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ynotagain

Big Joe's Time

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Damn i didn;t know you had to have a PHD in here!!!But i'm still going with my opinion..Right or wrong !!! :evil:

Now that sounds like an over-the-top Tripp Tracy comment. :shock: No PhD's required but specifics are encouraged when offering up opinions.

So we disagree but that's fine, even though you are wrong. :wink:

I agree storm, i hate those post where someone will say "so and so sucks". if you don't like a player then keep those opinions to yourself!! if you are going to post then be specific and above all be accurate!!

To his credit though he did answer the question. I can't tell you how many times I have asked for specifics and the poster never even makes the attempt.

Your point about accuracy is dead on too. Opinions are one thing but knowing what to base an opinion on is also important. When people say "Vasicek is terrible and I think he needs to sit and be replaced by Carter who will go to the fourth line and C. Adams will move up to 3rd line center..." I can't help but laugh.

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Hey Storm i wasn't only talking about you or this thread but just sometimes some people just take things like i am attacking them personally.I really enjoy a good debate!!

Ok, that's all good. I appreciate the clarification and your willingness to take the debate to the next level. Even though we disagree the fun is in the point/counterpoint.

I agree with you that some people think players are above criticism. I ripped Brindy for 2 specific examples of poor leadership and you would have thought I had punched the Pope. :wink:

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Well unfortunetly this IS a place that I can express MY opinions.I like to be able to hear others as well,,we can all agree to disagree and hash it out.Just because some people don't like to hear players get critisized thats just the way it goes.Everything isn't always sunny and bright.This is just a way people can discuss their views.It would be awful boring if we were all just saying how nice everything is and that its ok that the Canes are in a tough spot right now.We all have the same goal and the same team,just different opinions on how to get there.(playoffs) :mrgreen:

what a great post. :mrgreen: how can everything be right on a mediocre team that is struggling to get the 8th spot.

Yes I am a true fan for those who disagree with me.

Canes are like my kids, deserve criticism when struggling but support no matter what.

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what a great post. :mrgreen: how can everything be right on a mediocre team that is struggling to get the 8th spot.

Yes I am a true fan for those who disagree with me.

Canes are like my kids, deserve criticism when struggling but support no matter what.

I think only the deluded and chronically optimistic fans see no problems. :wink:

However, the distinction in my mind is that it isn't as simple as laying blame just on Tanabe, a 4/5 D-man or Vasicek, your third line center as the roots of all evil. It's a bit more complicated than that but we've had that conversation before so I think you know where I'm coming from.

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what a great post. :mrgreen: how can everything be right on a mediocre team that is struggling to get the 8th spot.

Yes I am a true fan for those who disagree with me.

Canes are like my kids, deserve criticism when struggling but support no matter what.

I think only the deluded and chronically optimistic fans see no problems. :wink:

However, the distinction in my mind is that it isn't as simple as laying blame just on Tanabe, a 4/5 D-man or Vasicek, your third line center as the roots of all evil. It's a bit more complicated than that but we've had that conversation before so I think you know where I'm coming from.

you forgot to add John Grahame to the list :wink:

I am just kidding for all those who think I am blaming Crackers. He has done fine. We as a team NEED to score more goals. BTW how long has it been since we scored 4 goals in a game? I say quite awile. Last year 4 goals in a game was no big deal.

For those that want to know the last time we scored 4 was on Feb 24 at Atlanta, 8 games ago. The offense is NOT getting it done.

They need to wake up or its golf on April 8th

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you forgot to add John Grahame to the list :wink:

I am just kidding for all those who think I am blaming Crackers. He has done fine. We as a team NEED to score more goals. BTW how long has it been since we scored 4 goals in a game? I say quite awile. Last year 4 goals in a game was no big deal.

For those that want to know the last time we scored 4 was on Feb 24 at Atlanta, 8 games ago. The offense is NOT getting it done.

They need to wake up or its golf on April 8th

The big difference for me is having good balance between D and offense. When your offense falters you need good D and vice versa. The fact that the Canes are, last time I checked anyway, the only team in the playoff picture at this moment who have more GAA than G's. That's terrible.

My other point is why some guys keep getting free passes when it comes to criticism. Gleason made a costly turnover on the first goal, and then Commodore gets totally out of position and Cole glides in as if defense is an option on the second goal. Grahame makes a boneheaded decision to handle the puck and Whitney can't control it for the game winner. All contributed to the loss not just the favorite whipping boys.

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Its great that everyone wants to give Carter a chance, but Carter will NOT replace Big Jo, Brindy or Staal. These guys are our ONLY centers and will not be out of the line up unless hurt. If Carter is to be inserted to the lineup then your benching one of the following: Williams, Whitney, Cole, Stillman, Walker or Ladd.

