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Williams coming back!!!! 1 year 700k and 1.3 million in performance bonus

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1 minute ago, Chuffy_McChufferson said:

I know which one I'm keeping when it comes time to crunch the finances.

The one with 4 years left and a full NMC?

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22 hours ago, legend-1 said:

Speculation? Nope, sarcastic quip at best based on how ridiculous the situation had started getting. Sounds like it's over and we're gonna see what happens.

 

Ah, sorry, given some of the stuff people post in forums the sarcasm was lost on me (and apparently at least one other, given his post)..  

Edited by LakeLivin

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Alright.  The prom dates are lined up.  Yeah!

 

Without sarcasm, joking or nastiness, I really hope I eat my words and prediction I made a few pages up.  Now that this is done, I'm looking forward to the hope that JW provides the value needed, and especially the leadership needed.  These are big boys, so any worries of bad feelings are hopefully just something we've made up.  I'm assuming someone is going to have to drop on the roster.  That's going to be interesting to watch, but it will likely be someone used to it.

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I don’t think the Canes have anyone that will clear waivers. No 2-way contracts as far as I can tell. Waddell either has to move a player in a trade (for a prospect or a pick) or we get nothing in return when a player gets snatched up via waivers. Or am I missing something here?

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1 hour ago, wxray1 said:

Alright.  The prom dates are lined up.  Yeah!

 

Without sarcasm, joking or nastiness, I really hope I eat my words and prediction I made a few pages up.  Now that this is done, I'm looking forward to the hope that JW provides the value needed, and especially the leadership needed.  These are big boys, so any worries of bad feelings are hopefully just something we've made up.  I'm assuming someone is going to have to drop on the roster.  That's going to be interesting to watch, but it will likely be someone used to it.

If nothing less it will provide opportunity for discussion here for those on both sides of the aisle.  Cost to risk ratio is minimal.

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9 minutes ago, cc said:

If nothing less it will provide opportunity for discussion here for those on both sides of the aisle.  Cost to risk ratio is minimal.

I'll say one thing or two. William's looks 10 years younger. Looks to be in good shape. I'm just hoping his ice time is eased into the lineup to see where he is at although I'm not convinced that will happen. Now that he is back I wish him the best and hope the contributions are plentiful to move us forward.

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I'm still a little lukewarm on whether or not Williams is what this team needs right now, but it needs something.  Hopefully he sparks the team to about an 8-1-1 record over the next 10 because that could be just what the doctor ordered.  Do this.

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10 hours ago, coastal_caniac said:

Why are folks so down on Nino, especially lately?  Look up his December stats. Besides, he plays on the left

Nino has been playing well for awhile just not getting points. Like last night he got a pass as he was waiting to stay on sides. Had half a step on a defender that had a head of steam, made a spin move to get some shooting room and spun right into 2 defenders because he had no help. While I wouldnt mind him getting a rest just to refresh it would be no more then 1 game. I would also consider sitting Necas for 1 game as he has cooled off. After that the only person not bringing something Willy cant is McGinn. So I would give Willy a turn in Nino's spot, one in Necas's spot, then he would rotate with McGinn until he is up to speed.

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1 hour ago, ClaytonCane said:

I don’t think the Canes have anyone that will clear waivers. No 2-way contracts as far as I can tell. Waddell either has to move a player in a trade (for a prospect or a pick) or we get nothing in return when a player gets snatched up via waivers. Or am I missing something here?

I could be wrong on this but I think we can carry 21 players and are at 19. So we shouldnt need to send anyone down.

 

Just looked it up its 23 we can carry and we have 22 with Willy on the roster

Edited by Derailed75
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29 minutes ago, Derailed75 said:

Nino has been playing well for awhile just not getting points. Like last night he got a pass as he was waiting to stay on sides. Had half a step on a defender that had a head of steam, made a spin move to get some shooting room and spun right into 2 defenders because he had no help. While I wouldnt mind him getting a rest just to refresh it would be no more then 1 game. I would also consider sitting Necas for 1 game as he has cooled off. After that the only person not bringing something Willy cant is McGinn. So I would give Willy a turn in Nino's spot, one in Necas's spot, then he would rotate with McGinn until he is up to speed.

Living on the West Coast, I don't get to see the action, but I follow the games on the computer sometimes.  There has been speculation as to whom JW would replace in the lineup on this board.  From afar, it has seemed obvious to me that it would be Nino.  I see him teaming up again with Staal and the lines looking like:

 

Svechnikov/Aho/Turbo

Foegele/Staal/JW

Dzingel/Haula/Necas

Martinook/Wallmark/McGinn

 

Obviously players will sit for injuries, but the Haula and Wally lines work well, McGinn and Marty do some PK, Svech to the Aho line makes them better, and the Staal line does not have to score, but needs to be defensive and physical.  

 

This team is getting out hit every game.  They lost Saku, Ferland, and JW, all hitters, and getting one of them back is a plus.  Reading what you have written about Nino puts a slight kink in my thoughts, but not much.  For much of this season it seems as if he has been doing his best Victor Rask imitation.

