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In-season trades and player moves

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On 12/23/2018 at 3:22 PM, gocanes0506 said:

I love all the experts’ opinions about the committee that dont leak things, have been together 6 months, and made 3 moves.  

I get they are the face of the franchise now but they haven’t ruined the team or been a part of it for this decade of misery.  

 

The team isn’t drastically worse. We are on pace to score less but also give up less goals than last season. 22 less goals scored, 17 less goals given up.   Minor drop in points per pace. 79 to 83 last season.

TD made the single largest investment in a FA that we’ve made since about ever.  18 million on a FA doesn’t happen around here. 

RBA could suck. He could also not suck. BP was seen as a ‘meh’ coach but has done well with a roster.  So who knows?  

I’m far from an expert but have an opinion. At least when Ronnie was GM we had someone to hold accountable for failures and praise for success. I was never a fan of the Waddell hire, and am still not. It speaks volumes that no one in the NHL offered him a hockey operations job after the Thrashers. Rick Dudley: more of the same. So they signed de Haan. Credit where credit is due. Martinook trade also looks very good. BUT ... since the end of last season they have failed to accomplish the obvious need to trade D for offense. The Skinner trade made no sense and looks ridiculous now. Darling. Where would we be if McElhinney had not fallen in our lap? Aho signed? No. TT signed? No. If Ferland walks, we have Dougie Hamilton and a possibility of signing Fox to show for letting two top 5 overall picks go. Why? Because our new owner and his braintrust did not want to pay them. What I see is a common theme: didn’t want to pay Lindholm, Hanifin, a GM or a proven coach. We have the lowest payroll and the results to show for it. So that’s a quick summary of why I’m tired of the “committee.”

 

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22 minutes ago, bluedevilcane said:

Brandon Sutter also went in the trade for Staal. I do think there are teams that are strong down the middle and  would love to have Staal for the role he played so well in Pittsburgh. Maybe not for $6 million, though Pittsburgh supposedly offered him the same contract he signed in Carolina.

Much like Wesley we over paid for Staal because of one strong season of offense.  

Edited by gocanes0506

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5 hours ago, gocanes0506 said:

Much like Wesley we over paid for Staal because of one strong season of offense.  

 

If that is what it takes to win a cup.  Then it was money well invested.  I for one am of the opinion that Orpiks's hit on Cole really set him back as a PF thus hurting Staal's production.  Still got a cup though.  So there is that.

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1 hour ago, bluedevil58 said:

 

If that is what it takes to win a cup.  Then it was money well invested.  I for one am of the opinion that Orpiks's hit on Cole really set him back as a PF thus hurting Staal's production.  Still got a cup though.  So there is that.

I probably should have put the J in front on Staal for clarity.  JR traded 3 first rounders to Boston for Glen Wesley after he had one strong offensive season.  JR jumped on Jordan to get him a year early after his one strong O season.  Both trades were overpayments and neither player returned to their previous offensive output.

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On 12/24/2018 at 11:40 AM, remkin said:

All judgements are transient always. We could still be waiting out Francis, or JR for that matter. We can only judge the committee by what has transpired to this point. I can see a future where they get Jack Hughes, flip Faulk or Pesce and a couple of prospects for a top line forward and a top goalie. I can also see a future where they let Ferland walk over his contract, let Fox slip away, end up in the mushy middle picking around #13, and keep waiting for that D for O deal that Francis wasn't the only one unable to pull off. 

 

So we only know what we know: Owner fires coach and GM. In the search for both, he makes it clear that he will be micromanaging things and probably will pay about 1/2 the going GM rate. Despite NHL GM being a massively sought after, incredibly rare club to get into, no one wants to be his GM, so after he begs Waddell three times, we get our reluctant GM. They then pull in a past retirement age close friend of Waddell, who, like Waddell has lots of time in NHL management without lots of success. 

 

Then the head coach. Again, an inside hire. A guy with lots of heart, but whose entire coaching experience is being on the bench for this same organization at only one level, and part of all of that losing that we supposedly let players go for being part of. Then his assistants are added from inside too. 

 

The committee did win the ping pong balls. Just imagine if they hadn't though. What would this team look like sans Svechnikov? Makes one think. 

