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Rating the Committee

POLL: Rate the Committee To This Point  

40 members have voted

  1. 1. How would you rate the total performance of The Committee to this point?

    • A: Excellent
      9
    • B: Pretty Good
      24
    • C: Average
      6
    • D: Poor
      1
    • F: Fail
      0


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On 7/12/2019 at 3:52 PM, Kyrule said:

I’m baffled that anyone is still baffled. Of course it was about cash/cap.

 

Mrazek’s AAV is 3.3 or something like that. Dzingel’s is somewhere around there. Haula is at 2.75. 

 

De Haan was at 4.55 million per year (for three more years). It was a bloated contract for a bottom pairing guy. 

 

What cracks me up is now people are saying TVR is expendable and it is pointed out that he makes 2 million plus. He is a bargain at that price IMO, and he is under appreciated like Forslund has said on multiple occasions..

 

I'm one who listed TVR as a possible trade candidate.  Not sure how you or anyone else define the term "expendable" but if it's along the lines of "superfluous" that's not how I'm looking at TVR.  Including a couple of very promising yutes (Bean, and McKeown) and some slightly older promising-but-perhaps-still-not-totally-proven kids (Fleury and Forsling), right now the Canes have more d-men than spots. At the moment, I see the top 4 set in stone with Slavin, Pesce, Dougie, and Faulk.  To me it's a matter of what the Committee decides to do with all the other pieces so as not to lose any without a return.  The question is, what to do regarding the 3rd pair and depth?  Certainly TVR is the safest roster bet for the upcoming season.  But what is the Committees long term projection, not just for this season? What kind of return can we get for any of the pieces we might need to move?  Are we going to carry 7 d-men or 8?  How long can the Committee go before being forced to make a decision?  Not knowing the answer to all those questions is the reason I listed TVR as yet a possible trade candidate.

Edited by LakeLivin
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On 7/11/2019 at 11:06 AM, super_dave_1 said:

Opening night against the Habs should be Aho bobbleheads with him holding a bag of money in each hand

And a Habs Jersey with a slash through it.

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18 hours ago, Kyrule said:

 

I’m baffled that anyone is still baffled. Of course it was about cash/cap.

 

Mrazek’s AAV is 3.3 or something like that. Dzingel’s is somewhere around there. Haula is at 2.75. 

 

De Haan was at 4.55 million per year (for three more years). It was a bloated contract for a bottom pairing guy. 

 

What cracks me up is now people are saying TVR is expendable and it is pointed out that he makes 2 million plus. He is a bargain at that price IMO, and he is under appreciated like Forslund has said on multiple occasions.

This.

 

I'll just add that counting the available slots at this time of year is kinda like using a snowblower while a blizzard is still raging: pointless. Building roster depth at this time of year does two things: It forces guys earn their slots, and opens the door to preseason moves to get your cap space and lineup just right. That way you ice the team you want, without guys you are not 100 percent sure are ready.

 

Just look at our forwards roster: With Dzingel, we've got 14 bonafide NHLers on it at the moment, counting McGinn (RFA) but without our captain. So whether it's Necas, Geekie, Goat, Pot or (insert the name of whomever you like here) they are not going to need a merely great camp to crack the lineup, they're going to have play absolutely lights out, because even our least-experienced guy (Svech) is already a stud. That's exactly what you want: Guys earning slots, not being handed them because they're your only option.

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Thinking on structuring a team and the committee and losing our two biggest hitters. I think we'll be ok. We will miss their physical game, but we will be faster. DeHaan and Ferland played only 5 playoff games each and for both 4 of them were the Boston losses. This does not mean that they are inconsequential, just that the team was able to win a lot of playoff games without them in the lineup.

 

Every year the pundits declare that whatever type of team won the cup is the new direction of the NHL that you need to win in the playoffs. This year, it was physicality. Don't get me wrong, the playoffs are more physical, and a team needs to be able to deal with that. But many years it's speed that kills. And all years teams must combine whatever the "it" thing is for that year with skill.

 

And every year the thing that comes up over and over is "depth scoring" and this year was no different. 

 

Well we have skill, speed, and suddenly very deep scoring (especially if J Williams comes back, and if Foegele, Svech, and say Necas produce). 

