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What to do about the LOSING Streak

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For those of you who think it makes sense to "tank" the rest of the season, can you help me understand how you justify that to your investment in this team? I'm sure you are all full season ticket holders who have invested your hard earned money for season tickets THIS year and I just don't know how you say that and be OK with watching the team just lose the rest of the season. I would love to be able to feel that way too but then I look a the amount of money I have spent this year and I have a hard time justifying that statement. Not to mention, how are you OK with the financial impact that would have on this team when people stop coming to games or season ticket holders downgrade or give them up all together because there are better things to do with those entertainment dollars.

We may be headed there anyway - but it's a different ballgame when people are saying they WANT it to happen. I just get it. I an sick over what is happening right now but I could never say I want it continue. It just doesn't make sense for the future of this team.

Im hoping that no one really wants to see this happen but frustration and disappointment are just getting the better of people.

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So far, I think Ward is the teams weakest link.

I would say our weakest link so far is scoring, we lack a true top line winger to play with Staal and that is part of it. Our team is 16-1-2 when scoring at least 3 goals in a game. If JR could work a trade for a winger that plays like a 1st line winger I think it will greatly improve the team.

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I know I'll get flamed, but has ANYONE thought to FIRE FRANCIS? after all, the ONE SINGLE YEAR that he had NO AFFILLIATION WHATSOEVER with this team WE WON THE CUP... uhhh helloooo... can you say "hockey gods"???

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My plan.

Hope to god that Karmanos sells this team to Jim Goodnight.

Fire Jim Rutherford

Ron Francis GM

Jeff Daniels Asst. GM

John Tortorella Head Coach

Tom Rowe Asst. Coach

Tom Barasso Asst. Coach

Brind`amour and Wallin retire.

Eaves, Walker and Kaberle traded.

As for the forwards:

Keep Samsonov, Ruutu, Staal, Cullen, Williams, Whitney, and Sutter.

Trade (Eaves, Larose, prospects, pick) for Andy McDonald`s rights and re-sign him.

Sign Erik Cole (He wants to come back...discount) or Call up Zac Boychuk

Sign "Big Name wing" in the $4-5.5 M range (Tanguay, Havlat, Gaborik)

Sign Stephanne Yelle

Call up Tim Conboy

Samsonov(2.5)-Staal(8.25)"A"-Ruutu(3.5)"A"

"Big Name"(4.5)-McDonald(3)-Williams(3.5)

Whitney(3.55)-Cullen(2.8)-Boychuk(1.225)/Cole(2.2)

Yelle(.8)-Sutter(1.225)"A"-Helminen(.5)

Total 35.35-36.325

Defense

Keep Corvo, Gleason, Pitkanen, Babchuk, Seidenberg. Call up Brett Carson.

Pitkanen(4)-Gleason(2.75)"C"

Corvo(2.65)-Seidenberg(2.5)

Babchuk(2)-Carson(.55)

Total 14.425

Goalies

Trade/Release Leighton

Sign Capable Backup (Raycroft, Sanford, Dubielewicz, Johnson, Garon)

Ward(2.667)

Backup(1)

Total 3.667

This team is close. This one year revamp is possible, if not probable. Our defense will be amazing next year. The forward group is fairly young. McDonald is a perfect second line center, with Cullen not far behind there will be competition. All 6 Wingers would provide for competition and constant scoring stability. Yelle and Sutter would be a good grinding fourth line and penalty killing combo, and Helminen provides speed and ability to step into the top 9.

If any prospect comes to camp able to take the spot of anyone i listed, then they should be on the team (Bowman, McBain, Terry, Murphy).

The Cap hit would be near 54-55 Million. It is going to take some spending to win. If Whitney could be moved for a cheaper, younger wing, we would be close to the spending goal below the cap.

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For those of you who think it makes sense to "tank" the rest of the season, can you help me understand how you justify that to your investment in this team? I'm sure you are all full season ticket holders who have invested your hard earned money for season tickets THIS year and I just don't know how you say that and be OK with watching the team just lose the rest of the season.

It saves me money if we miss the playoffs. I don't need to shell out more $ for seeing this team lose in the first round. The last thing we need is to be the 8th seed with this team. Bad draft pick, no chance in the playoffs.

Tanking is against my better nature, but at this point I can see why others advocate it.

