to spout off about he should be playing, he's saving himself, but we have no idea. If he wanted to be traded at the deadline and/or has let his demotion off the top line get in his head, then that is an issue. I can see it, but it will get in the way in that he probably doesn't feel the love to stay here. 

 

But signing a pending UFA requires interest from both sides, and then agreement of value on both sides. That just seems so unlikely now. I'd still want the guy, but almost certainly not for what he thinks (and he might be right) he'll get. I really don't blame him for trying to get max value. Most likely he's in the mindset that he'd stay here, but it only makes sense to skip the UFA market if you feel you're getting a great deal to stay. I can't imagine that's what we're offering. And we probably see that he's injury prone, but also, he is a very very good complementary player in the NHL. He can produce points and round out a top line, but he does not create much on his own. So you really can't pay him like a guy who does. 

 

I think Ferland is a guy we should try to keep. I don't know what sort of off ice issues might be there, but mainly if the guy doesn't want to be here, he'll be gone anyway. So, assuming he wants to stay, this is a guy who can put up 50 points and 20 goals while wrecking balling the other team. He, along with Martinook, Foegele, and somewhat Nino, and McGinn all bring grit with some offense that nicely balances this team's high end skill out. But only at value. With Foegele showing now, and Nino on board, even though I like Ferland, we don't need him as much either. 

 

The price we'd pay to keep him is dropping faster than his probable UFA value, and even more from what he probably thinks he's worth. At this point (things could change if we move on and Ferland steps up), it's hard to imagine Ferland here next year.  

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I really hope Ferland is keeping his arm attached with Gorilla glue and bailing wire. I hope he's taking about half a bottle of Advil to manage the pain. If not, he should be playing. There are untold examples of guys playing through injuries during the playoffs, and unless Ferland is injured to the point where he can't function, he needs to suck it up, and play through the pain. He played well before Christmas, but his play was really up and down during the Canes surge in the second half. This might be one instance where the team could be a bit more transparent with their injury reports. On the surface, it looks like Ferland might not be totally committed to the team, but nobody really knows how seriously he could be hurt.

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18 hours ago, caniac6 said:

I really hope Ferland is keeping his arm attached with Gorilla glue and bailing wire. I hope he's taking about half a bottle of Advil to manage the pain. If not, he should be playing. There are untold examples of guys playing through injuries during the playoffs, and unless Ferland is injured to the point where he can't function, he needs to suck it up, and play through the pain. He played well before Christmas, but his play was really up and down during the Canes surge in the second half. This might be one instance where the team could be a bit more transparent with their injury reports. On the surface, it looks like Ferland might not be totally committed to the team, but nobody really knows how seriously he could be hurt.

I am assuming he will need surgery after the season is over for some type of shoulder injury. Anyone think he is regretting not taking the Canes initial offer (something like 5x5?)

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21 hours ago, caniac6 said:

I really hope Ferland is keeping his arm attached with Gorilla glue and bailing wire. I hope he's taking about half a bottle of Advil to manage the pain. If not, he should be playing. There are untold examples of guys playing through injuries during the playoffs, and unless Ferland is injured to the point where he can't function, he needs to suck it up, and play through the pain. He played well before Christmas, but his play was really up and down during the Canes surge in the second half. This might be one instance where the team could be a bit more transparent with their injury reports. On the surface, it looks like Ferland might not be totally committed to the team, but nobody really knows how seriously he could be hurt.

 

Gorilla glue and bailing wire?  I'm thinking duct tape.  If the injury is such that he's got a slim chance of being able to finish a game, next man up makes more sense and putting himself into the lineup would be almost irresponsible. Hopefully at some point we'll get an idea of the actual situation.   

 

2 hours ago, cane-addict-1 said:

I am assuming he will need surgery after the season is over for some type of shoulder injury. Anyone think he is regretting not taking the Canes initial offer (something like 5x5?)

 

Yup..

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Luke Decock says Fox has been traded.  

 

Will provide details as they come apparent 

 

*Edit: In SuRpRiSiNg news he is going to the Rangers

 

*2nd edit for the NYR's 2nd round choice and a conditional 3rd next year.  Its the 37th pick for those keeping track. We have the 36th and 37th picks.

 

Trade ends up being:

 

Hamilton, A year of Ferland, and NYR's 2nd and a conditional 3rd

 

for 

 

Lindholm and Hanifin

 

Kind of a let down.  

 

*3rd edit, the conditional 3rd becomes a 2nd if he plays 30 games next season

Edited by gocanes0506
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15 minutes ago, coastal_caniac said:

Good on the Canes.  I'm surprised we got that much for him - 37th overall in this draft and a conditional third if he signs.  Not bad, not bad at all.

we get a 3rd.  It becomes a 2nd rounder in 2020 if he plays 30 games next year.  Rangers have already got the ELC done.

Edited by gocanes0506
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I have seriously mixed feelings about this.

 

I wanted this guy on our team. I know our D is really good and we have Bean in the wings. But the upside on this guy is Cale Makar.