Edited by beboplar

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Well, after thinking about this, I am on the fence on this move.

I just hope this doesn't mess anything up with the team and really don't see where he fits as all our lines have really good chemistry and knows their roles.

If we were missing a forward due to injuries, JW could be slotted anywhere.

If you sit McGinn, who is one of our top PKers, does that mean JW is gonna kill penalties?

If you sit Nino, who is struggling with confidence and had his best month in December, how does that affect his play?

If you sit Gardiner, could he play on our bottom D-pair?

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Turns out we didn't need injuries as a reason to sign JW I guess? 

 

Ginner seems too much a dyed in the wool Canes 4th liner to bench him. Nino is playing well. Necas may have cooled down but still a weapon. Really anyone we would sit for JW is someone who's made big contributions this year. If JW is looking like legit top-9 guy getting closer to the trade deadline we might need to make a trade for picks. 

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So, first the deal. It is for a half of a year and the pay is commensurate with that. If he hits all of his bonuses $2M, would be like a $4M deal for a full year. But some of the bonuses may not be ridiculous, I guess we'll have to wait on the details. Sara Civ points out Correy Perry's bonuses which incllude $100K if the team goes three rounds in the playoffs, and $150K for a cup, and the player plays at least 50% of the games. I assume if he doesn't hit the bonuses, they don't count on our cap for next year. So if we have some legit bonuses, we only pay if he contributes. It seems like a pretty fair deal.

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43 minutes ago, hopper915 said:

Well, after thinking about this, I am on the fence on this move.

I just hope this doesn't mess anything up with the team and really don't see where he fits as all our lines have really good chemistry and knows their roles.

If we were missing a forward due to injuries, JW could be slotted anywhere.

If you sit McGinn, who is one of our top PKers, does that mean JW is gonna kill penalties?

If you sit Nino, who is struggling with confidence and had his best month in December, how does that affect his play?

If you sit Gardiner, could he play on our bottom D-pair?

If you are on the fence, consider that with the current "dream team" without JW, the Canes are BARELY in the playoff picture.  They currently sit at #7 at 52 points, with #8, 9, and 10 at 50, 50, and 49 in an 8 teams get in playoff field.  That's with your "this team is so good I don't know who to sit" theme.  38 or not (he was 37 last year in a really good season, and only has to play 1/2 year), JW is a difference maker.  Check the lineup for who amongst them has won 3 Stanley Cups for 3 different teams.

 

Welcome back, JW.  We need you!

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I am happy to have J Williams back. I'm projecting it will infuse some energy into a grinding part of the year. I do agree though that there is no obvious candidate to sit. Here's why.  We are so deep up front. We really don't need another forward. When in our history could we say that? Our problem is not offense. We are currently #8 in the league in goals/game. Sure, we can always go for #1, but the problem (for once) is not that we can't put the puck in the other net. 

 

The problem, on occasion, is stopping the puck. Now for the season, we're still #8 in goals against and the combo still, despite all of our concerns has us remaining as the #9 best record in the NHL. So the "problem" is not as big as it's been. But to the extent it's there, the problem is occasional lose play in the D zone and neutral zone combined with occasional spotty goaltending. 

 

Williams can help maybe in terms of the messaging of forwards getting back, but really he can just help us outscore by a little more. He can also help us stay strong if we suffer injuries. 

 

Edit: I took the Staal part out, because he's been more productive in the last 12 games or so.

 

I still think J Williams helps. It will be interesting to see who's place he takes though.

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I tend to agree with the ones who want to sit Nino, move Svech with Aho and Turbo and put Williams with Staal and Foegele.  Leaves 2 lines unchanged, upgrades the 1st line and puts together a shutdown line in Staal/Williams/Foegele that is still going to score.  Feels like least disruption with most upside, particularly the 1st line with Svech, that line should be unstoppable.  Seems like you rotate Nino in with the 4th liners to give them (and probably Necas) periodic breathers particularly when we get to the part of the schedule where we're literally playing every other day.

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I tend to hope that Williams allows Brindy to do the Lake thing, and give guys "maintenance days" or rotate guys out who could use a press box look. Heck, that could include Williams himself. Even J Staal could use a maintenance day IMO, though doing it too early could be weird with the captaincy thing. 

 

The fact that we are having trouble making room in 12 forward slots for a 50 point 20 goal guy, is a sign of how good things are going and how well guys are developing. 

 

Svech and Necas of course. But also Wallmark and Foegele. Perhaps especially Wallmark and Foegele. 

 

Last 15 games, Foegele has 12 points and 5 goals, and 4 multi-point games. It's his second year in the league. 

Last 15 games, Wallmark has 12 points and 6 goals and 2 multi-point games. It his second full year in the league.

 

So the offensive rise of Foegele and Wallmark, and Wally being a center vs Williams a winger, really does not argue for sitting either of them. 

 

So maybe Nino, but he has looked better. Even Staal, who's had a slow year is actually picking it up the last 12 games or so. Dzingel's game is on the rise. Haula's a center and too good to sit if healthy. etc.