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The canes need to get a forward who can score period. If they do not trade for one we might as well say goodbye to the season i dont see brindy stepping it up anytime soon. Williams still isnt all the way back you can just kind of tell. I think they should trade either for a Center or RightWing. Our offense is terrible of late. Also the defense is starting to play better i saw signs of the defense coming back to what it was when we were on the 4 game winning streak. One major thing the canes also need to do is get a tough guy. Brookbank will not cut it we need someone who can step up for this team and throw some punches. If the canes dont make a move soon or step their game up all togethor this season is over. We will see Monday and Tuesday night how we can play against Tornoto and Pittsburgh.

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I know I'll get flamed, but has ANYONE thought to FIRE FRANCIS? after all, the ONE SINGLE YEAR that he had NO AFFILLIATION WHATSOEVER with this team WE WON THE CUP... uhhh helloooo... can you say "hockey gods"???

Even though this was probably a joke there have been other years with no association with Mr Francis when the Canes/Whalers didn't win a cup. Like the 91-92 season through the 97-98 season, a span in which this team was mostly terrible and before 1981 when they weren't so hot either. And before 1972 they didn't even qualify to play a game, those teams must have been terrible.

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My plan.

Hope to god that Karmanos sells this team to Jim Goodnight.

Fire Jim Rutherford

Ron Francis GM

Jeff Daniels Asst. GM

John Tortorella Head Coach

Tom Rowe Asst. Coach

Tom Barasso Asst. Coach

Brind`amour and Wallin retire.

Eaves, Walker and Kaberle traded.

As for the forwards:

Keep Samsonov, Ruutu, Staal, Cullen, Williams, Whitney, and Sutter.

Trade (Eaves, Larose, prospects, pick) for Andy McDonald`s rights and re-sign him.

Sign Erik Cole (He wants to come back...discount) or Call up Zac Boychuk

Sign "Big Name wing" in the $4-5.5 M range (Tanguay, Havlat, Gaborik)

Sign Stephanne Yelle

Call up Tim Conboy

Samsonov(2.5)-Staal(8.25)"A"-Ruutu(3.5)"A"

"Big Name"(4.5)-McDonald(3)-Williams(3.5)

Whitney(3.55)-Cullen(2.8)-Boychuk(1.225)/Cole(2.2)

Yelle(.8)-Sutter(1.225)"A"-Helminen(.5)

Total 35.35-36.325

Defense

Keep Corvo, Gleason, Pitkanen, Babchuk, Seidenberg. Call up Brett Carson.

Pitkanen(4)-Gleason(2.75)"C"

Corvo(2.65)-Seidenberg(2.5)

Babchuk(2)-Carson(.55)

Total 14.425

Goalies

Trade/Release Leighton

Sign Capable Backup (Raycroft, Sanford, Dubielewicz, Johnson, Garon)

Ward(2.667)

Backup(1)

Total 3.667

This team is close. This one year revamp is possible, if not probable. Our defense will be amazing next year. The forward group is fairly young. McDonald is a perfect second line center, with Cullen not far behind there will be competition. All 6 Wingers would provide for competition and constant scoring stability. Yelle and Sutter would be a good grinding fourth line and penalty killing combo, and Helminen provides speed and ability to step into the top 9.

If any prospect comes to camp able to take the spot of anyone i listed, then they should be on the team (Bowman, McBain, Terry, Murphy).

The Cap hit would be near 54-55 Million. It is going to take some spending to win. If Whitney could be moved for a cheaper, younger wing, we would be close to the spending goal below the cap.

Can u please be the GM for carolina u are 10000% right if the canes want to win they have spend money the occasional hockey fan will come to the game if they have a good team so they can make all that money right back. I agree with every single thing u said.

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The problem is that the problem is nearly unfixable. Cam's play over this losing streak has been poor admittedly, and why we haven't seen Leighton yet is beyond me, BUT this is just a symptom of the larger disease. This team, full of previous 20-30 goal scorers can't hit the back of the net. We just don't generate as many good chances and when we get them the puck sails past the net and slams off the boards. Further, we have terrible special teams.

We tried firing the coach. We tried shaking up the lines (millions of times).

There is one glaring problem that will either get fixed, or the continuing losing streak will fix for us. Brind'Amour needs to rest, possibley for good. The team either comes to grips with that and does something more than has been done, or the entire team will slink further and further down the drain.

The optimal thing would be to find a legit playmaking center, but absent that: just bring up Heimelman. Anything would be better at this point.

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My plan.

...

Sign "Big Name wing" in the $4-5.5 M range (Tanguay, Havlat, Gaborik)

...

You realize "big name" wings cost more than that right?

Gaborik was 7.5 million this year and was looking for a raise before his injury. Tanguay make $5.3 and will want a raise. Havlat makes 6 Million a year and spends lots of it injured (though he would fit right in).