 

The committee then decided to double down on a goalie who was, no exaggeration, the single worst goalie in the NHL. Fair to say that was a fail. A fail that cost actual games and points. At least they figured that out finally.

 

They then made a blockbuster trade. Too soon to grade that one. It really could go either way. We gave up two top 5 draft picks, but will we re sign Ferland? Will we sign Fox? Will Dougie find his way on his new team? Incomplete.

 

Then the committee got really antsy and itchy pants and decided that the one thing that simply could not wait for the right deal? Getting a goalie? No. Getting that forward for D? Nope. It was getting rid of Skinner no matter the cost. Could this year's flailing to score team have found some spot for a guy who put up 25 goals, on his worst years? Oh, but then we would have never gotten that first rounder for next years deep dra.....oh wait. We didn't get a first rounder. 

 

The committee did get DeHaan, who was an underrated solid pick up. The committee did pick up McE off waivers, though that was sort of a no brainer. And the committee did get Martinook, who has been better than advertised. 

 

While one never knows what people might have learned, it is still not unreasonable to be skeptical of Waddell and Dudley based on their lack of success despite years in the league. 

 

I'm not in any way saying that the committee approach with it's novice owner and all in house team, might not still pull it off.  They were presumably close to some big trade that fell through, and we appeared to be all in on Nylander. But until that sort of deal happens, it is as illusionary as it was under Francis. 

 

This team needed that trade at the latest two weeks ago. This team is flailing and despite the nice Whaler win, about to go under for the 13th straight time.

 

It is actually pretty easy to see a path for next year. Necas is better than people think. Svech will be a true star by next year. Aho will have learned to be an even better center. Foegele might even show another level. That D for O trade will simply have to happen. And we might win the lottery again. 

 

But I have been looking to next year for over a decade on these very boards. The idea of looking there again in JANUARY? Dundon is new to all of this, but that also means he hasn't suffered looking to next year, well really at all (unless you count last year). I have. So yeah, it colors my opinion of the committee. I'm still open to something turning that around. Not sure how much longer though.

Not so sure the "firings" of the brass was TD trying to shake up the organization or a mutually agreed upon parting of the ways. RF was never going to be a committee guy, BP leaves with one year remaining on his contract and enjoying Calgary, Steve Smith submits his resignation late in the off season and signs on with Buffalo. Can TD get seasoned coaches or GM's to buy into the Committee approach? I doubt it. 

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The Holiday trade freeze is over and speculation of a Hurricane move was something to keep an eye on was discussed by Darren Dreger. Spector Hockey talking about Dreger's appearance on TSN radio saying the Hurricanes will continue to be linked with a possible trade with the Maple Leafs, possible with an interest in Kaspari Kapanen.

 

Quote

Both sides appear to be slow-dancing toward a possible deal in the coming weeks. Then again, perhaps they’ll find other options

 

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Calling Don Waddell, Don where are you? Just saw your buddy, JR, signed Jake Guentzel to 5 year $30 mil deal so what have you done? Get off your lazy hind side and make something happen before we flush another season down the tubes. It likely is too late for this season unless we go on a miraculous tear, but you could show some signs of life for next season?

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1 hour ago, OBXer said:

The Holiday trade freeze is over and speculation of a Hurricane move was something to keep an eye on was discussed by Darren Dreger. Spector Hockey talking about Dreger's appearance on TSN radio saying the Hurricanes will continue to be linked with a possible trade with the Maple Leafs, possible with an interest in Kaspari Kapanen.

 

 

 

1 minute ago, cclifford10 said:

Yes to Kaspari Kapanen! How about Hamilton + for Kapanen and Ian Scott?

Although I'm not going to get my hopes up for ANY trade, Kapanen could be interesting, an all Finnish line?

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I have been holding this in for too long.   Time to let her go.......Rask and Hamilton need to go away.  I don't care where they go just go away.   My chest is clear.   

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3 minutes ago, snuffy72 said:

I have been holding this in for too long.   Time to let her go.......Rask and Hamilton need to go away.  I don't care where they go just go away.   My chest is clear.   

 

 

Hear!  Hear!

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14 minutes ago, reelpirate5 said:

It will be tough to make a trade that works for us.  The Canes have very few players producing at any level.  They could waive most of the team, and they would all clear. 

