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All things Brandon Sutter

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I would use Ladd as an example before Staal. #4 overall pick thrown into the NHL after just one season in the AHL, just three years later his career would appear to be at a crossroads where we are unsure if he has a future with this team.

Just because WE think his career is at a crossroad does not neccessarily mean the team does. i look at the Stillman trade as a vote of confidence. JR and Lavi think he's ready to be a regular top six forward and permanently made room for him for the rest of the season. Unless willy is the second coming and makes it back this season.

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Staal, Cam, and Ladd are the best examples.

Staal for one year but then he developed after his AHL stint

Cam to a point but then he did win the Cup after being up here for one full season. Not that rushed for the end result.

Ladd, no comment, I do not think he is that great to begin with IMO. He is a decent player but not worthy of his high selection.

4th overall in the first round of 2004

(ready to get flamed LOL)

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Staal for one year but then he developed after his AHL stint

Cam to a point but then he did win the Cup after being up here for one full season. Not that rushed for the end result.

Ladd, no comment, I do not think he is that great to begin with IMO. He is a decent player but not worthy of his high selection.

4th overall in the first round of 2004

(ready to get flamed LOL)

Well, then Staal would be the best example of having Sutter spend some time in the AHL, wouldn't he?

Ladd's improved since he spent some time down there, short as it was.

And I dunno anyone who doesn't think Cam could use a conditioning stint. Of course, given our goaltender situation, it's an impossibility, but Cam was definitely rushed into the starting spot.

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Well, then Staal would be the best example of having Sutter spend some time in the AHL, wouldn't he?

Ladd's improved since he spent some time down there, short as it was.

And I dunno anyone who doesn't think Cam could use a conditioning stint. Of course, given our goaltender situation, it's an impossibility, but Cam was definitely rushed into the starting spot.

I dont think Cam could use a conditioning stint

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Well, then Staal would be the best example of having Sutter spend some time in the AHL, wouldn't he?

Ladd's improved since he spent some time down there, short as it was.

And I dunno anyone who doesn't think Cam could use a conditioning stint. Of course, given our goaltender situation, it's an impossibility, but Cam was definitely rushed into the starting spot.

You think Ladd playing 1 game in Albany made him better? Oh I don't know, but I think Ladd getting moved up into a Top 6 position logging more than 6 minutes a game has done more for him than that 1 game in Albany.

As for Cam, his problems aren't because he was rushed. He's 23 so yeah you are going to have growing pains with him, but his problems aren't due to him being rushed, its due to the team in front of him not doing their job.

Staal, I'll agree that the lock out year did him a world of a good. Although, we'll never fully know if Staal would be Staal if the lock out never occurred. ;)

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Well, then Staal would be the best example of having Sutter spend some time in the AHL, wouldn't he?

Ladd's improved since he spent some time down there, short as it was.

And I dunno anyone who doesn't think Cam could use a conditioning stint. Of course, given our goaltender situation, it's an impossibility, but Cam was definitely rushed into the starting spot.

Cam might have been rushed to be the full time starter but he wasn't rushed into the league. When he came up he was ready to be a backup. If anyone rushed Cam's development it was Johnny Grahame since he wasn't capable of a 1a and 1b situation.

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Yes he can, its 20 or played 4 junior seasons, which he will have done when this season ends.

Sutter can't play in the AHL next season. He isn't 20 (cut off date is 12-31-1988) and he hasn't played 4 seasons in the WHL. He played a few games as a 15 years old after his Midget team got eliminated but these games do not count for the 4 years rule (this is something that only happens in the WHL since this league drafts its players a year younger than the OHL or the Q. So these kids get drafted but then have to play a year Midget or Jr. A, they can play up to 5 games with the team drafted them and they can join the WHL team full time once their own teams season ended).

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Sutter can't play in the AHL next season. He isn't 20 (cut off date is 12-31-1988) and he hasn't played 4 seasons in the WHL. He played a few games as a 15 years old after his Midget team got eliminated but these games do not count for the 4 years rule (this is something that only happens in the WHL since this league drafts its players a year younger than the OHL or the Q. So these kids get drafted but then have to play a year Midget or Jr. A, they can play up to 5 games with the team drafted them and they can join the WHL team full time once their own teams season ended).

Thanks for the clarification. If I understand this right, Sutter can come play for us for 5 games but must then go play for his WHL team?