There are other problems with your plan but this is pretty glaring.

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Even though this was probably a joke there have been other years with no association with Mr Francis when the Canes/Whalers didn't win a cup. Like the 91-92 season through the 97-98 season, a span in which this team was mostly terrible and before 1981 when they weren't so hot either. And before 1972 they didn't even qualify to play a game, those teams must have been terrible.

part joke, part serious, and yes, I know there were early years that Francis had no affilliation with the club that they didn't win the cup. Some may not remember, but this team went on a tear after he was traded to Toronto, and might benefit from hearing what the players said after he left - those feelings / sentiments might just account for why this team has stunk up the ice ever since he came back...

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You realize "big name" wings cost more than that right?

Gaborik was 7.5 million this year and was looking for a raise before his injury. Tanguay make $5.3 and will want a raise. Havlat makes 6 Million a year and spends lots of it injured (though he would fit right in).

There are other problems with your plan but this is pretty glaring.

Its actually not that glaring of a problem. Tanguay is out for two months with a knee injury. Gaborik has a MAJOR injury. His trade value is nothing right now. Given the current economy, all salaries will have to go down. Havlat will be in the 5 million range. Declining player value, injury, declining economy = Lower salaries. 5 Million will get you a star this offseason.

Now, a second hand star. Notice i didnt put Zetterberg, Franzen or Hossa up there. Those guys will get 7-9 million a year. Gaborik, Tanguay, Havlat however, will not. Somebody has lost their mind if any of those three recieve over 5.5 million.

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Its actually not that glaring of a problem. Tanguay is out for two months with a knee injury. Gaborik has a MAJOR injury. His trade value is nothing right now. Given the current economy, all salaries will have to go down. Havlat will be in the 5 million range. Declining player value, injury, declining economy = Lower salaries. 5 Million will get you a star this offseason.

Now, a second hand star. Notice i didnt put Zetterberg, Franzen or Hossa up there. Those guys will get 7-9 million a year. Gaborik, Tanguay, Havlat however, will not. Somebody has lost their mind if any of those three recieve over 5.5 million.

Given the economy all salaries will not necessarily go down. Average salaries will fall with the cap but 1st line players will still receive big bucks, the guys who's salaries are going to fall are 3rd liners and 3rd pairing defensemen making 3 million dollars a year not the stars. The incentive to win will keep the owners from keeping their check books closed for the stars that could push them over the top.

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the most obvious way to end a losing streak is to start winning, so i guess the better question to ask is, how do we start winning again? score more, give up fewer. soft goals are not acceptable, not at this level. give up a softie, sit on the bench (Mike Keenan style). but i know the puck has to go through 5 other guys first. deffense, HIT SOMEONE when they have the puck. forwards, HIT SOMEONE when they have the puck. it looks like pond hockey sometimes, fancy moves with a bunch of guys wearing no pads. i understand that we can't win 82 games, but right now we are getting blown off the ice.

the last time we had a 5 game losing streak? 02-03. the coach? Paul Maurice!!!! HHHHMMMMMMM??????

last time i checked the "new NHL" didn't take emotion out of the rule book. show some!!

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I wouldn't mind seeing Cole back.....it hasn't been the same since we traded him, and he's not fitting in real well in Edmunton.

As for Wardo, he's still young, he is a Stanley Cup Champion at an age where many goalies are still in the AHL. He is still very young for a NHL goalie. Patience. If you have no offense, and you are wearing your defensemen out, their defense becomes dull, and the opposition gets more chances and break-a-ways. Blame it on goalies all you want, but the fact is that break a way goals are the fault of the entire team, not the goalie. Cam stops some of them, he stopped a couple breakaways last night.

All that being said, I do think Leights should have got the call on the last 2 games to rest Cam. We need a dependable backup goalie. I still think that Avery should be on the brain here, as he should go cheaply after his incident.

It is interesting to see that many of you agree that Gleason gets the C if Brindy retires or gives it up. I AGREE. Staal has glimmers of leadership, but its inconsistent, much like our team.

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How about this? Get RID of BRIND'AMOUR!?!?! No lets give him more minutes that will help us win! Or lets move him down to the 3rd line and cut everyone's minutes! Oh lets not do anything and keep losing. Lets keep Ward out on the ice when he needs a game off. Lets pay a back up goalie but never use him? Lets fire a coach and talk bad about him then bring in an old friend!

Hurricane Management = IDIOTS!

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Well the frustration level has reached a high not seen in about 6 years (the last time the team lost this many in a row) for the players, coaches and fans.