 

Adding Haula and Dzingle, is adding two 50 point players. It is not inconceivable that this team could sport 7 or even 8, 50 point or greater players. That is pretty sick depth: Nino, Aho, TT, Williams, Dzingle, Haula, Svech, and Staal has been around 45, which would be 8. 

 

I think our added speed and skill, depth of scoring and some physical players will be enough. Yes, I would like one more banger who can score, but Martinook, Dougy, McGinn, Foegele, Staal, and to some extent Nino, Fleury and Faulk can at least hit enough to not be pushed around. But we will light the lamp and we will be fast. 

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2 hours ago, top-shelf-1 said:

So whether it's Necas, Geekie, Goat, Pot or (insert the name of whomever you like here) they are not going to need a merely great camp to crack the lineup

 

 

Doesn't change your point, but it won't be Pot - he signed with Anaheim.

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Can I just add, for all who have whined that Aho wanted to be a Hab, what a great signing that offer sheet was for the Canes.  Cost controlled for the next 5 years, head in the game, not worrying about contract status on Day 1 of training camp, while other high end RFAs such as Marner, Pointe, Laine, Trouba, and Rantenen are at home worried about what kind of deal their agents are going to get for them?  They are probably saving at least $1M per year for the next 5 on Aho, and while that may not sound like much, look how close to the cap they have crept with the Dzingel signing.

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3 hours ago, realmdrakkar said:

 

 

Doesn't change your point, but it won't be Pot - he signed with Anaheim.

I totally missed that. New work regimen. Ugh.

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3 hours ago, beboplar said:

look how close to the cap they have crept with the Dzingel signing.

It may be a bit of a trick of the light with the Marleau contract, but we are a cap team it would appear. Who'd have thunk it?

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3 hours ago, beboplar said:

Can I just add,

No. No, you can't. (kidding)

 

I love what both sides did. The Canes looked willing to commit, which from the standpoint of intra-league PR is important, especially after TD's comments re coach/GM value early in his tenure. Aho stuck to what he wanted too. Ultimately both played their cards exactly as the CBA stipulates.

 

Players' desires seem like fickle things at first blush, but in fact they just--must--adjust based on the subject player's age and the status of their development. Ultimately, I still believe bridge deals will make a comeback; indeed, I think both Aho's and Gaudreau's are bridge deals, just for guys who project to elite status. If they meet expectations, I can imagine their next deals being upwards of $10 million for the first five years, then (assuming they are willing to go eight years at that point) stepping down by half in each of the last three years. So at 34, SeaBass would make $1.5 (maybe 2) million. Feels about right.

 

Those whom orgs feel might become elite but are less sure about will start getting deals of higher value than traditional bridge deals--and term will depend almost entirely on their ages and likely length of their next deals.

 

 

Edited by top-shelf-1
grammar
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I'm going to unpin this. Overall, it seems that we're pretty happy with the committee to this point. 

 

63% chose Very Good, so the majority. 

 

The average grade on 1-5, with 5 being excellent, was 4.0, again, Very Good. 

 

Some might up their vote with the addition of Dzingle, but not enough to re do the poll. 

 

Feel free to keep commenting and voting.

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On 7/14/2019 at 1:11 PM, remkin said:

Feel free to keep commenting and voting.

I'll bump the average up a bit with my vote of excellent (just realized I never voted!).

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I voted excellent before the Dzingel signing. I was anticipating one more move but I admit I wasn’t sure.

 

Hiring Brind’amour turned out to be an excellent decision. Trading Skinner took a lot of guts. Trading De Haan took guts. We made some good trades (Martinook, Nino, and Haula). We gambled a bit during free agency but ended up with two guys on great contracts. We only have the Reimer contract remaining as a bad contract, but at least he is filling a role and Darling is history.

 

The moves we made ultimately made the team better, AND we added a first round pick.

 

We had a great draft (IMO).

 

Oh, and we ended up making the ECF. Like someone else said, it’s hard to argue with success.

 

Gutsy, shrewd, disciplined, and maybe a bit lucky is how I would describe the committee...

 

...and I’m chuffed.

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A coworker was wearing a black "Bunch of Jerks" t-shirt yesterday. In Eastern Carolina. In 100-degree heat. In mid-July.