I wouldn't go so far as to say that, there are quite a few role-players that are having to play above their level. Teams that are missing a piece or two (or more, looking at you LA) would jump at the chance to pick up those said missing pieces and give up nothing in return.  

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FYI:

 

 

NICHOLS ON HOCKEY:  During an appearance yesterday on Toronto’s TSN 1050, Darren Dreger said the Carolina Hurricanes remain a club he’s keeping an eye on leading up to the NHL trade deadline. He notes Hurricanes GM Don Waddell has talked openly about their need to acquire a scorer, while team owner Tom Dundon said he doesn’t value or covet high-end defense when going into a draft. 

Dreger believes they’ll continue to link the Hurricanes with the Toronto Maple Leafs. He pointed out their previous interest in William Nylander before he re-signed with the Leafs, and they’re said to be interested in Leafs winger Kaspari Kapanen. 

SPECTOR’S NOTE: The two clubs seem, as Dreger pointed out, to be a good fit. The Leafs need to bolster their blueline, especially on the right side. The Hurricanes need scoring forwards. The Leafs have good young offensive forwards while the Hurricanes have depth in quality defensemen.

Both sides appear to be slow-dancing toward a possible deal in the coming weeks. Then again, perhaps they’ll find other options to address their respective needs. 

 

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7 hours ago, reelpirate5 said:

It will be tough to make a trade that works for us.  The Canes have very few players producing at any level.  They could waive most of the team, and they would all clear. 

A little exaggeration, but sadly close to the mark. Both our goalies would be claimed as backups. All of our roster D would be claimed. But the forwards. Bishop, Wallmark, Foegle, Kuokkanen, McGinn, and PDG might all go unclaimed. We have guys who should not be here, and guys (a couple not on that list) being asked to play roles they are not suited for. Then there’s Rask, who showed promise at one time, but now looks as lost as Scott Darling. We have a first line, a fourth line, and guys like Jordan and Martinook who have an NHL skill set, but it is not scoring goals.

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The above is my biggest complaint with our Org.. Everyone of those guys showed promise, yet none have taken that next step...we cant trade for, or develop players offensively..

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14 hours ago, bluedevilcane said:

A little exaggeration, but sadly close to the mark. Both our goalies would be claimed as backups. All of our roster D would be claimed. But the forwards. Bishop, Wallmark, Foegle, Kuokkanen, McGinn, and PDG might all go unclaimed. We have guys who should not be here, and guys (a couple not on that list) being asked to play roles they are not suited for. Then there’s Rask, who showed promise at one time, but now looks as lost as Scott Darling. We have a first line, a fourth line, and guys like Jordan and Martinook who have an NHL skill set, but it is not scoring goals.

Yes it was an intentional exaggeration.  Point is this team is in dire need of talent.  Just look at our centers for the Caps game.....Aho, Wallmark, Bishop, and Rask....that is just ugly, and not a recipe for success. 

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Getting rid of Lindholm and Skinner who are both at a PPG or better and in return ice Ferland and Martinook as offensive replacements was a grade F move. The committee was banking on Svech and Necas to fill the scoring point void which was an insane ask and strategy. It shows that Skins and Lindholm can play at a high level when line mates are a higher caliber. The goal needs to be a net add of offensive talent,not swapping out players. Dundon isn't a big believer in the UFA market but it is where this team needs to go to get better.Waiting for growth from Charlotte gets old, we dont have a lot of talent to accomplish a block buster trade. Not many teams are in the barn fire sale mode,most are looking to get better. Most dont want to include our high end potential in the AHL in a blockbuster trade along with a proven NHL player so how do you get a high end talent in a Canes uniform. Dundon has to get busy in the UFA market in the off season. We need a net add of 3 offensive players. Send PDG,Rask,McGinn Darling packing.

Edited by slapshot02

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3 minutes ago, KJUNKANE said:

So there you go, Zykov claimed by Vegas? So long.

 

What were the odds :letssee:. I think we had first crack at him so not picking him back up was an intentional decision. His one way contract probable worked against him for us.

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Just read on Twitter than McGinn and PDG put on waivers....  Any confirmation?

 

UPdate:   If he's on the top line with Turbo and Aho today, me thinks McGinn rumor is false...

Edited by ironman87

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