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Sutter can't play in the AHL next season. He isn't 20 (cut off date is 12-31-1988) and he hasn't played 4 seasons in the WHL. He played a few games as a 15 years old after his Midget team got eliminated but these games do not count for the 4 years rule (this is something that only happens in the WHL since this league drafts its players a year younger than the OHL or the Q. So these kids get drafted but then have to play a year Midget or Jr. A, they can play up to 5 games with the team drafted them and they can join the WHL team full time once their own teams season ended).

Thanks for the clarification. If I understand this right, Sutter can come play for us for 5 games but must then go play for his WHL team?

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Sutter can't play in the AHL next season. He isn't 20 (cut off date is 12-31-1988) and he hasn't played 4 seasons in the WHL. He played a few games as a 15 years old after his Midget team got eliminated but these games do not count for the 4 years rule (this is something that only happens in the WHL since this league drafts its players a year younger than the OHL or the Q. So these kids get drafted but then have to play a year Midget or Jr. A, they can play up to 5 games with the team drafted them and they can join the WHL team full time once their own teams season ended).

So the 7 games he played in 2004-2005 don't count? Either you know the rules better than Rutherford and he's wrong because the quote in the N&O talks about Sutter playing in Albany this year or he's right. No offense but I'm gonna bet the NHL GM is right on this.

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Thanks for the clarification. If I understand this right, Sutter can come play for us for 5 games but must then go play for his WHL team?

No, this 5 games rule is a WHL rule for 15 years old. :)

Players get drafted by WHL teams when they are 14 years old (hence WHL Bantam draft). The OHL and the Q drafts 15 years old. Players have to be 16 years old to play full time in the CHL (actually the cut-off date is always the 1st January, so if they are late born, players can start their CHL career as 15 years old).

When kids are drafted by WHL teams they can't join their WHL teams for another year but play instead for a Midget or Jr A team. But they can play up to 5 games with the WHL teams and they can join their WHL teams once their Midget or Jr A season ends. WHL teams try to bring in their top prospects for a few games (mostly during Christmas break, when they miss some players with the WJC or the U17 WC) to get a look on their development and it also means that they are committed to the CHL (players loose their NCAA eligibility when the play a single CHL game).

Sutter can play in the AHL this season after his WHL season ends (just like for example Jeff Carter did, he played 12 games with the Phantoms in 2003/04 after his OHL season ended but he couldn't play for them next season during the lock out and had to go back to play in the OHL) but he can't play for Albany next year. It's either NHL or WHL for him next season.

And I'm pretty sure that JR knows this. :P

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No, this 5 games rule is a WHL rule for 15 years old. :)

Players get drafted by WHL teams when they are 14 years old (hence WHL Bantam draft). The OHL and the Q drafts 15 years old. Players have to be 16 years old to play full time in the CHL (actually the cut-off date is always the 1st January, so if they are late born, players can start their CHL career as 15 years old).

When kids are drafted by WHL teams they can't join their WHL teams for another year but play instead for a Midget or Jr A team. But they can play up to 5 games with the WHL teams and they can join their WHL teams once their Midget or Jr A season ends. WHL teams try to bring in their top prospects for a few games (mostly during Christmas break, when they miss some players with the WJC or the U17 WC) to get a look on their development and it also means that they are committed to the CHL (players loose their NCAA eligibility when the play a single CHL game).

Sutter can play in the AHL this season after his WHL season ends (just like for example Jeff Carter did, he played 12 games with the Phantoms in 2003/04 after his OHL season ended but he couldn't play for them next season during the lock out and had to go back to play in the OHL) but he can't play for Albany next year. It's either NHL or WHL for him next season.

And I'm pretty sure that JR knows this. :P

That makes a little more sense. So hes coming to play the rest of the season for the RiverRats when his current team is done, and this summer they'll have to decide what to do with him? NHL or back up to the OHL? And what about next season if he returns to Canada for next season, will he then be eligible for the AHL?

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No, this 5 games rule is a WHL rule for 15 years old. :)

Players get drafted by WHL teams when they are 14 years old (hence WHL Bantam draft). The OHL and the Q drafts 15 years old. Players have to be 16 years old to play full time in the CHL (actually the cut-off date is always the 1st January, so if they are late born, players can start their CHL career as 15 years old).

When kids are drafted by WHL teams they can't join their WHL teams for another year but play instead for a Midget or Jr A team. But they can play up to 5 games with the WHL teams and they can join their WHL teams once their Midget or Jr A season ends. WHL teams try to bring in their top prospects for a few games (mostly during Christmas break, when they miss some players with the WJC or the U17 WC) to get a look on their development and it also means that they are committed to the CHL (players loose their NCAA eligibility when the play a single CHL game).

