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NHL Playoffs 2020

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9 hours ago, gocanes0506 said:

worst case: canes lose in the first round and win the lottery and Toronto wins the lottery too.

If either of that happened   the Canes can choose to keep their own pick  and transfer to next years draft .  Next Years draft is  not as strong as this  years draft  but some diamonds in the rough  in later rounds .  And im Sure the Toronto pick  could  choose to keep theirs or  defer  also .   Lottery winners picks  get that privileged .   

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1 hour ago, Canesfanforever said:

If either of that happened   the Canes can choose to keep their own pick  and transfer to next years draft .  Next Years draft is  not as strong as this  years draft  but some diamonds in the rough  in later rounds .  And im Sure the Toronto pick  could  choose to keep theirs or  defer  also .   Lottery winners picks  get that privileged .   

That isn’t how it works. The only protection on our pick is its the worst of the two picks. If Toronto wins the lottery they automatically keep theirs. We give up our pick in that scenario no matter where it ends up.

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2 hours ago, gocanes0506 said:

That isn’t how it works. The only protection on our pick is its the worst of the two picks. If Toronto wins the lottery they automatically keep theirs. We give up our pick in that scenario no matter where it ends up.

The leafs  stipulation was  if  it was top 10 or less i think .   What im saying is  because of the lottery winner results is   they still get protection  unless the team wants to defer  that pick .   Either way  the leafs or  rangers still will get a pick if it's  this year or next years .    Unless  changed the ruling on that , that im not aware of . 

 

 

I just did a quick google search to help me better explain it . 

How does a protected draft pick work?
*The protection means that if the team that is sending you the pick lands within the protected range, they get to keep that pick. If the pick is kept by the sender, the protection carries over to the next season's draft. Protections may vary from year to year. *Teams can also protect picks with best/worst trade-offs
 
But you are right if neither pick is lottery winner i think .  
Edited by Canesfanforever

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6 minutes ago, Canesfanforever said:

The leafs  stipulation was  if  it was top 10 or less i think .   What im saying is  because of the lottery winner results is   they still get protection  unless the team wants to defer  that pick .   Either way  the leafs or  rangers still will get a pick if it's  this year or next years .    Unless  changed the ruling on that , that im not aware of . 

 

 

I just did a quick google search to help me better explain it . 

How does a protected draft pick work?
*The protection means that if the team that is sending you the pick lands within the protected range, they get to keep that pick. If the pick is kept by the sender, the protection carries over to the next season's draft. Protections may vary from year to year. *Teams can also protect picks with best/worst trade-offs

That is the thing, ours isn’t protected in the same sense. The only protection is the worst of the two picks.  If Toronto’s protection is activated, we only have one pick to be the worst. We don’t get to decide to defer.

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So, lottery wins aside, if my back of the envelope, at work math is right....

 

If Toronto wins and we lose, we pick either 14 or 15 depending on Pittsburgh, the higher pick if they also lose.

If we and Toronto lose, we pick 11-15 depending on the other series. 

 

If we both win, we get pushed down into the bottom half of the next strata. If we lose in round 2, and Toronto wins, we have a pretty good chance of picking around #21. If Toronto loses in round #2 then we probably slide up a couple of spots, say around #18-19 ish depending on other results.

 

So then, adjusting my win-win fantasy, our best case would be a Toronto loss and a series of high points percentage losses (Edmonton, Minn, Pittsburgh and the NYI) with no lottery win by Toronto. This would slide us in around #11, while still being able to go deep ourselves. Actually getting all the way up to #11 is highly unlikely though as we'd need 5 series to go exactly right and all be upsets except Toronto, likely less than 3% chance. 

 

If Toronto losses and two of the other 4 teams go right, we'd pick #13. If Toronto losses and all the wrong teams win, we'd pick #16. 

 

Toronto losing and us winning moves us from what was going to be #21 up to 11-16, and we get to keep playing (so long as Toronto doesn't win the lottery).

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They had Waddell on the other day and he said, Hamilton should be good to go. I think this will be huge. The only guy out should be Pesce.

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1 hour ago, remkin said:

So, lottery wins aside, if my back of the envelope, at work math is right....

 

If Toronto wins and we lose, we pick either 14 or 15 depending on Pittsburgh, the higher pick if they also lose.

If we and Toronto lose, we pick 11-15 depending on the other series. 

 

If we both win, we get pushed down into the bottom half of the next strata. If we lose in round 2, and Toronto wins, we have a pretty good chance of picking around #21. If Toronto loses in round #2 then we probably slide up a couple of spots, say around #18-19 ish depending on other results.

 

So then, adjusting my win-win fantasy, our best case would be a Toronto loss and a series of high points percentage losses (Edmonton, Minn, Pittsburgh and the NYI) with no lottery win by Toronto. This would slide us in around #11, while still being able to go deep ourselves. Actually getting all the way up to #11 is highly unlikely though as we'd need 5 series to go exactly right and all be upsets except Toronto, likely less than 3% chance. 

 

If Toronto losses and two of the other 4 teams go right, we'd pick #13. If Toronto losses and all the wrong teams win, we'd pick #16. 

 

Toronto losing and us winning moves us from what was going to be #21 up to 11-16, and we get to keep playing (so long as Toronto doesn't win the lottery).

So pretty much  

Math Equation GIFs - Get the best GIF on GIPHY

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H

2 hours ago, remkin said:

They had Waddell on the other day and he said, Hamilton should be good to go. I think this will be huge. The only guy out should be Pesce.

Waddell on today says Pesce will be close to being ready if and when play resumes

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21 minutes ago, gocanes0506 said:

H

Waddell on today says Pesce will be close to being ready if and when play resumes

Wow. Not what was said just a little bit ago. I guess the date of the playoffs keeps getting pushed back. Give me a healthy Pesce and Hamilton, and I like our chances a lot better. 

