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micheelob

Ward is average at best!

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I just couldn't resist bringing this one back from the dead.

It makes some interesting reading from everyone that was down on Cam.

I'll take "Average Cam" any day.

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Last night on 99.9 after the game, Mike Maniscalco mentioned that he compared Cam's stats to Roy's and Brodeur's at this point in their careers and noted he was better. I was curious and checked for myself so here it is. Means nothing for future predictions but it helps drive the point that it takes time to develop. Perhaps expectations are set a little high for Cam? First three seasons as #1:

Roy --------- Games played: 47, 46, 45 SV %: .875, .892, .900 GAA: 3.35, 2.93, 2.90

Brodeur---- Games played: 47, 40, 77 Sv% .915, .902, .911 GAA: 2.40, 2.45, 2.34

Ward ------- Games played: 60, 69, 61 Sv%: .897, .904, .913 GAA: 2.93, 2.75, 2.51

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To close out NHL on the Fly last night -- they were talking about Cam as a long shot Vezina Trophy candidate, when the one announcer (don't know his name) says I don't know about that but if he keeps playing like he is , he might be a Conn Smythe Trophy candidate :)

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To close out NHL on the Fly last night -- they were talking about Cam as a long shot Vezina Trophy candidate, when the one announcer (don't know his name) says I don't know about that but if he keeps playing like he is , he might be a Conn Smythe Trophy candidate :)

No doubt we would Love to see that happen!!!Thats is what our expectations are for Cam and the team..

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Last night on 99.9 after the game, Mike Maniscalco mentioned that he compared Cam's stats to Roy's and Brodeur's at this point in their careers and noted he was better. I was curious and checked for myself so here it is. Means nothing for future predictions but it helps drive the point that it takes time to develop. Perhaps expectations are set a little high for Cam? First three seasons as #1:

Roy --------- Games played: 47, 46, 45 SV %: .875, .892, .900 GAA: 3.35, 2.93, 2.90

Brodeur---- Games played: 47, 40, 77 Sv% .915, .902, .911 GAA: 2.40, 2.45, 2.34

Ward ------- Games played: 60, 69, 61 Sv%: .897, .904, .913 GAA: 2.93, 2.75, 2.51

Actually all that does is show a very clean cut comparison of how goal scorings changed. Not sure how smart Mike is I never listen to the guy but that was a bad comparison.

Roy 80's high scoring

Brody 90's low scoring

Ward New Millenium and medium scoring.

You can't compare each goalie given they each broke in during a different decade. Goal scoring was high up the wazzo in the 80's. Bad Roy numbers prolly werent that bad back then.

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Actually all that does is show a very clean cut comparison of how goal scorings changed. Not sure how smart Mike is I never listen to the guy but that was a bad comparison.

Roy 80's high scoring

Brody 90's low scoring

Ward New Millenium and medium scoring.

You can't compare each goalie given they each broke in during a different decade. Goal scoring was high up the wazzo in the 80's. Bad Roy numbers prolly werent that bad back then.

What he said. (Beat me to it)

Go see Grant Fuhr's numbers, and he won multiple cups.

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To close out NHL on the Fly last night -- they were talking about Cam as a long shot Vezina Trophy candidate, when the one announcer (don't know his name) says I don't know about that but if he keeps playing like he is , he might be a Conn Smythe Trophy candidate :)

Been there, done that

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I really don't know why some fans are still having trouble giving Ward the credit he deserves. Star of the week 2 out of 4 weeks, player of the month for March. What else is he supposed to do to get past the "average" tag? :unsure:

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geez, this topic got bumped again.. it's been dead 2-3 times.

Yeah, I bumped it. I just think it's kind of interesting just where all of the "get rid of Cam" people went.

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All i'm saying is bumping this topic and putting it in peoples faces that they were wrong, really doesnt help build the community. Kinda draws that line a lil darker between people.

Gotta think, this is our first goalie we've developed here in Carolina. A ton of fans dont have the experience of watching a goalie develop, I got mine watching Richter develop when I lived in NJ, same for Brody. Though they both kinda walked in and took the place over.

I mean we just had a new fan post a topic about why do we pull the goalie. Then it gets bumped everytime we score a empty net goal and not in a...this is why we do it manner...but in a your a idiot manner.

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All i'm saying is bumping this topic and putting it in peoples faces that they were wrong, really doesnt help build the community. Kinda draws that line a lil darker between people.

Gotta think, this is our first goalie we've developed here in Carolina. A ton of fans dont have the experience of watching a goalie develop, I got mine watching Richter develop when I lived in NJ, same for Brody. Though they both kinda walked in and took the place over.

I mean we just had a new fan post a topic about why do we pull the goalie. Then it gets bumped everytime we score a empty net goal and not in a...this is why we do it manner...but in a your a idiot manner.

I'm certainly not trying to draw a line or put anyone down, but I am trying to make some see that you do have to have patience when developing a young goalie. I hoped by bumping this it would make somebody see why a team would take some time with a young goalie. Some of the posts earlier in the season had us benching Ward in lieu of Leighton. I guess in my attempt to add a little humor while showing some why we do things can be misundestood at times.