There are a couple observations in looking at the team and player stats which indicate to me that like today's economy, the issues run deeper than they appear. Here is a summary of observations to show the "depth" of the issues the team faces:

Ugly Stat #1: The captain of the Hurricanes is at -26 and the trend is still down

Ugly Stat #2: In addition to the captain, there are three other players who are at -10 or worse, including former leaders of the team such as Whitney and Williams (the other player is Dennis)

Ugly Stat #3: The team is the ONLY team in the league with no short-handed goals

Ugly Stat #4: Even though the team has the highest opportunities for Power Plays at 211, they only convert 15.6% of them

Ugly Stat #5: The team has given up 24 more goals than the scored (only 4 other teams in NHL are worse)

Ugly Stat #6: Only 4 players have 10 or more goals scored and the most is Staal at 19

Ugly Stat #7: About 25% of all Canes power play goals have been scored by one player (Staal with 8 of 33)

and last but not least,

Ugly Stat #8: The team has lost 5 games in a row

The first seven stats above highlight the deep and breath of the issues the Canes face for the rest of the season. Like today's economy, the fix is not simple and will likely take time (so plan on saving some money this year in not having to shell out big bucks for playoff tickets). The issues that need to be resolved in order of importance (IMHO):

1) The team needs a wholesale attitude adjustment to move from complacent, lazy and at times arrogant to hungry, motivated to win / fight, and more humble....this is on the coaching staff to resolve with more "tough love" (already started in Friday's practice)

2) The team needs to make a decision on leadership for the future (no matter how hard it is to do)....we are in leadership "purgatory" in trying to let Rod "get back in his groove" while having Staal be the "de facto" leader in terms of ice times and play time in critical moments....we can not reserve Rod only for critical faceoffs as a way to placate this situation

3) The team needs to play with an intensity that increase their time in the penalty box...yes, I did say MORE time in the box and not less...as I see this differently than most not as a positive, but as a symptom of bigger issue in attitude as referenced above

4) The team needs to show they can score short-handed as currently teams have no respect for our kill which I believe is leading to a poorer showing on PK

The above are some MAJOR issues, so the fans will need to be patient to work through them. In the mean time, we will likely remain just outside the playoff window peering inside for the remainder of the season. Comments on the above are welcome.

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1 question I have is why in the world havent the canes brought up TIM CONBOY. He is a tough guy who has pretty good skill and is a pretty good stay at home defenseman. I would have no problem if Wallin was a healthy scratch. Conboy is 10 times better than Nic.

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:blink: What are we to do trade players fire more coaches sell the the team who knows what will happen not selling the team ofcourse haha. Just wanted to hear everyones 2 cents worth

This team needs to be rebuilt from the ground up.....the ONLY change we DON'T have to make is build a new arena.

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If we are not going to make the playoffs we would be better to drop down much lower to get a better draft pick. It is painful for me to say this because I absolutely hate it when we lose. If the players feel the way a majority of the fans feel about Roddys play then this could be creating a problem in the room. Gleason would be my pick for the C when a change is made.

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1 question I have is why in the world havent the canes brought up TIM CONBOY. He is a tough guy who has pretty good skill and is a pretty good stay at home defenseman. I would have no problem if Wallin was a healthy scratch. Conboy is 10 times better than Nic.

Great question. He shakes things up, especially opponents!

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Make Roddy a year-ending "healthy scratch." Give the "C" to Gleason. Take the "A" away from Staal and give it to Ruutu and then make him a "healthy scratch" for a couple of games.

I am almost at the point where if I could get the STH price and parking pass for the remainder of this season's games, I would sell them; but if the Canes continue this slide, selling them for my cost will be impossible.

If the Canes played every shift of every game as they did during that 11 minute streched of the Leaf game I would gladly support them in a long losing streak. But it seems that no one in the Canes organization from the GM down to the towel boy gives a damn as long as they get a pay check.

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Simple, all we need to do is have some guys get injured. Even if its fake, we need some key guys to just flop and be out for a couple weeks. Call up Albany, do what we did last year, and thats how we win! Last year with all those injuries, we pulled it together (- the last game). See, the problem is the team isnt used to having so many players healthy. Staal isnt used to having scoring options (that ARENT scoring), so as a result, Staal cant score. The defence isnt used to having so many familiar faces for each game! They are used to seeing different River Rats in and outta the line up. So, call em all up! We need some more Borer, Carson, Conboy, Rodney stuff to work with. Where is Keith Aucoin?! If he was here, we would be winning!

The simple answer, not enough injuries.

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