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gocanes0506

Canes will match offer Sheet on Aho 5yrs 8.45mil AAV

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3 hours ago, LakeLivin said:

In all fairness to Fleury he averaged 7:42 ice time in the playoffs (he did get only 3:31 in one game).  Saying he was only capable of playing 3 minutes (less than half the time he actually played) is misleading.  That doesn't negate your point; but no need to disparage the guy way more than 7:42 suggests, imo.

 

 

Fair enough.  I didn't look up his ice time - the 3 minute thing just stuck in my mind.  I'll edit.  I do stand by the rest, though.  🙂

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3 hours ago, top-shelf-1 said:

I guess we read different statements.

 

He knew he had limited options and he exercised them, and he said so. Trying to "blame" the agent or Aho--when there is nothing to blame them for--what's the point?

 

I get that a lot of guys think the players rule the roost and don't like it. I'm one of those who know they do and love it. As others have posted, owners' profits have increased at levels exponential to players' rewards. Fans who don't like that players are only trying to get some equivalency would change their tune after exactly one game pitting owners and trainers against GMs and PR people.

Whether athletes are overpaid or underpaid is a whole other discussion. I don't blame anybody for wanting a piece of the pie, but you have to think about what that means in terms of the cap percentage and how it can affect the depth of the team when too much of your money is tied up in one guy. I think $8.5mil AAV over 5 years is a reasonable number that could have been arrived at in normal negotiations. There's a lot of panic in Aho's statement that I don't feel was warranted considering negotiations hadn't been going on that long. It gave me the impression Aho's agent was whispering in his ear making him believe it would turn into another Nylander situation if he didn't sign the OS. That tactic didn't work on Point, so he moved on to Aho. I don't know why his agent was so gung-ho about getting a client to sign an OS, but he got his wish.

 

We're coming from different sides of the spectrum. You're looking at it purely from a business angle and I'm looking at it from an emotional angle. Aho's been touted as a guy that never wanted to leave Raleigh and wants to be the face of the team. Signing the offer sheet made both sides look bad because it made Aho look greedy and disloyal and the Canes look cheap and stubborn. Publicly TD, DW and Aho are saying they're satisfied with how everything ultimately worked out, so I hope it's true there's no bad blood behind the scenes. I also hope future RFA's don't use this as a template for how to conduct business because it might not work out as well a second time.

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19 minutes ago, Kaze said:

Whether athletes are overpaid or underpaid is a whole other discussion. I don't blame anybody for wanting a piece of the pie, but you have to think about what that means in terms of the cap percentage and how it can affect the depth of the team when too much of your money is tied up in one guy. I think $8.5mil AAV over 5 years is a reasonable number that could have been arrived at in normal negotiations. There's a lot of panic in Aho's statement that I don't feel was warranted considering negotiations hadn't been going on that long. It gave me the impression Aho's agent was whispering in his ear making him believe it would turn into another Nylander situation if he didn't sign the OS. That tactic didn't work on Point, so he moved on to Aho. I don't know why his agent was so gung-ho about getting a client to sign an OS, but he got his wish.

 

We're coming from different sides of the spectrum. You're looking at it purely from a business angle and I'm looking at it from an emotional angle. Aho's been touted as a guy that never wanted to leave Raleigh and wants to be the face of the team. Signing the offer sheet made both sides look bad because it made Aho look greedy and disloyal and the Canes look cheap and stubborn. Publicly TD, DW and Aho are saying they're satisfied with how everything ultimately worked out, so I hope it's true there's no bad blood behind the scenes. I also hope future RFA's don't use this as a template for how to conduct business because it might not work out as well a second time.

 

Well said.

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I will say this. Aho said it was important for him to be there Day 1 of camp, he had an option to move the process forward, and he took it. If we take him at his word, it is possible that he saw the writing on the wall as no RFA of the big time variety seems to want to go first, and it is possible that multiple players end up holding out for at least part of camp.  So far, Aho is the only one from the group of A listers who is now signed. If they all sign this week then his "panic" might have been overblown, but if they don't, and key players remain unsigned as camp starts and progresses, then this logic will look more correct. 

 

Also, no other RFA had a good offer to sign. Supposedly Montreal made a play for Point but he declined. I don't think we know the number though. 

 

Further, Aho had a relatively short window to decide to either engage this process or say no to the offer sheet. 

 

Finally, had he not signed the offer, he'd still be arguing over the term for who knows how long. 

 

In the end, outside of the term issue, I think this whole thing will very quickly fade into a trivia question. But it could actually turn into a positive for us if A. One or more RFA's sit out. B. The numbers on the other guys get crazy.