 

That's all I need to know.

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Read the Athletic article this morning about contract efficiency among teams in the NHL.  We are far and away #1.  And that does not include our prospects and guys on ELCs.  That alone gets this crew an A for me. 

 

They are killing the off-season this year.

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Just watched a video rating the prospect pools. Guess who is #1.

 

Other teams had higher-end prospects, but nobody can match our depth was the emphasis. Some of the players from this year’s draft were listed.

 

Looking at the comments section it seems that Montreal and the Rangers are among the best as well.

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One thing's for sure IMO, at least you can't look at this team (on paper at least) and not say they are better coming into this season, than the team that went to the ECF. The committee has tried. If it flops. They tried. 

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An indirect indicator:  when was the last time you can recall the Canes at risk of losing players to waivers instead of hoping to pick up players off waivers?

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6 hours ago, sleekfeeder said:

One thing's for sure IMO, at least you can't look at this team (on paper at least) and not say they are better coming into this season, than the team that went to the ECF. The committee has tried. If it flops. They tried. 

Agree sleek. I think that the committee really made some significant moves, even as they are just under the big splash radar. Seems that some national media types do see it though, and some don't.

 

Haula has been out of sight, out of mind due to his injury, but Vegas fans list him as a significant contributor to their run, and his numbers agree. He does have to recover from the injury, but, we gave them a B prospet (Roy), and a conditional 5th round pick for crying out loud. (I've been hopeful for Roy for years, but IMO he will be a 4th line NHL center at best. He's had 2 full seasons in the AHL, he's 22, and managed .55 ppg. both seasons, which translates to around 20 points in a full NHL season.) And Huala is a two way player. The committee has been really focusing on that with departure and acquisitions since it's inception. In fact just about the only somewhat of an exception is....

 

Dzingle was more of a known mid to upper pack UFA, but we got him in the value part of the UFA cycle, and gave up nothing from our system or futures. People talk about some risk with Dzingle since he's coming off of a career year. OK, but the year before he still put in 23 goals. My only issue with Dzingle is his apparent tendency to think "fly the zone" means don't play much defense, not whether he will score goals. I look at him and see a career points progression of 32-41-56. I would think 60 is as likely as regression, but even regression might be estimated at 22 goals and 50 points. 

 

They also got an NHL backup goalie, and Mrazek back much cheaper than signing him pre UFA.

 

But to your point, even if Necas stays in the AHL, so long as Williams returns, we will have last year's team, plus Haula and Dzingle. AND we will have Svech a big step up, and I think Foegele also a step up. (And I'm not giving up on Necas out of camp, but definitely up at some point).

 

That's why, to me it will likely all come down to goaltending. Mid-pack save percentage again? Playoffs very likely.  

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I'll put it here since the Committee's moves are a big part of this. Why where and will the Hurricanes be for real? Almost no pundits saw this team coming, and frankly in December we truly were a few more games of losing away from digging a hole that even our special run wouldn't have cleared. Now, it seems divided. I have seen pundits and power rankings putting us pretty high on the list and "in playoffs". And some taking the typical course of thinking last year was a flash in the pan and things will return to "normal" with our regression this year. 

 

I get it a little. Besides the historical malaise of the post cup years in Raleigh, the team lacks THE top talent at key positions that gets the punditry's goose bumps going. We don't have a top 15 center. We don't have a top 20 winger. We don't have a top 10 goalie. So how in the heck did we get so good as to win the vast majority of those meaningful games in calendar year 2019? And how are we going to do it again? My opinion:

 

1. Depth

2. Solid Defense

3. Team two way game.

4. Team playing in "the zone". 

5. At least league average goaltending.

 

I see all 5 of those things going again this year but with more scoring depth, and a couple of key rookies likely to step way up.

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I'm going to break those 5 down a bit, with an eye to this upcoming season. One post for each thing;

 

1. Depth. This team may not have the very highest pinnacle of marque talent, but we are very deep in all positions, except (maybe) goalie. 

 

This year's version has 8 forwards who have scored 20 goals and 40 points in a season. We also have a D man who's right at that (Hamilton), so, for guys who have a very good chance of going 20/40, we have 8 and 1, Dougie, who has been right on the verge of 20 goals and has hit 40 points, so very close. This is a bit of a skewed look because I can't look at every player's entire history from every team, but comparing this potential depth of scoring to what teams did last year.