So question to the ones who want Carter in. Whose spot are you willing to give up, minus Brindy, Staal and Big Jo.

Like I said, great you want to give the guy a shot, but you have to look at the full picture. Its not that cut and dry.

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Hmmm, Carter runs into guys and they fall down? That's the logic along with his past goal scoring for playing him over Vasicek? So if you swap them out what are the line configurations and why is the physical angle, i.e. knocking guys down, such a big advantage?

"why is the physical angle, i.e. knocking guys down, such a big advantage?"

Do you know what sport this is? I'll tell you, we're not talking Carolina Rail Hawks...

I'll make it real easy for you -- If you are big, finess player and your finess game

isn't working and you're not going to use your size, you should be a healthy scratch.

Anyway, I'll let you get the last word in -- it seems you need it...

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"why is the physical angle, i.e. knocking guys down, such a big advantage?"

Do you know what sport this is? I'll tell you, we're not talking Carolina Rail Hawks...

I'll make it real easy for you -- If you are big, finess player and your finess game

isn't working and you're not going to use your size, you should be a healthy scratch.

Anyway, I'll let you get the last word in -- it seems you need it...

Our problem isn't playing a physical game. Did you watch the game last night??? Our problem is that we need to score more goals, if we score more goals every game..letting one or two in wouldn't be a big deal. You say Anson has had 20 goal seasons, but that doesn't mean he will capitalize on his chances here. It's not like we acquired him and immediately sent him to the press box. He had a few games to shine and he didn't outshine the guys who have been here longer. Not saying he is bad, but being a member of the team longer gets you an up and in order for him to trump that, he needed to exceed what the others are doing, not match it.

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Hmmm' date=' Carter runs into guys and they fall down? That's the logic along with his past goal scoring for playing him over Vasicek? So if you swap them out what are the line configurations and why is the physical angle, i.e. knocking guys down, such a big advantage? [/quote']

"why is the physical angle, i.e. knocking guys down, such a big advantage?"

Do you know what sport this is? I'll tell you, we're not talking Carolina Rail Hawks...

I'll make it real easy for you -- If you are big, finess player and your finess game

isn't working and you're not going to use your size, you should be a healthy scratch.

Anyway, I'll let you get the last word in -- it seems you need it...

Gee thanks for asking. Yes, I know not only what the sport is but I know Carter's game, Vasicek's game and their positive attributes with respect to the Canes current roster and the role you seem to equate only with physical presence. I think you need to understand roles within the context of the different lines.

On this team the third line center is asked to control the puck down low, cycle the puck, win face-offs and play a checking role. That is what Vasicek does and has done relatively well whether it's with a finesse style or not. What you fail to grasp is not all roles are created equal yet you went to make blanket statements about effectiveness essentially equaling "knocking guys down?"

Again thanks for asking but I think your questions in the future might be better directed towards legitimate topics rather than sarcastic ones that only highlight your own inability to understand roles and schemes. BTW, if you want to make a comparison in terms of physical play for a forward you might want to steer clear of a McSorley reference - he was a D man, you know. Or apparently you didn't. Is that good enough for the "last word?" :wink:

It seems like you were so quick to start with the misguided insults you forget my simple question from the prior post: " Please share why Carter would be an upgrade over Vasicek in the context of the third line's role. Thanks." Please illuminate everyone if you would be so kind and don't forget about roles. Thanks again.

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Its great that everyone wants to give Carter a chance, but Carter will NOT replace Big Jo, Brindy or Staal. These guys are our ONLY centers and will not be out of the line up unless hurt. If Carter is to be inserted to the lineup then your benching one of the following: Williams, Whitney, Cole, Stillman, Walker or Ladd.

So question to the ones who want Carter in. Whose spot are you willing to give up, minus Brindy, Staal and Big Jo.

Like I said, great you want to give the guy a shot, but you have to look at the full picture. Its not that cut and dry.

Of course you have nailed the central point in terms of the domino effect and how it impacts roles. Don't hold your breath waiting for an answer though. :wink:

Plus I really would love to find out who some of these folks think Anson Carter really is. They talk about him like he's a hitter such as Chris Neil. Hardly. The funny thing is that Carter and Vasicek now both average about the same number of hits/game and the Canes have 3 of the top 20, and 2 of the top 10, hit leaders in all the NHL.

Yeah, they need a third line, cycling center who can bang. That's the missing ingredient. :wink:

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Yep, that is why it was good for JR to get him back and give up on Belanger!! Of course had he known that Nashville would ship him off to Atlanta then that deal might not have gone down.

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What a strange way things go from "He sucks, why is he here? bad trade."

to "Big Joe is Awesome!!!! He Is My GOD!"

depending on the day.... this is crazy.

You talking about me? Cause I have liked joe from the start!

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