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Remkin, you are spot on. This episode could not have worked out any better for the both the team, and the player. if he didn't sign the offer sheet, the term fight could have gone on for months. I realize that the extra 3 years that the Canes wanted protects them from a bidding war 5 years from now; if Aho continues his rise. However, if we have to pay market value at that time; so be it. The Canes have plenty of time to prepare for that scenario. History has shown that the best high end UFA signings are your own UFA's. 

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One other thing. We showed the NHL we are not a soft target for offer sheets. Not only did we match, but Aho's response really makes Montreal look like fools IMO. Probably we don't get messed with again in the future. And this is probably not really a factor, but IMO we are now the only team in the league that can make an offer sheet without looking like we upset the order, since we had it done to us. 

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19 minutes ago, remkin said:

And this is probably not really a factor, but IMO we are now the only team in the league that can make an offer sheet without looking like we upset the order, since we had it done to us. 

Hence why I think we should go after Kyle Connor

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15 hours ago, Kaze said:

I don't know why his agent was so gung-ho about getting a client to sign an OS, but he got his wish.

You don't? To me, and admittedly this may be biased, but right now, Aho's agent has not necessarily endeared himself to Bunch of Jerks nation (not that he gives a rat's hinderland), but isn't it just possible that it ultimately was a selfish move, calculated to get his name out there with this sort of niche that he can now wave about attempting to attract new clients? Also, as this type of financial ploy appears to be in vogue (ie these short bridge deals), wouldn't that be an additional incentive to attract new clients. No, if I had to guess, this agent profited off this OS, not only in his commission, but also in potential clients and Aho was just duped?

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Problem with an offer sheet for Conner is that he will command at least 7M with term. We have a few more players to sign for 2019-20, including Williams. Conner would put us over the cap; and even if we could squeeze him in, the team has to think ahead and prepare for Svech in 2020-21.

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5 minutes ago, AssistantGM said:

Problem with an offer sheet for Conner is that he will command at least 7M with term. We have a few more players to sign for 2019-20, including Williams. Conner would put us over the cap; and even if we could squeeze him in, the team has to think ahead and prepare for Svech in 2020-21.

Marleau's 6.5 cap hit will disappear next offseason

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2 minutes ago, AssistantGM said:

Problem with an offer sheet for Conner is that he will command at least 7M with term. We have a few more players to sign for 2019-20, including Williams. Conner would put us over the cap; and even if we could squeeze him in, the team has to think ahead and prepare for Svech in 2020-21.

Although true, if the figures we have for these buyouts are accurate, we'll have over $10 mil extra when they are satisfied. That and we still don't know about Williams resigning, so that's another $4 mil? AND the Cap has to go up prior to then, so what I'm saying is if Connor is there, and he would sign off on an OS, then I'd jump at that?

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5 minutes ago, KJUNKANE said:

You don't? To me, and admittedly this may be biased, but right now, Aho's agent has not necessarily endeared himself to Bunch of Jerks nation (not that he gives a rat's hinderland), but isn't it just possible that it ultimately was a selfish move, calculated to get his name out there with this sort of niche that he can now wave about attempting to attract new clients? Also, as this type of financial ploy appears to be in vogue (ie these short bridge deals), wouldn't that be an additional incentive to attract new clients. No, if I had to guess, this agent profited off this OS, not only in his commission, but also in potential clients and Aho was just duped?

The merit of Aho's agent's action should be based upon his client's best interest.  Aho's best interest was served by him signing a 5 year offer sheet.  That is what his client wanted.  I don't believe there is ANY merit to the story he wanted to play in Montreal.  Aho would like to become a free agent at the height of his playing career, at about age 26-27.  He gets a front loaded contract at a fair market value at the term HE wanted.  Whether this scenario attracts future clients to the agent's harem is a secondary issue.  That said, his agent did a good job serving his client's needs.  Frankly, this is not bad for the Canes.  Aho is in training camp on Day 1, not like Nylander who showed up in Dec and took a couple of months to adjust.  Aho is gambling on himself to get better over these 5 years, and the Canes are the beneficiaries.  At the end, if his plan works to his advantage, the Canes will have to compete for his services, but they presumably will have flourished in the meantime.

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2 hours ago, beboplar said:

The merit of Aho's agent's action should be based upon his client's best interest

That's an awfully big SHOULD? And yes, that is what his client (and undoubtedly the client's father who is himself a GM in Finnish league) wanted, but I still think there's more to it than just that. Please note, I never said the way this turned out was bad for the Canes or Aho, he got his 5 years and will enter training camp unencumbered, but I still think his agent is smiling?

Edited by KJUNKANE

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1 hour ago, beboplar said:

I don't believe there is ANY merit to the story he wanted to play in Montreal.