 

You end up looking at McGinn, who coincidentally just happened to have a pretty good game last night, but who is also a 4th liner. Marty? 

 

To start, it makes sense to let Williams spot on the 4th line for a few games, but then what? I think some sort of rotation of guys not in the PPG neighborhood. 

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25 minutes ago, remkin said:

So, first the deal. It is for a half of a year and the pay is commensurate with that. If he hits all of his bonuses $2M, would be like a $4M deal for a full year. But some of the bonuses may not be ridiculous, I guess we'll have to wait on the details. Sara Civ points out Correy Perry's bonuses which incllude $100K if the team goes three rounds in the playoffs, and $150K for a cup, and the player plays at least 50% of the games. I assume if he doesn't hit the bonuses, they don't count on our cap for next year. So if we have some legit bonuses, we only pay if he contributes. It seems like a pretty fair deal.

He signed at $700 K plus $1.3 M in bonuses. But since this is for half a year would it actually be $350 K plus up to $1.3 M in bonuses?

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4 minutes ago, Bonivan said:

He signed at $700 K plus $1.3 M in bonuses. But since this is for half a year would it actually be $350 K plus up to $1.3 M in bonuses?

Not sure what you mean. I'm just saying if he gets $2M for half of a season, it would be like $4M for a full season. But if the bonuses are not ridiculously easy to hit, then it goes down unless we make a run and he's a big part of it. So it seems like a pretty fair deal for us.

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7 minutes ago, remkin said:

I tend to hope that Williams allows Brindy to do the Lake thing, and give guys "maintenance days" or rotate guys out who could use a press box look. Heck, that could include Williams himself. Even J Staal could use a maintenance day IMO, though doing it too early could be weird with the captaincy thing. 

 

The fact that we are having trouble making room in 12 forward slots for a 50 point 20 goal guy, is a sign of how good things are going and how well guys are developing. 

 

Svech and Necas of course. But also Wallmark and Foegele. Perhaps especially Wallmark and Foegele. 

 

Last 15 games, Foegele has 12 points and 5 goals, and 4 multi-point games. It's his second year in the league. 

Last 15 games, Wallmark has 12 points and 6 goals and 2 multi-point games. It his second full year in the league.

 

So the offensive rise of Foegele and Wallmark, and Wally being a center vs Williams a winger, really does not argue for sitting either of them. 

 

So maybe Nino, but he has looked better. Even Staal, who's had a slow year is actually picking it up the last 12 games or so. Dzingel's game is on the rise. Haula's a center and too good to sit if healthy. etc.

 

You end up looking at McGinn, who coincidentally just happened to have a pretty good game last night, but who is also a 4th liner. Marty? 

 

To start, it makes sense to let Williams spot on the 4th line for a few games, but then what? I think some sort of rotation of guys not in the PPG neighborhood. 

Don't really understand this kind of thinking.  If your aspirations are for the team to make the playoffs as an end game, then I might agree with your take.  Someone has to sit on a team that is sitting on the fence to make the playoffs.  I am sure TD's aspirations are higher, meaning what does it take to not only make the playoffs but win a series.  You saw the blood and guts it took to beat the Caps last season.  Without JW's signing I would wager that the Canes would not survive a 1st round playoff series IF they made the post season.  Even if he is not wearing a letter, JW is a huge factor in the "I've been here, this is what we need to do" department when the rubber meets the road at those tough times.  

I am borderline thrilled he is back on the team and really don't care who sits, be it Nino, Marty, McGinn, or injury guy.

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9 minutes ago, beboplar said:

Don't really understand this kind of thinking.  If your aspirations are for the team to make the playoffs as an end game, then I might agree with your take.  Someone has to sit on a team that is sitting on the fence to make the playoffs.  I am sure TD's aspirations are higher, meaning what does it take to not only make the playoffs but win a series.  You saw the blood and guts it took to beat the Caps last season.  Without JW's signing I would wager that the Canes would not survive a 1st round playoff series IF they made the post season.  Even if he is not wearing a letter, JW is a huge factor in the "I've been here, this is what we need to do" department when the rubber meets the road at those tough times.  

I am borderline thrilled he is back on the team and really don't care who sits, be it Nino, Marty, McGinn, or injury guy.

I'm not sure I understand what "kind of thinking" your talking about. I like J Williams being back so we don't disagree. I also agree that J Willy brings great leadership in the playoffs. No disagreement. The only disagreement would be projecting the team is incapable of winning a first round series without him. I'd point out that everyone on this team except a couple now have some good playoff experience. He will help, but they are not incapable without him. A lot of the team's struggles of late have been spotty goaltending and Williams can't help that. Still, I'm down with it.

 

My point was that we have 12 forwards right now who don't really deserve to sit, but unless we go with 13 forwards and 5 D, someone will need to sit. I think it should be a bit of a rotation. That's really the point of that post. Do you disagree? Should Nino just not see the ice for 10 games? Or McGinn? That's really the question of that post.

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Nice Signing- Players will get hurt/injured.. that will always happen. So  having extra depth good. Having Justin for the playoffs even at his age a huge bonus for this team.

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