Sutter can play in the AHL this season after his WHL season ends (just like for example Jeff Carter did, he played 12 games with the Phantoms in 2003/04 after his OHL season ended but he couldn't play for them next season during the lock out and had to go back to play in the OHL) but he can't play for Albany next year. It's either NHL or WHL for him next season.

And I'm pretty sure that JR knows this. :P

That makes a little more sense. So hes coming to play the rest of the season for the RiverRats when his current team is done, and this summer they'll have to decide what to do with him? NHL or back up to the OHL? And what about next season if he returns to Canada for next season, will he then be eligible for the AHL?

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Sutter can play in the AHL this season after his WHL season ends (just like for example Jeff Carter did, he played 12 games with the Phantoms in 2003/04 after his OHL season ended but he couldn't play for them next season during the lock out and had to go back to play in the OHL) but he can't play for Albany next year. It's either NHL or WHL for him next season.

And I'm pretty sure that JR knows this. :P

beat me to it, I was gonna use the Jeff Carter example....LOL

Mo is dead on. Sutter can be 'loaned' to Albany for the rest of this year, but next year its NHL or back to Red Deer.

Yes, I'm bored, and glanced through some of the CBA, this part confirms that a player under 20 can be loaned to the minor league team:

"The age 18 and age 19 Player, respectively, may be Loaned to the minor league team affiliate of his Club when his junior team is no longer in competition and provided he has been listed on the Club's minor league eligibility list.

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No, this 5 games rule is a WHL rule for 15 years old. :)

Players get drafted by WHL teams when they are 14 years old (hence WHL Bantam draft). The OHL and the Q drafts 15 years old. Players have to be 16 years old to play full time in the CHL (actually the cut-off date is always the 1st January, so if they are late born, players can start their CHL career as 15 years old).

When kids are drafted by WHL teams they can't join their WHL teams for another year but play instead for a Midget or Jr A team. But they can play up to 5 games with the WHL teams and they can join their WHL teams once their Midget or Jr A season ends. WHL teams try to bring in their top prospects for a few games (mostly during Christmas break, when they miss some players with the WJC or the U17 WC) to get a look on their development and it also means that they are committed to the CHL (players loose their NCAA eligibility when the play a single CHL game).

Sutter can play in the AHL this season after his WHL season ends (just like for example Jeff Carter did, he played 12 games with the Phantoms in 2003/04 after his OHL season ended but he couldn't play for them next season during the lock out and had to go back to play in the OHL) but he can't play for Albany next year. It's either NHL or WHL for him next season.

And I'm pretty sure that JR knows this. :P

Thanks for the clarification. I don't agree with the rule but it does change what to do with Sutter and definitely makes it a harder call as to if he should play in the NHL next year. My best guess is this means he gets the shot next fall at the NHL like J. Staal did in Pittsburgh a year ago and if he proves he can hang with the NHL in that cameo he gets to stay.

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I'm not sure what to expect out of Sutter...from what I read he was considered a "safe" pick...which means he'll get some things done but don't expect him to be the next Ovechkin. I fear that he really won't be anything special...but we'll see. He needs to seriously bulk up though before coming to the NHL.

Patrick Kane 5"11 165 pounds?

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Being 165 at 5'11" is a lot different than being 174 at 6'3"

Indeed but who knows how much Sutter weighs now? It was made very clear when he was drafted that he needed to bulk up and I'm sure they have him on a program. I saw him play in the World Juniors and he still looks gangly but he wasn't muscled around and his mental toughness is evident. Granted it was not NHL competition but if Francis thinks he can make the transition, I'll take his opinion over mine and anyone else's here.

His Red Deer profile lists him at 174 lbs. which is where the N&O got his stats but team listings are notoriously inaccurate. Check out Cam Ward's on the Canes' official site, it still has him at 200 lbs. even though it's been well chronicled he dropped 20 or so pounds down to 180.

Regardless though, it will come down to his skills and mental approach to the game more so than whatever he tips the scales at these days. He knows how to play the game and is already much more physical than Staal was at the same age.

Plus you have to remember that the new CBA has reduced UFA age qualifications by 4 years. Add in the salary cap and teams, not just the Canes, need to get guys on the fast track to the NHL.

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I really hope we get to see him play in Albany at some point even if it is just for a little while I would love to see him in a Rats uniform.

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They don't play the same style. Sutter will need to bulk up to be effective.

Agreed, Sutter is a hard checking true 2 way center. He will need to bulk up, but look at Jordan Staal, he suprised everyone when the Pens kept him up.

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