 

 

Why not?  He'd be stupid not to want to play there if they were the ones willing to pay him.  People seem to think athletes only want to play one place and that wanting to play in Montreal means he doesn't want to play in Raleigh and vicy-versy.  He'd be crazy to not want to play in both cities.

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6 minutes ago, realmdrakkar said:

 

 

Why not?  He'd be stupid not to want to play there if they were the ones willing to pay him.  People seem to think athletes only want to play one place and that wanting to play in Montreal means he doesn't want to play in Raleigh and vicy-versy.  He'd be crazy to not want to play in both cities.

Because Montreal is a train wreck having great difficulty getting back on track.

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30 minutes ago, cc said:

Because Montreal is a train wreck having great difficulty getting back on track.

Seems to be a disease plaguing teams in the vicinity 

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I wonder how true it is but some say that Winnipeg values Connor more than Laine.

 

I don’t think any of this pertains to us, just thought it was interesting.

 

Btw, players don’t care where they play, if they do it is for self-serving reasons (want to go to big city, want to get away from media circus, family reasons, etc.). They have no allegiance, they’re just mercenaries. They just want to play wherever and get paid, but we as fans get attached to players/teams because it satisfies our basic need to identity with a group/others.

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37 minutes ago, cc said:

Because Montreal is a train wreck having great difficulty getting back on track.

 

 

Meh.  They finished 3 points beneath us last season and made the playoffs 6 times while we were rolling our decade of futility.  Not saying they're the dynasty they were in the '70s but they aren't the Slugs either.  Again i'm not saying the Habs were his #1 choice, just saying if i'm coming over from Finland to play in the best league in the world, there are 31 teams i'd want to play for if they waved $42M in my face.  Of course i'm just a punter on a message board so maybe i drool heavier over millions of dollars than a professional athlete does, but i'd still have a hard time sitting here with a straight face saying Aho didn't want to play in Montreal, or any other NHL city, when they're willing to stick that much cash in his G-string.

 

Edited by realmdrakkar

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10 minutes ago, Kyrule said:

I wonder how true it is but some say that Winnipeg values Connor more than Laine.

 

Most of the people I know around here in the 'Peg feel the same. Laine is a one-trick pony and he went cold last year. He's slow and doesn't use his size to his advantage. Connor is a better around player. 

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20 minutes ago, Bing_Chow said:

Most of the people I know around here in the 'Peg feel the same. Laine is a one-trick pony and he went cold last year. He's slow and doesn't use his size to his advantage. Connor is a better around player. 

Laine had back injury two years in a row https://www.nhl.com/news/injuries-hindered-patrik-laine-during-season-and-playoffs/c-306950966

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3 hours ago, realmdrakkar said:

 

 

Why not?  He'd be stupid not to want to play there if they were the ones willing to pay him.  People seem to think athletes only want to play one place and that wanting to play in Montreal means he doesn't want to play in Raleigh and vicy-versy.  He'd be crazy to not want to play in both cities.

When you are young, and Aho is still quite young, it is one thing to earn a great contract (5 years @ $8.54M front loaded is sweet), but another to have to perform under the bright lights and expectations that come with that in a city so rich in Stanley Cup history. Professional sports is full of players who have performed well in small markets, earned their dues and moved to larger markets, only to cringe under the pressure of fans and media expectations.  The best thing for Sebastian Aho is to continue his hockey growth in the place where he has already earned that respect, while earning plenty of money and building up his resume for his free agency window in 5 years.  This outcome was a WIN/WIN for both sides.  Let Aho's agent smile all he wants.  Canes fans and management should smile with him.

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6 hours ago, Bonivan said:

So, with this in mind, buy low on him? Back injuries are very tricky, want proof, look at Tiger Woods? Granted much older and likely hurt in different way, but could Laine's injury be overly resented by Winnipeg fans? Boy what a steal that could be if we could pick him up on the cheap and he full recover after intense rehab? 

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9 hours ago, KJUNKANE said:

So, with this in mind, buy low on him? Back injuries are very tricky, want proof, look at Tiger Woods? Granted much older and likely hurt in different way, but could Laine's injury be overly resented by Winnipeg fans? Boy what a steal that could be if we could pick him up on the cheap and he full recover after intense rehab? 

More proof.  Ryan Callahan, Henrik Zetterberg.

 

Laine is just blowing it off.  Young macho men.  I've seen this before, including from myself.  18 months of a chronic issue raises red flags.  You can't blow it off.  Ask Tiger.  Ask me.

Edited by wxray1

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45 minutes ago, wxray1 said:

More proof.  Ryan Callahan, Henrik Zetterberg.

 

Laine is just blowing it off.  Young macho men.  I've seen this before, including from myself.  18 months of a chronic issue raises red flags.  You can't blow it off.  Ask Tiger.  Ask me.

Okay, wxray did you blow it off?

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