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Right D:  Hamilton, Pesce, Vatanen, TVR

Left D: Slavin, Skjei, Fleury, Gardiner, Edmundson

 

Talk about depth on D, lol.

 

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Fleury has to feel good about a Pesce having a chance to come back but really frustrated that he could be riding the bench again.

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6 minutes ago, gocanes0506 said:

Fleury has to feel good about a Pesce having a chance to come back but really frustrated that he could be riding the bench again.

 

I'm guessing that Pesce coming back might take away more time from TVR, another R shot D.  If not for "politics", I'd consider starting Fleury on the 3rd pair ahead of Gardiner and Edmundson. 

Edited by LakeLivin

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I know they bring eyeballs but Looking at the standings for the first time in 21/2 months, Chicago and Montreal had no chance of making the playoffs. Other teams on the outside looking in had a fighting chance with a strong finish. Rangers were 2 points behind us though we had 2 games in hand, but but that’s doable with a strong finish. Setting aside all the reasons to stop the season as a separate topic, they should have come up with a way to construct a 22 team playoff and not just gifted spots to Montreal and Chicago. Remember Edmonton was an 8 seed when we beat them for the Cup. If Montreal or Chicago somehow rise up and win the Cup, they did nothing in roughly 70 games of the regular season to deserve a spot in the playoffs. I can’t think of how 22 would work, but it seems to me that 22 includes the teams who were in when play stopped plus all teams that at least had a fighting chance.

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12 minutes ago, bluedevilcane said:

I know they bring eyeballs but Looking at the standings for the first time in 21/2 months, Chicago and Montreal had no chance of making the playoffs. Other teams on the outside looking in had a fighting chance with a strong finish. Rangers were 2 points behind us though we had 2 games in hand, but but that’s doable with a strong finish. Setting aside all the reasons to stop the season as a separate topic, they should have come up with a way to construct a 22 team playoff and not just gifted spots to Montreal and Chicago. Remember Edmonton was an 8 seed when we beat them for the Cup. If Montreal or Chicago somehow rise up and win the Cup, they did nothing in roughly 70 games of the regular season to deserve a spot in the playoffs. I can’t think of how 22 would work, but it seems to me that 22 includes the teams who were in when play stopped plus all teams that at least had a fighting chance.

 

Agree, and a field of 22 would have been no more a scheduling problem than a field of 24.  Including Montreal and Chicago grates against my sense of fairness as well, but it's in the best interest of the players as well as the teams to recoup as much revenue as possible, so given the size of those 2 markets, I've grudgingly accepted the 24 team format.

 

Inclusion in the play-in rounds does lower the lottery odds for Montreal and Chicago with respect to this years draft, so it's not a completely free ride. 

Edited by LakeLivin

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On 5/27/2020 at 4:42 PM, LakeLivin said:

Right 😧 Hamilton, Pesce, Vatanen, TVR

Left 😧 Slavin, Skjei, Fleury, Gardiner, Edmundson

 

Talk about depth on D, lol.

 

 

And back to be a dominating D force from just months ago.  Awesome.

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49 minutes ago, gocanes0506 said:

July 31st start.

 

Pesce could be ready in August.  After the play-in round? Maybe after the 1st round.

 

I know Waddell said that Pesce will be close to being ready, but when it comes right down to it, I wonder if the fact that he has asthma, combined with our new found depth, might lead to him not coming back this summer.  

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The NHL  said that teams can have a 28 man roster with unlimited goalies .   Great for the canes  so  assuming  they can have  a few AHL  players  i would be comfortable with  Bean and  Keane  and Sellgren    and lastly   Geekie  join the club  for the time  being . 

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9 hours ago, LakeLivin said:

 

I know Waddell said that Pesce will be close to being ready, but when it comes right down to it, I wonder if the fact that he has asthma, combined with our new found depth, might lead to him not coming back this summer.  

I would definitely sit him until the end, if we go that far.  
 

im talking EC finals or later before I would consider getting him in. Even then, it would be in a game 1 scenario ir game two after we won the first one. 
 

I think Vatanen and Dougie’s performances will factor into it as well. If both are very strong then, sit Pesce. If one or both struggle to shake off the rust, maybe you look at bringing him back eventually.

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2 hours ago, Canesfanforever said:

The NHL  said that teams can have a 28 man roster with unlimited goalies .   Great for the canes  so  assuming  they can have  a few AHL  players  i would be comfortable with  Bean and  Keane  and Sellgren    and lastly   Geekie  join the club  for the time  being . 

We are going to have 8 defenders already and will probably add Bean and Keane.  I seriously doubt Sellgren makes the trip over.  
 

We have 12 forwards but will more than likely add Geekie and possibly Bishop to the bunch.  
 

Rod has said he doesn’t want a ton of players at practice. So, I would expect our max to be 24.  Maybe Forsberg gets added to the goalie group. Ned didn’t look very good.

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15 minutes ago, gocanes0506 said:

We have 12 forwards but will more than likely add Geekie and possibly Bishop to the bunch.

 

 

Those are the forwards i expect as well.  Bishop has pretty much always given what was asked of him on his callups and did get a little NHL playoff time last season.  And Geekie, how do you not bring him up after those last 2 games?

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15 hours ago, coastal_caniac said:

Also, I really hope the Dougie and Waddell camps have had discussions in all this down time.

This. Despite all of our D depth, Dougie is that Norris-level guy that most really good teams have and most of our history we have not had. He wins games. He and Slavin form a level at the top pair that is elite. If we can sign him for a good while, that would lock that position down at the "star" level that the most elite teams tend to have. 

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