I also think in the post about why anybody pulled the goalie, someone stated that it was the stupidest thing to do. Yes, I bumped that one a week or so later when we pulled the goalie and scored, and I said "Here's your sign". I'm not trying to step on toes and I don't try to get personal, but I do try to add a little levity at times.

As far as insinuating that someone is an idiot, nobody needs to do that for me. I know already.

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It's actually quite funny to read some of the bashings posted here from time to time. So many folks like to spout statistics about this player and that as if the game was played on a spreadsheet instead of the ice. Everyone has on and off days and sometimes that turns into weeks or longer, but the really insightful observers are able to see past the immediate and get a better picture of what kind of basic skills players possess. True, Cam's had some off days and let through what could be called soft goals from time to time, but who hasn't? Even those foopahs have been sandwiched between remarkable if not spectacular saves in practically every game he's played. It's pretty obvious in hindsight, that Cam's one of those guys that actually works better when he's playing all the time (just look at his results in his recent string of consecutive starts). As he gets more work, his ability to be in his "zone" becomes more and more consistent. Congrats to Barasso for recognizing that in time to get us where we are today...in playoff contention.

Cam is a remarkable goalie and continues to improve. to say he is average seems to me, well.... to be a bit short sighted and over critical. The same agrument can be made for the Brind'Amore bashers. Geez...have a major injury and if you don't jump up and be superman out of the gate, you're an over the hill ,washed up has been. The things Brind'Amore brings to the ice are so much more than any ridiculous +/- rating yet we've all seen the conclusions drawn by many who don't seem to be able to connect the dots that include not only extenuating circumstances, but the overall play of the entire team as they learn the system that best organizes the particualr chemistry of this team. Now that Rod is seemingly healty and has gained confidence, he's regained his status as a driving cog in our playoff mentality which we'll desperately need in order to sustain the incredible run of the last month. In hockey, as in most sports, it's more important how you finsih than how you start, provided you don't dig yourself too deep a hole or start your roll to late. It looks like we've been able to put everything together in time to be a truly inspired force going into the playoff season.

The whole team seems to have bought into the system now and it shows. The sum is greater than the parts and all the players are able to step it up and show their skills better. No better example can be shown than Chad La Rose, but many of the guys are really starting to benefit from the chemistry that the system is beginning to generate. The confidence is showing in the team and the fans are starting to buy into it as well. I think the playoffs will be awesome for us!

Go Canes!

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Less than 50 days ago this team was booed out of the RBC (Boston, Feb 17). On Apr 2 the crowd's appreciation could not have been more evident. They were only silenced by the announcer's voice of "Carolina goal scored by....." late in the 3rd period. If not for that "intrusion" the crowd would have remained standing and cheered until the final horn.

I don't think bumping this thread calls anyone out, since there were many people booing who are now cheering. Heck, I certainly wasn't happy with the TEAM's play in mid-February (nor were the players).

Feedback is good - it works! In February Whitney said "You can't get booed out of your own building" (meaning we must play better). Last night Mo said the team reacted to the (upbeat/loud) crowd.

btw, and on topic, Ward is ABOVE average. Said it then and saying it AGAIN.

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Ward is still a young, developing goalie. He is going to have his ups and downs. If the team skating in front of him could score 3 or 4 goals, his occasional let down wouldn't be so obvious.

This was my original post in this thread back in January. Yes Cam has buckled down, but how much of the recent success is due to the team being able to put some goals on the scoreboard. Goalies get too much credit for wins and too much blame for losses.

I agree ManWolf, Cam wasn't average then, and he isn't average now.

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1st Star of the Month in March, 10 straight wins at home, 7 in a row as of the Rags game last night.....yep, he's just your ol' "average at best" goaltender. Done with this thread.

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Done with THIS thread, sure. But it'll come up again next year soon as we lose 3 in a row, just like last year and the year before. Good, nobody remembers - bad, nobody forgets. Somebody will always bash whoever we put in the net.

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Interesting fact, in 2002 when Cam was drafted 25th overall in the first round only one goalie was drafted before him (Kari Lehtonen, 2nd overall Atlanta).

Another interesting note, Joni Pitkanen was taken 4th overall by the Flyers and Anton Babchuk was taken 21st overall by the Blackhawks, so we essentially have 3 first round draft picks from 2002 playing for us.

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Ward is a good goalie, a good back up that is...bring in a #1 goalie...and let Wardo wait till the playoffs to play.. or just get rid of him all together..that works for me.. he Might be a good back up goalie for the rats

well, they are not getting rid of him and he's playing in the playoffs :P :P ;)

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The simple fact is, players will be players, have ups and downs. Fans will be fans, cry and whine about everything, then jump the boat and sail with good fortune. No matter who we have as a goalie, we are gonna bash them at some point, or praise them to death. Think about NJ right now. They have a good team, they arent playing well, im sure there fans are BASHING them to DEATH! However, when they were on a roll during the season, boom. Great. I bet they praised Clemmenson for his solid play, if he came back and lost 5 straight, BANG. He'd be dead. Same kinda thing.

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Yep here we go again. I wish he was playing UP to "Average At Best". He wasn't playing well before the injury and now he is "supposedly" back to 100% and if thats the facts,, he is not the Goalie he used to be or the goalie we thought he would become. This is , what three years in a row now that he has not gotten much better? Yep I know I'm  Cam Bashing again but  it is well deserved,,, IMO

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