 

First number is guys who hit 20/40, and second hit or very close: Top 10:

 

1. Toronto: 7/8 

2. Washington: 7/7

3. Tampa: 5/7

4. San Jose: 5/6

5. Vegas: 5/6

6. Calgary: 5/6

7. Boston: 5/5

8. Winnipeg: 5/5

9. Pittsburgh: 4/6

10. Columbus: 4/5

 

New #1: Carolina: 8/9

 

Last year's Canes: 3/6. Interesting, because tweaking the cutoffs just a tiny bit would have put us at 6/6. And while it's even more of a stretch, recall that our guys really struggled to score the first half of the season. The second half projections likely give us 6/6 last year. And we've added two more in Dzingle and Haula. 

 

It is a bit of fun with numbers since I'm projecting next year vs a year where those teams actually did it. Most likely we won't have 8-9 guys do that, but it speaks to our depth. I listed the top 10 up there, there were 20 other teams below that. We don't need eight 20/40 guys to actually hit that number. Only two team had 7 last year. 

 

Last year's depth included an 18 year old Svech and no Haula or Dzingle. Yet it was enough to become an elite team in the back half.

 

Depth is only one factor. Teams like Tampa, Washington, Boston, have multiple elite players with much higher numbers. Then there's D and goalie play etc. But it is a big factor. Just look at the names on the top 10 list. Every one of them made the playoffs.

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Having the belief you can do it and the commitment to the goal is key. To me that’s coming from Rod. He’s a huge intangible they don’t talk much about. He has an entire year of head coaching now.  He knows his system works. He has tools he did not have last year.  It OK to be optimistic this year.

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2. Defense.

 

The list was just how they came into my head. Our D could well be number one. For years we've struggled with an average at best defense. Then a couple of late round draft picks just happened to be top NHL D men: Slavin and Pesce. That helped a lot. Oddly, more than 3 straight top first round D picks, but that's a story for a different day.

 

Slavin: Just picked by the Hockey Guy as the #10 D man in the NHL, with the simple statement that he can do just about everything. 

Pesce: Only shuts down top forwards year after year.

Hamilton: Improved as the year went on, and was the only D man with 20G/40 point potential.

Faulk: So long as he brings last season's game, a very solid #4. 

 

TVR is sneaky effect at #5, and Fleury or McKeown or Forsling or someone will be fine at #6. 

 

As our forward skill runs deep, so does our D. As with Aho up front, Slavin is gaining some notoriety as elite, but we don't have Norris type names on that D, and that makes it hard for some of the lazier national pundits to see how good we are. But we do have a lot of really good ones, which is a big part of our winning.

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6 minutes ago, cc said:

Having the belief you can do it and the commitment to the goal is key. To me that’s coming from Rod. He’s a huge intangible they don’t talk much about. He has an entire year of head coaching now.  He knows his system works. He has tools he did not have last year.  It OK to be optimistic this year.

That's number 4 on my list, (and coaching is #2 also) getting to it! But any of the things on the list could be #1.

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3. Team 2 way game. 

 

This one is split between the committee and the coach. The committee for making this fundamental to player moves, the coach for getting the team to play this way.

 

The committee has, to my eye, deeply valued players who play both ways. Moving Skinner for hockey pucks was one key statement here. But Hanifin was bit soft in the back end, racking up some big minuses pre trade. But also guys brought in were two way, and or physical: Ferland, Nino, Martinook. And Eric Haula is known for his two way game. Even Dougie, who looked a bit shaky at first, is a career +22, and finished even with a lot of improvement in the back half. Dzingle could be a bit of an exception, but on the whole we are valuing two way players. 

 

The coach is getting guys to play this way. Item number one is Justin Faulk. I don't know that its the coach, but the timing of his new found D game coming back correlates. But whether it's teaching Svech to play the right way from the start, or Faulk's improvement, or the fact that our star Fins are both very good 2 way players despite not being physical, or just the presence of Brett Pesce and Jordan Staal, but the entire team plays both ends of the ice. And that allows more winning than other stats would predict.

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