 

I predict this guy will be good enough that a "fair" trade would be a top half first rounder.

 

However, contrary to Waddell's proclamation after the trade last year, we were having trouble signing him, and as I type, I see that he was demanding the Rangers. Frankly I'm so sick of that. How have the Rangers not won 5 cups in the past 15 years since they get to keep picking up UFAs and College guys at will.

 

It is a high second rounder. And we are compiling picks. It almost never happens, but if we could package this pick our other extra picks and our first rounder and move up....I want that every year, and it never happens, but being a high second rounder can matter.

 

We got something of value, so it's not a bust, but the odds that Adam Fox becomes a household name vs. whomever gets picked at 35 is pretty one sided, so I can't really do a happy dance. At least it's over.

 

 

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8 minutes ago, remkin said:

I have seriously mixed feelings about this.

 

I wanted this guy on our team. I know our D is really good and we have Bean in the wings. But the upside on this guy is Cale Makar.

 

I predict this guy will be good enough that a "fair" trade would be a top half first rounder.

 

However, contrary to Waddell's proclamation after the trade last year, we were having trouble signing him, and as I type, I see that he was demanding the Rangers. Frankly I'm so sick of that. How have the Rangers not won 5 cups in the past 15 years since they get to keep picking up UFAs and College guys at will.

 

It is a high second rounder. And we are compiling picks. It almost never happens, but if we could package this pick our other extra picks and our first rounder and move up....I want that every year, and it never happens, but being a high second rounder can matter.

 

We got something of value, so it's not a bust, but the odds that Adam Fox becomes a household name vs. whomever gets picked at 35 is pretty one sided, so I can't really do a happy dance. At least it's over.

 

 

Considering the situation, this feels like a good return.  The Canes get a high 2nd round pick, and if Fox plays 30 games next season, the 3rd round pick turns into a 2nd round pick.  Supposedly the 2019 draft is deep, so this year's pick may be as good as a late 1st rounder in most years.  The Canes have done very well in choosing picks from round 2 and beyond.  For example, Aho, Faulk, Pesce, Slavin, Foegle, Wallmark, and McGinn all fit that mold.  With Bean and McKewon NHL ready, was Fox really going to be a good fit on this squad?  I applaud management, given the trade restrictions of "Rangers or bust", for getting this return.

Edited by beboplar

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He is likely to play for the Rangers next year as part of their rebuild, so we probably get another 2nd in 2020. Obviously, he has wanted to be a Ranger all along; but our embarrassment of riches on D could have made him question how long it would take to get to the "show" with us. We have at least 2 NHL ready D stuck in Charlotte, and Fleury can't crack the lineup with the Canes.

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44 minutes ago, remkin said:

It is a high second rounder. And we are compiling picks. It almost never happens, but if we could package this pick our other extra picks and our first rounder and move up....I want that every year, and it never happens, but being a high second rounder can matter

We got Aho and Faulk and a few others in the second round...just sayin.

 

Like the return for the trade, but I’m sick and tired of these prospects with ZERO NHL experience under their belt having all the leverage.  To me, this guy is another Jack Johnson...*edit* him!

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Glad this "distraction" is over.  Hope to pound his donkey 1st chance we get.  Like Hedican said one memorable game when people got up to leave when we got scored on late. Parpahrasing:  "we dont need that kind of player here".  i.e he don't wanna be here then good riddance.  BTW Jack Johnson dissed us and he is 1 minus 113 career.

 

BTW we came back and won that game with people beating on the doors to get back in.

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Let's just win the Cup this year and let him know that we have won 2 Cups since the Rangers last one.

 

That way we can tell, Jack Johnson, er I mean Adam Fox that he chose poorly.

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My wish is that the Canes win the cup and Fox becomes Jack Johnson 2.0. 

 

I think it sets a terrible precedent for guys who don’t like their drafted team to pressure trades, especially the college route guys.

 

Best we got something for him but part of me wishes we’d made him dig in and return to Harvard for his final year.

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4 minutes ago, AWACSooner said:

We got Aho and Faulk and a few others in the second round...just sayin.

 

Like the return for the trade, but I’m sick and tired of these prospects with ZERO NHL experience under their belt having all the leverage.  To me, this guy is another Jack Johnson...*edit* him!

My feeling too. Hope it turns out just as well for Fox as it did for JJ. Rangers are on the early side of a rebuild.

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Btw, TSN is reporting he told the Flames last summer that he wouldn’t sign with them either, which is why he was packaged in the deal...so that’s TWO teams he spurned!

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Tens of thousands of players dream to make it to the Chel, and these Prima Donnas with zero big league experience are dictating where they wanna go....

 

Adding Fox to my Shiet List, where he will sit comfortably next to Orpik and JJohnson.

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I think when you draft a guy you should be able to have him undercontract to you for 3 seasons. So if he doesnt sign with you until 4 years after the draft he still owes you 3 years.

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